2018 for First Lite...30 new pieces.

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Jan 18, 2018
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MS
Can someone speak to the ability to layer under the Catalyst. Ryan talked about wearing his Catalyst jacket down to zero wind chill in the video which I assume meant he was wearing something over it, not under it. I’m looking at this as a Deep South mid season treestand shell for windy days with my merino layers underneath.
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2018
Messages
28
Pit zips or not. Great question. We go round and round on this. Pretty much all the high end hunting brands use YKK zippers. Their quality, consistency, and selection is hard to beat. That being said, all zippers, even the best, have inherent problems. They are heavier, louder and have many more moving parts than the fabric they replace. The version of the catalyst that is being tested is about the 5th incarnation of that piece. We started testing it in the fall of 2016. What we found was that after removing the laminate the breathability increased so much that for the very few times a tester wanted them it didn't warrant putting them into production on that piece. I think many people will be surprised by how breathable and windproof this fabric is. That being said comments are truly appreciated. KC

No new solids for this summer. Interested in what solids people would like to see. We really like to use solids which can be used in the field.

As some of you he others have stated, I would purchase FL for more than hunting. We are moving to Germany and I want good technical clothing for my family so that my wife and daughter will be able to go farther and longer as we hike, climb and ski. Solids would be preferable, as would more clothing options for the ladies. Good way to grow the business and get the next generation into FL and hunting/outdoors. Could expand sales to Europe...
 
Joined
Oct 17, 2015
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British Columbia
Just some pictures from the SLC Expo, thanks to everyone at FL for talking for almost an hour

Looks like they have purple hue in the 500D all taken care of in Fusion, got the Alaskan Guide Kodiak C.U.B. with M.A.X. and an In-line Accessory Adapter and saw the EXO 3500 in person, finish on both is A+

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Joined
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Just wondering if they have anything in their back pocket with new gloves or if I'll have to keep my Sitka Ascent and Sitka Cold Front gloves

Definitely pretty excited though over all of these pieces, stoked they're coming out with the Chamberlain.

With that said does anyone have anything to say in regards to durability of the Vapor Stormlight Ultralight Rain Jacket? Wondering if I should be grabbing this or the SEAK Jacket, pretty abusive with my gear.
 

twall13

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Jan 21, 2015
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I don't own the obsidians, but I do own some Kanab 2.0's. In my opinion, it's not a pant you order if you are looking for durability. It's a pant you purchase if you require a very silent material that breathes well and won't stink after a week in the backcountry. First lite had done a decent job of addressing the durability in the high stress areas but Merino just isn't as durable as other materials. I know their limitations and use them accordingly and haven't had any durability issues, but again, I'm not brush busting in those pants. Others may disagree but that's my take on them.

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dplantz

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Wenatchee, WA
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Just wondering if they have anything in their back pocket with new gloves or if I'll have to keep my Sitka Ascent and Sitka Cold Front gloves

Definitely pretty excited though over all of these pieces, stoked they're coming out with the Chamberlain.

With that said does anyone have anything to say in regards to durability of the Vapor Stormlight Ultralight Rain Jacket? Wondering if I should be grabbing this or the SEAK Jacket, pretty abusive with my gear.
It's way more durable than any mainstream brand lightweight rain jacket, but I wouldn't want to go uphill through over head high alder with it too many times. If you're hunting anywhere off the coasts, vapor is the way to go. Most years you'll hardly wear it, just sits in your pack as a security blanket, so definitely worth the weight savings. Seak is really only necessary if you're doing multiple full days out in the rain every season.

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mcseal2

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May 8, 2014
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I own a couple pairs of Obsidians. I love the comfort and quiet of them but I tore the leg wide open on one about the 4th time I wore it on a thorn bush. I would probably not purchase them again for my hunting. They just aren't tough enough despite how much I like everything else about them.
 
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I have Obsidians and love them, did suffer a small hole hiking through deadfalls in Southern Colorado this last fall, although frustrating the ripstop worked and contained the puncture - easy to repair. If in rugged country or a chance of thorns, I would look at the corrugates. The comfort, warmth to weight ratio and quietness are the big advantages of these.
 
