Need help finding a load for my rifle

[maninthemaze]

I managed to get some rounds loaded today. I let my RCBS chargemaster warm up for several hours then started off at 77 grains gonna move up in .2 grain increments. With beam scaled zero adjusted and verified with several 55 grain bullets I began. First charge from the CM showed about 1/16 low on the beam scale. I dumped it back in the CM. Second charge from the CM showed 1/16 heavy on the beam. Both loads showed dead on 77 grains when weighed on the CM. Very interesting!!! I completed the rest of my loads using my tried and true dropper, trickler and beam scale. And I thought I was moving in the right direction with the Charge Master purchase.

Another thing that changed. I made a phone call to CCI with a question about their primers. I had good luck using the BR2 in my 7wsm. I wanted to know if they would be hot enough for almost 80 grains of powder or should I stick with the 250's. They recommended I use Federal 215's. I was shocked that they would recommend someone else's products, but they did. They said the Federal 215's were hotter than their 250's and I would need it to light all that powder. So off to Whitaker's I went to buy some 215's.

Hopefully friday I'll get a chance to shoot them. I'm gonna leave the chronograph at home and take a tall target. Hopefully shoot at 600 yards. I've got 10 rounds to foul the barrel and get on target, then I'll ladder test on fresh paper.

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[danmayland]

I managed to get some rounds loaded today. I let my RCBS chargemaster warm up for several hours then started off at 77 grains gonna move up in .2 grain increments. With beam scaled zero adjusted and verified with several 55 grain bullets I began. First charge from the CM showed about 1/16 low on the beam scale. I dumped it back in the CM. Second charge from the CM showed 1/16 heavy on the beam. Both loads showed dead on 77 grains when weighed on the CM. Very interesting!!! I completed the rest of my loads using my tried and true dropper, trickler and beam scale. And I thought I was moving in the right direction with the Charge Master purchase.

Another thing that changed. I made a phone call to CCI with a question about their primers. I had good luck using the BR2 in my 7wsm. I wanted to know if they would be hot enough for almost 80 grains of powder or should I stick with the 250's. They recommended I use Federal 215's. I was shocked that they would recommend someone else's products, but they did. They said the Federal 215's were hotter than their 250's and I would need it to light all that powder. So off to Whitaker's I went.

Hopefully friday I'll get a chance to shoot them. I'm gonna leave the chronograph at home and take a tall target. Hopefully shoot at 600 yards. I've got 10 rounds to foul the barrel and get on target, then I'll ladder test on fresh paper.

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Wow. Sounds like your headed in the right direction. I completely missed that you were using CCI primers. I would have defiantly recommend switching to 215's

You all got me questioning my CM now though!! Although I would argue that if your in the middle of your accuracy node even 2/10th of a grain either way isn't going to affect your velocity enough to throw you out of the node.

I know that my 6.5 shoots bug holes and holds 1/4 moa out to 1,000 yards and all my loads are thrown with the CM!!


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[maninthemaze]

You all got me questioning my CM now though!! Although I would argue that if your in the middle of your accuracy node even 2/10th of a grain either way isn't going to affect your velocity enough to throw you out of the node.


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I agree, I don't think being 2/10 would have that much effect on the accuracy node. I think I've been trying to hard to hit a certain velocity. Shooting the 195's around 3100 has been my goal. I should just concentrate on getting the accuracy where it needs to be, and let the velocity be whatever it ends up being. I was really trying to up my game, and ended up forgetting some of the basics. After all, none of the load development I did with my 7wsm involved a chronograph.

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[Mtnman84]

I did some testing with 2 28 nosler and was shooting the 195 3170 and 3200 with 33 both rifles have 28 inch pipes and we were using a lab radar accuracy was good and had an es around 30

 

[danmayland]

Any updates? Have you checked runout by any chance?


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[maninthemaze]

I'm planning on shooting tomorrow morning, hopefully before it gets hot and mirage sets in. And I don't have a way of checking the runout, yet. Hopefully I can get by without going that far. After all, I'm not shooting F-class. But who knows, one of these day I might be.

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[maninthemaze]

I forgot to mention that I also redid the bedding around the recoil lug. I have always heard that there needs to be clearance around the front of the recoil lug, so when my bedding didn't go in front of the lug, I thought no problem. Well, after staring at it the other day, when I was double checking a few things, it started bothering me. So I ground out some of what was already there and roughed up some of the other places. I won't explain the whole process. But now, I have bedding around the lug, with .005 clearance on the barrel side. I also extended the bedding about 3/4" forward of the lug.

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[maninthemaze]

All rounds were fired at 500 yards.

Looks like 77.0, 77.2, 77.4 and 77.6 are pretty good vertically, but have a little horizontal spread to them. The wind was blowing from 2 to 5 mph right to left.

And it looks like 79.6, 79.8 and 80 are good vertically as well as horizontally.

I've read some people worry about just the vertical and some people worry about the vertical but take into account the horizontal. Seems like loading up some more 79.8's to verify is definitely in order.

I'm gonna assume it was a combination of the weak CCI primers, as well as me not letting the RCBS chargemaster warm up enough. Or it's throws are a little off.

