Whose Load Data has been closer to reality for you.....powder or bullet manufacturer?

5MilesBack

"DADDY"
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
Messages
15,527
Location
Colorado Springs
I always find it odd when I look at a bullet manufacturer's load data and will see maybe 65.5gr max load with a specific powder, then check the powder manufacturer's load data for that bullet and they'll post 63.3gr as MAX load. From your experience, which ones are posting conservative load data info? And then you throw in one of the USA Load Guide books and it's entirely different as well.

I could see some 1/10's of grain differences perhaps, but 2-3gr differences is HUGE.
 

cooperjd

WKR
Joined
Dec 30, 2016
Messages
473
Location
Mount Pleasant, SC
i'm a novice reloader and have been noticing the same thing... i find the differences annoying. i have only had a few flattened primers so far, but i think the old '06 might need a gunsmith take a look, as i'm getting flattened primers on a mild factory load as well...

the guy that just posted about his new tikka 7mag has a load that is more than Hodgdon's listed max load for a similar bullet. i'd like for everyone to be close to the same page, not 4gr different!
 
Joined
Apr 9, 2012
Messages
1,847
Location
Fishhook, Alaska
There is also the deal that the bullet manufactures generally lump all of their bullets of the same weight together. Which is a generalization, because usually one of the bunch will have more or less pressure than the others. A 180 Matchking for instance, does not act at all like a 180 Gameking in my rifle. This can sometimes (not always) lead to the bullet manufacture data being a little more conservative.

I usually go with the powder manufacturer if they have data for a specific bullet I'm shooting, since the combination is a little more exact. Either way, the chronograph usually tells the truth. If it's +/- the velocity in the book, I'm happy. If it's way off, then odds are the pressures aren't in line either. So in the instance of widely varying data, I would load up to the bottom number, and if still not meeting expected velocities, I would keep going up toward the top number until either velocities can in line with expectations or I hit the higher "max". The majority of the time, the higher number has proven to be the more accurate number.
 

N2TRKYS

WKR
Joined
Apr 17, 2016
Messages
3,954
Location
Alabama
I've noticed that the powder manufacturer's data has a higher max load than the bullet manufacturer's.
 

rayporter

WKR
Joined
Jul 3, 2014
Messages
4,251
Location
arkansas or ohio
i dont let it bother me as i know they are using much much different equipment that i am. they are measuring pressure and stuff with barrels that are nothing like i use.

so you have to learn to go up slow and sometimes you have to stop short of what was published and sometimes you can go way past.

just like some data is a few grains different than the next.
 
OP
5MilesBack

5MilesBack

"DADDY"
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
Messages
15,527
Location
Colorado Springs
I guess it depends on what you're comparing.

I was looking at a bunch of the Barnes bullet options in a .270 Win.

Barnes shows max load 63gr of Ramshot Big Game for their 85gr MPG for 3801fps with a Remington case, Ramshot Big Game shows max load 61.5gr for 3802fps with a Winchester case. The spread is even bigger for the 95gr TTSX.
 

N2TRKYS

WKR
Joined
Apr 17, 2016
Messages
3,954
Location
Alabama
I was looking at a bunch of the Barnes bullet options in a .270 Win.

Barnes shows max load 63gr of Ramshot Big Game for their 85gr MPG for 3801fps with a Remington case, Ramshot Big Game shows max load 61.5gr for 3802fps with a Winchester case. The spread is even bigger for the 95gr TTSX.

I don't shoot Barnes bullets, so I haven't looked at any of them.
 
Joined
Apr 9, 2012
Messages
1,847
Location
Fishhook, Alaska
I was looking at a bunch of the Barnes bullet options in a .270 Win.

Barnes shows max load 63gr of Ramshot Big Game for their 85gr MPG for 3801fps with a Remington case, Ramshot Big Game shows max load 61.5gr for 3802fps with a Winchester case. The spread is even bigger for the 95gr TTSX.

On the flip side, for a regular old 180 TXS in my 30-06, Barnes data stops at 54.6 grs of Big Game. Ramshot data goes a solid two+ grains higher to 56.9 gr. I suspect the difference for that particular load is basically just how much powder compression they are willing to accept. The difference in published velocity is in line with the powder increase, so nothing weird going on.
 
OP
5MilesBack

5MilesBack

"DADDY"
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
Messages
15,527
Location
Colorado Springs
Good reason to start low and work your way up.

Ya, but "low" is all relative to which load data you're looking at. I tend to start at or near max loads because I also usually load longer than their suggested lengths which decreases pressures too.
 

TheJuice

WKR
Joined
Apr 11, 2013
Messages
310
Location
Adel, IA
Ya, but "low" is all relative to which load data you're looking at. I tend to start at or near max loads because I also usually load longer than their suggested lengths which decreases pressures too.

That makes sense for you, because that's what has worked for you and the way you load for your rifles.
I'm simply making a comment that fits across the board. I personally would like to work my way up to max as one rifles max may be quite a bit lower than another. Would hate to see someone take a recommendation to load at max book and it be too much for 'their' rig.
 

16Bore

WKR
Joined
Mar 31, 2014
Messages
3,020
Nosler's off by a mile, Hornady has been pretty reliable. Barnes has been good and my experience (emphasis on MY) has been that close to max with the bullet seated to the front of the first driving band equaled good juju.

But work up YOUR load!
 
Joined
Dec 30, 2014
Messages
8,176
I try to look up powder and bullet manufacturer data and also see what reputable people are loading to on the internet. Then I start conservatively based on what I've found. There is no clear cut answer about one always being more conservative because of all the variables. Berger's load manual for example has max load data well below the charges I load to in 223, 6.5x47, and 300 WSM but their 300 Norma mag data is significantly hotter than I (and most others) can comfortably load even with a long throated chamber.

You really need to read cases for signs of pressure because there are too many variables (brass, bore diameter, rifling, chamber head space/ throat, twist rate, barrel length, primer, temperature, etc) However, It seems the more common a cartridge and load, the more accurate the published data will be. The combo you're looking at is pretty non conventional, I'd bet .270 data for lead 130 Gr pills and 4831 varies less.
 

N2TRKYS

WKR
Joined
Apr 17, 2016
Messages
3,954
Location
Alabama
Ya, but "low" is all relative to which load data you're looking at. I tend to start at or near max loads because I also usually load longer than their suggested lengths which decreases pressures too.


I thought loading bullets closer to the lands increased pressure.
 

16Bore

WKR
Joined
Mar 31, 2014
Messages
3,020
I thought loading bullets closer to the lands increased pressure.

It does when you're already at max. Start with the bullet kissing the lands, find pressure, the shorten COAL if needed to find accuracy. That way you're only moving in two directions. Don't start in the middle and work sideways.

Except Barnes. Every time I've seated to the first driving band has been a peach.
 
Joined
Aug 20, 2016
Messages
895
My dad's 1975 Sierra loading manual is definitely hotter than anything I've seen today. Definitely hotter than my 2012 Nosler manual.

Guess there were fewer lawyers back then. So the max was actually the MAX.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
 
Joined
Dec 30, 2014
Messages
8,176
I thought loading bullets closer to the lands increased pressure.

It depends how close to the lands. If you have a lot of freebore and are not getting that close to the lands while still loading longer than SAAMI spec, you will reduce pressure because the bullet takes up less case capacity. This is one reason people get rifles chambered with longer freebore - they can load to long COALs and use more powder without getting pressure too high.

If you are jamming into the lands, you'll increase pressure.
 
Top