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It's way more durable than any mainstream brand lightweight rain jacket, but I wouldn't want to go uphill through over head high alder with it too many times. If you're hunting anywhere off the coasts, vapor is the way to go. Most years you'll hardly wear it, just sits in your pack as a security blanket, so definitely worth the weight savings. Seak is really only necessary if you're doing multiple full days out in the rain every season.

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Snows up high in September, not really a 'security blanket' which is why I've loved my Chugach from Kuiu the past few seasons but I've unloaded all of that and switched to FL this year. The SEAK was burly when I tried it out but the Vapor was off putting, felt too thin for my liking. I wish they made a Boundary jacket like the pants I got.
 

dplantz

Lil-Rokslider
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Wenatchee, WA
Snows up high in September, not really a 'security blanket' which is why I've loved my Chugach from Kuiu the past few seasons but I've unloaded all of that and switched to FL this year. The SEAK was burly when I tried it out but the Vapor was off putting, felt too thin for my liking. I wish they made a Boundary jacket like the pants I got.
I was in the two feet of snow up high in September last year, and definitely did not need the seak. Even in moderately heavy snow, I just ran chama most of the time. That wool pretty well dries as fast as it gets wet in most snow. But there are times the rain jacket comes in handy for high Western snow, but the vapor is way more than tough enough. Wearing full weight pack, off trail through timber, no wear or tear

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Dwight.MT

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Oct 5, 2016
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Bozeman, MT
I bought a mid-weight jacket from FL a couple years back (I think the official name is Boundary Stormtight) that is pretty analogous to the KUIU Chugach. I like the stormtight a lot, it offers a nice compromise between ultra lightweight-but-maybe-not-so-durable and bombproof-but-heavy. Not sure why FL dropped the mid-weight jacket and is only making the SEAK and Vapor these days(?)
 

dplantz

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I bought a mid-weight jacket from FL a couple years back (I think the official name is Boundary Stormtight) that is pretty analogous to the KUIU Chugach. I like the stormtight a lot, it offers a nice compromise between ultra lightweight-but-maybe-not-so-durable and bombproof-but-heavy. Not sure why FL dropped the mid-weight jacket and is only making the SEAK and Vapor these days(?)
Vapor is measured greater waterproof and way more breathable than stormtight. They probably figured if they could get better performance for lighter weight, why not. Stormtight wasn't really intended as an all day every day multiple weeks every year piece anyhow; like seak is. Everybody wants one piece to do everything. In following first lites advice about the use of their pieces starting a couple years ago (one would think they would know best how to use their own stuff), I've come to realize that I'm way more comfortable with way less weight and bulk on myself and in my pack if I use focused, specialty pieces. Generalist stuff just fails to meet the need way too often, and you end up packing around more and heavier pieces to try and fill those gaps.

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Joined
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Meh just for durability, there’s no way I’m not putting a hole in the Vapor after feeling it and comparing it to jackets I’ve had in the past that have some form of tape all over them from biking and skiing.

Don’t get me wrong, I love the idea of lightweight, rain proof, and packable but I don’t mind giving up weight for some extra durability. Hell, I have an 8oz emergency rain jacket for mountain biking because it does a specific job.

However, I don’t think I ever asked for a multi week sustained rain jacket but then again you never asked me anything to begin with on my needs and why I wanted this over that.

Any who, I’m grabbing a SEAK jacket.
 

Ryan Avery

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Jan 5, 2012
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To correct what I said about the Sawtooth having 300 weight merino. It had 320 weight merino.
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Joined
Dec 30, 2014
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Vapor is measured greater waterproof and way more breathable than stormtight. They probably figured if they could get better performance for lighter weight, why not. Stormtight wasn't really intended as an all day every day multiple weeks every year piece anyhow; like seak is. Everybody wants one piece to do everything. In following first lites advice about the use of their pieces starting a couple years ago (one would think they would know best how to use their own stuff), I've come to realize that I'm way more comfortable with way less weight and bulk on myself and in my pack if I use focused, specialty pieces. Generalist stuff just fails to meet the need way too often, and you end up packing around more and heavier pieces to try and fill those gaps.

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Stormtight Jacket might have been great if it was 3 layer. Mine started leaking with minimal use, looked like there is not enough protection for the laminate from the inside. I'm sure they discontinued it for a reason.

I did like the fit, features, and relative lack of noisiness though.
 
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