And just for you Dan. My scope doesn't track consistently like it used to. While getting on target. The first three rounds were about 10" low, I adjusted up 1 MOA. I knew this wouldn't be enough but I had bullets to burn to foul the barrel. Anyways, next 3 rounds were up 5" perfect, since I'm shooting at 500 yards. I adjusted up 1 MOA again. Next 3 rounds were in the same spot as the previous 3. Up another 1 MOA, the next 3 rounds moved up about 2". This is were I left the scope for the ladder test, and didn't touch it again until I was done.

I called Vortex and they said they have a 5-7 day turn around time. Looks like I'm gonna send it off, first thing Monday morning. That's if the zombie apocalypse hasn't happened because of the eclipse.

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[danmayland]

Well that's a bummer to hear about your scope. I'd be really skeptical of that ladder test knowing that your scope isn't tracking properly. I'm confused by that 79.6 and 79.8 rounds. Looks like the node is at 78.2-78.4 to me


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[maninthemaze]

I'm just curious, but why 78.2 to 78.4?

The 79.6, 79.8 and 80.0 were, all three, within 1-1/2" inches.

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[PAXMAN]

I have a very similar rifle built by mike @ Hells Canyon. I found that 26 nosler Norma brass necked up works better and is cheaper. I also use N570. Most temp stable powder with low es I have ever used. 79.5 shot 3072,3073,3072 and less than 1/2". Brass prep did take some getting used to. I anneal, neck up using carbide expander ball and dry neck lube. Then make a double pass over the ball. I did noice on virgin annealed cases I would need to scrub them out before sizing. They seemed to catch on the ball more.

 

[danmayland]

I'm just curious, but why 78.2 to 78.4?

The 79.6, 79.8 and 80.0 were, all three, within 1-1/2" inches.

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Sorry I think I was half drunk when I looked at your target. Did the wind die down shooting those last loads. I agree that 79.8 is probably the middle of that node. Those just threw me off being so far away from them other group. What billets were you shooting? I think your going to start seeing a marketable improvement!! Or at least once you get the scope issue resolved.


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[danmayland]

For what it's worth, it's amazing how much runout can affect your groups. I would attribute the majority of peoples fliers to runout. I loaded up almost 100 rounds today for a match tomorrow. I measured runout on every round. Most range from 2-3 thou of runout with probably 10ish were 4-5 thou and probably 10ish were 1-2 thou. I correct any that are more than 3 thou. I had one that was about 9 thou off. I took it out with some loads and shot it at the end of a 4 shot string. Sure enough it was a full inch out of the group at 100 yards. I marked the brass for the next reload and if it's still that far out it's going in the fouler pile!


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[maninthemaze]

The wind was touch and go. Sometimes it was blowing steady, sometimes dead still. If remember correctly, the 77.2 round, it was dead still. Thanks a lot for all your help. I really appreciate it.

And I guess I'll start pricing/researching something to check the runout.

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[maninthemaze]

Oh yeah, I'm still shooting the 195s and using the N570 powder. Once I realized I wasn't warming up the CM long enough and then talked to the guys at CCI, I decided to stick with the same stuff. I really want to shoot those 195's for some strange reason.

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[danmayland]

The wind was touch and go. Sometimes it was blowing steady, sometimes dead still. If remember correctly, the 77.2 round, it was dead still. Thanks a lot for all your help. I really appreciate it.

And I guess I'll start pricing/researching something to check the runout.

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I use the Hornady I picked up from Amazon. I like it because it's stupid easy to use and make adjustments.


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[mt100gr.]

Not to detract from the thread here, but could you explain your warm up process for your chargemaster, please. Not only is this thread becoming a great resource for trouble shooting load development techniques, but also a reassuring saga of frustration many of us have faced.

Thank you.

 

[maninthemaze]

I simply turn it on a couple hours before using it. When I talked to Ryan, he said that he just plugs his into a surge protector and then leaves it on all the time. He said that you would be amazed at the amount of drift they have. I left one of my 195 Berger's on it for about 2 hours. It weighed 195 initially, but showed it at 195.4 just 2 hours later.

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[maninthemaze]

In case anyone is wondering the order in which I fired the rounds they went in groups of three's. Three rounds at a time is the limit on this rifle because it gets really hot, really quick. I fired them 77.8, 78.8, 79.8 followed by 77.6, 78.6, 79.6, then 77.4, 78.4, 79.4 and so on. All bullets were colored with a black, red and blue sharpie up to the bearing surface. If you are shooting more rounds, I think green would be another color you could try. Black and blue are kinda hard to tell apart without getting real close. Coloring the bullets let's me distinguish between them, as I can't see the bullets holes from that distance. Not even through my spotting scope.

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[danmayland]

In case anyone is wondering the order in which I fired the rounds they went in groups of three's. Three rounds at a time is the limit on this rifle because it gets really hot, really quick. I fired them 77.8, 78.8, 79.8 followed by 77.6, 78.6, 79.6, then 77.4, 78.4, 79.4 and so on. All bullets were colored with a black, red and blue sharpie up to the bearing surface. If you are shooting more rounds, I think green would be another color you could try. Black and blue are kinda hard to tell apart without getting real close. Coloring the bullets let's me distinguish between them, as I can't see the bullets holes from that distance. Not even through my spotting scope.

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I use red, blue and green sharpies. Color just the tip to og. Get creative and color one batch of bullet tips half red and half green, then next batch do half red and half blue then next batch half blue and half green. Gives you a total of 6 color combinations


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