Work Advice

Virginian

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
May 13, 2017
Messages
142
Location
Virginia
So I need advice about a situation at work. I have been at this company for about 4 years but in my current position for 14 months. My direct boss is doing some things that aren't right. She leaves for 2-3 hours in the day to go to the gym and lunch, has not been following a lot of the rules, but most importantly I found out she is working for a small start-up company using not only her time at our company but also supplies and equipment (think science research). With all of this, she is going to get a part of the other company. To me, this is stealing and lying. I have a close relationship with her boss and have told him about her side job and a couple other things. However, he has done nothing. He spoke with her about the smaller issues but not the side job.

I have another colleague, who is on the same level as my boss who is doing all these nefarious things and she knows about them too. We have talked about it and tried to figure out what we should do. I feel that it's my duty to say something since I know, especially if anyone found out I know. Anyway, my colleague and I discussed speaking with the boss of who I reported this to (she has worked with him for 20 years) to inform him because nothing is being done.

Then I get an email from my colleague about a meeting with the highest boss who is one of the senior VPs in the company. The meeting has already been made without telling or asking me in advance and I feel a little apprehensive. Not about reporting it, but I feel it will make my boss's boss, whom I have a close relationship and reported this to, look bad and hurt our relationship. Generally, I would say that it's the right thing to do so it doesn't matter, however, in this case, I need a recommendation from him for graduate school and I certainly don't want to burn that bridge. So now I'm in a pickle. What should I do?
 

Btaylor

WKR
Joined
Jun 3, 2017
Messages
2,441
Location
Arkansas
You mentioned your friend talked to your boss about the small stuff but not the side job. I would question if he passed that part on up the chain of command due to the nature of that situation. It may be possible that is the case and the senior vp is looking to confirm information he has been given. I think I might first explore that with the person who set up the meeting with the vp before making a decision about which way to proceed.
 
Joined
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Messages
867
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PA
Your direct boss is stealing time and resources from her employer.

You informed the next person up the chain, which is all you can be expected to do. It isn't your job to hold your superior accountable. Unless you plan on being at this company long term I would keep my head down unless explicitly asked about it. Could you get a statement signed by one of higher-ups saying you told them to protect yourself if it ever blows up?
 

DougP

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Aug 9, 2016
Messages
236
Location
Lafayette, LA
So I need advice about a situation at work. I have been at this company for about 4 years but in my current position for 14 months. My direct boss is doing some things that aren't right. She leaves for 2-3 hours in the day to go to the gym and lunch, has not been following a lot of the rules, but most importantly I found out she is working for a small start-up company using not only her time at our company but also supplies and equipment (think science research). With all of this, she is going to get a part of the other company. To me, this is stealing and lying. I have a close relationship with her boss and have told him about her side job and a couple other things. However, he has done nothing. He spoke with her about the smaller issues but not the side job.

I have another colleague, who is on the same level as my boss who is doing all these nefarious things and she knows about them too. We have talked about it and tried to figure out what we should do. I feel that it's my duty to say something since I know, especially if anyone found out I know. Anyway, my colleague and I discussed speaking with the boss of who I reported this to (she has worked with him for 20 years) to inform him because nothing is being done.

Then I get an email from my colleague about a meeting with the highest boss who is one of the senior VPs in the company. The meeting has already been made without telling or asking me in advance and I feel a little apprehensive. Not about reporting it, but I feel it will make my boss's boss, whom I have a close relationship and reported this to, look bad and hurt our relationship. Generally, I would say that it's the right thing to do so it doesn't matter, however, in this case, I need a recommendation from him for graduate school and I certainly don't want to burn that bridge. So now I'm in a pickle. What should I do?

The value of integrity in business cannot be overstated. Other than problem solving skills, it’s the #1 trait I look for in new employees.

Here’s what I would do. Go sit down with your boss’s boss and tell him everything and ask him for advice. Let him know this is something you’ve struggled with and apologize for any grief you may have caused. If he’s a good manager, he will lead you in the right direction.

That said, are you certain you are reading the situation right with your boss? If people didn’t start working on start-ups while holding on to their current jobs, we wouldn’t have nearly as many start-ups. It is an ethical gray area for sure. Is she meeting her objectives? Is she ordering equipment/supplies through your current company to advance the start up (big no no), or is she periodically using capital equipment that probably won’t cost your current company anything (gray)? Also, what’s the culture there? Is it collaborative up and down the chain of command with a focus on developing and empowering employees, or is it stiff and authoritative? In an ideal world, an employee would seek permission to work on a side hustle, but in reality, most companies would shut that down fast so it’s not worth the risk.




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Murdy

WKR
Joined
Jun 6, 2014
Messages
623
Location
North-Central Illinois
Could you get a statement signed by one of higher-ups saying you told them to protect yourself if it ever blows up?

Or send a summary to the person you reported it to in an email and save the email.

Also relevant is whether the start-up is a competitor or potential competitor. If so, this is a bigger problem beyond simply misallocating company time and resources and could hurt your company in ways that are much more significant.

Not sure what I would do, but I agree with much of the advice and observations offered so far.
 

P Carter

WKR
Joined
Nov 4, 2016
Messages
577
Location
Idaho
IMHO, in tricky situations like this, absolute honesty and openness are your only defenses. (At least for me. I'm too dumb to remember if I deceived someone and why.) Remember what you did and why you did it; jot it down in a notebook or email to yourself. I'd go along with the meeting, understanding that you didn't set it up, but be ready to sit down with anyone (including your boss's boss) afterwards and fully explain what you did, when, why, who you talked to, etc. It might get a bit exhausting, but if you stay on the up-and-up no one should hold that against you. (Of course, doesn't mean the WON'T, just that the SHOULDN'T.) And if you've made some sort of mistake along the way, at least this will demonstrate good faith. Most importantly, if you advance in this way, you'll be able to know that you did the right thing, which is perhaps most important of all and really the only thing that can guide folks in a situation like this. All the other variables are just too complicated.
 

5MilesBack

"DADDY"
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
Messages
15,527
Location
Colorado Springs
Those are tough situations. Several years ago the Commanding Officer and Executive Officer showed up to the ship drunk, the morning we were getting underway. The Operations Officer reported it to the Admiral, and a week later the Operations Officer was off the ship and reassigned. Some organizations don't like snitches.
 

GotDraw?

WKR
Joined
Jul 4, 2015
Messages
1,296
Location
Maryland
If her gig is not effecting you, then let it lie.

If you spoke with her boss, then this is now their issue to deal with not yours. People start side gigs all the time while being employed and they sometimes get equity for it. Clearly her boss is now aware and has dealt with it in his own way.

Not your job to play work-police and create a tempest in a teapot beyond what you've done. Keep getting your own work done and don't worry about her. No one is going to come after you for "failing to report" this is not the military. If you continue to feel the need to escalate this all over the place, then better for you to talk with someone and figure out why this is consuming too much of your own focus.

My 2 cents.
 
Joined
Sep 22, 2013
Messages
6,389
So I need advice about a situation at work. I have been at this company for about 4 years but in my current position for 14 months. My direct boss is doing some things that aren't right. She leaves for 2-3 hours in the day to go to the gym and lunch, has not been following a lot of the rules, but most importantly I found out she is working for a small start-up company using not only her time at our company but also supplies and equipment (think science research). With all of this, she is going to get a part of the other company. To me, this is stealing and lying. I have a close relationship with her boss and have told him about her side job and a couple other things. However, he has done nothing. He spoke with her about the smaller issues but not the side job.

I have another colleague, who is on the same level as my boss who is doing all these nefarious things and she knows about them too. We have talked about it and tried to figure out what we should do. I feel that it's my duty to say something since I know, especially if anyone found out I know. Anyway, my colleague and I discussed speaking with the boss of who I reported this to (she has worked with him for 20 years) to inform him because nothing is being done.

Then I get an email from my colleague about a meeting with the highest boss who is one of the senior VPs in the company. The meeting has already been made without telling or asking me in advance and I feel a little apprehensive. Not about reporting it, but I feel it will make my boss's boss, whom I have a close relationship and reported this to, look bad and hurt our relationship. Generally, I would say that it's the right thing to do so it doesn't matter, however, in this case, I need a recommendation from him for graduate school and I certainly don't want to burn that bridge. So now I'm in a pickle. What should I do?

This is exactly why I mind my OWN business and let others run theirs. You put yourself in this position, now suck it up. Being a buttinski has repercussions.
 

boom

WKR
Joined
Sep 11, 2013
Messages
3,185
i am hard-wired to keep my head down and eyes forward..

i wouldnt have said jacksquat..i dont think. reading more: if you had to say something..just pass the info along, no more. once it was off your plate, done deal. wipe it from your mind. if the higher ups dont do anything, that is on them..not you.

tough position..nothing to add except: good luck to you..hope it all works out.
 

Wild Bob

FNG
Joined
Sep 22, 2015
Messages
34
Location
West of Rough Rider Country, east of the Divide
"Your direct boss is stealing time and resources from her employer.

You informed the next person up the chain, which is all you can be expected to do. It isn't your job to hold your superior accountable. Unless you plan on being at this company long term I would keep my head down unless explicitly asked about it. Could you get a statement signed by one of higher-ups saying you told them to protect yourself if it ever blows up?" -flatlanderhuffandpuff

"If her gig is not effecting you, then let it lie.

If you spoke with her boss, then this is now their issue to deal with not yours. People start side gigs all the time while being employed and they sometimes get equity for it. Clearly her boss is now aware and has dealt with it in his own way.

Not your job to play work-police and create a tempest in a teapot beyond what you've done. Keep getting your own work done and don't worry about her. No one is going to come after you for "failing to report" this is not the military. If you continue to feel the need to escalate this all over the place, then better for you to talk with someone and figure out why this is consuming too much of your own focus." - Gotdraw?

"This is exactly why I mind my OWN business and let others run theirs. You put yourself in this position, now suck it up. Being a buttinski has repercussions." - Where's Bruce?
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

In my opinion; all three of these previous comments are solid advice in this situation. Let me explain why I agree with what these guys have already said: (And I offer this as a manager of several departments and my direct experience in handling similar situations in my career.)

1) You never fully know the situation of a coworker. (Back to the Golden Rule principles - on one has walked in another's shoes.)
2) While I understand where you are coming from, and your intentions may be good...are you really concerned from a standpoint of what's best for the company...or your own personal gain (or what you may need or want down the road)? - IMHO, this can be a fine line. I have spent A LOT of time over the years putting out fires between employees that are too busy worrying about 'some one else's job instead of them working hard doing the best they can, at their job.
3) You did due diligence by reporting...if I were you, I would just document what you noted and did, and now focus on what you are evaluated on in your job performance evaluation. The rest will either take care of itself, or as more often is the case; things are being dealt with behind the scenes that you are unaware of.
4) We don't live in a perfect world, it is full or grey. I often deal with situations that coworkers place very high on their personal priority list (and I respect that - I'm not pooh-poohing it) but more often than not, it may be lower on my priority list. We all have to realize that we often don't even fully realize what our supervisor's job fully entails, and if we think we do...then I question if we are actually doing our job fully, or are we too busy looking elsewhere? As a supervisor now, I often hear negative comments from one coworker about another, (i.e. someone just wastes time driving around etc..) when I know, exactly why the other employee was driving around that day, but the guy complaining has no idea that the other guy was actually out collecting samples or performing an evaluation task etc... When I see my boss out, away from work, should I question what they are doing? I also know that my boss has to attend a ridiculous amount of evening meetings that me or other coworkers don't have to...but if I didn't know that, it would be easy to pass a quick judgment.
5) Just remember that as much as we like to think that we know EVERYTHING about anything...remember that the last time I checked, none of us walk on water.
6) Last, keep in mind, that very often, the more you move up the chain of command, (more often than not) the more that person has on their plate. I'm sure that I've had employees report things to me, that I have acted on, but I did not have time to specifically go back to the reporting individual and follow up with them after the fact. I'm sure that some of those folks have complained because of that, or assumed that nothing was being done. I always thank employees for their feedback and concerns, but when it comes to follow up reporting, sometimes there isn't enough time in the day!
- Not trying to come down on you here, just sharing a perspective from the other side of the situation.
OK, I'll shut up now.

Good luck to you and hope things work out well in the end.
 

Rmauch20

WKR
Joined
Jan 15, 2017
Messages
347
Location
Kansas
There’s the way it ought to be in and there is the way it is.
Narking others out Can also put a lot of unneeded the attention on yourself. You could also negatively affect your relationship with other coworkers. I would tell you to make sure you have all your bases covered. Keep your head down and eyes forward and let the company worry about the companies money.
 

dotman

WKR
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Messages
8,201
If this is a publicity traded company by SEC rules there has to be a whistle blower hotline, I would just use this and let your company then investigate or not.
 
Joined
Sep 22, 2013
Messages
6,389
"So you were fired today? Why??"

"Apparently my boss and her bosses started a new business venture together."

"What's that got to do with you and losing your job?"

"It's complicated."

Nick-Clegg-announces-his-resignation-as-leader-at-a-news-conference.jpg
 
Joined
Jun 17, 2017
Messages
1,228
It sounds like you have already acted responsibly and ethically.

At the end of the day you have to be able to look yourself in the mirror and ask, "what would Milton do?"




i-could-set-1czvx9.jpg
 

hflier

WKR
Classified Approved
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Mar 18, 2012
Messages
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Tulsa, OK
I am the VP at a large company and people always assume I know everything, when in reality much gets filtered. I would want to know, but unless you are dead positive of the players involved it can be risky to you. You did not say whether this was a large public company or a smaller privately owned company. The latter is very dangerous. In a large company you can blow the whistle with some protection and many large companies have Ethics hotlines. In a small company, there are sometimes complex relationships and you may be viewed as a problem instead of a stand up employee trying to do the right thing.
 
Joined
Oct 10, 2016
Messages
643
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Sweden
I think the idea of having a statement signed that you reported it sounds good. I reported an ethical problem to my direct supervisor once and after he reported it onwards, he used the situation in a way to try and get rid of me, because he wished I had not brought the issue up. Either way, a paper trail is good for these types of things.

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frankrb3

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Joined
May 10, 2016
Messages
529
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SW Montana
To the OP, sounds like no one else cares. Maybe you shouldn't either. If you don't like working at a place like that then leave. Also, it's probably not ok that you have a friendly relationship with your boss's boss. This is probably why you feel conflicted to say something and it could get you pinched. Sound's like you are trying to recruit people on to your side. I would be very careful about doing this. People generally care about themselves first at work places (as they should since they're the ones responsible for their family, bills and mortgage payment) and will separate themselves from you once you become a whistle blower. I would leave now under good conditions to salvage your friendship and reference with your buddy before you convince yourself to do something regrettable.
 
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