Take the Trad Plunge?

Whisky · Oct 10, 2014

I've been tossing this idea around for a couple years but lately I've been really musing it over. First, I am just flat out sick of all the bullshit with compounds. Yoke tuning, broad head tuning, bareshaft tuning, sighting in 5-7 pins, tuning rests, twisting cables/strings, having two bows set perfect before season and then after one hunt in the mountains they go to shit and you have to start all over. Just sick of fudging with them. I hate tuning.

Second, where I elk hunt a 30 yard shot with a compound would be a long shot. Thick stuff.

Third, I have gotten pretty picky with my archery deer tag. I shouldn't be because I'm no expert hunter, but I am. I spend a lot of time between mule deer and whitetails hunting in a giving year, but not much killing until the end of season when i fill out on a doe for the freezer. I see traditional as an opportunity to go after more animals. After all I'm sure my standards would be far lower with a longbow in hand. More stalks, maybe more shot opportunies, more learning, more fun.

Fourth, lighter weight.

So with that said, do you see good reason to jump into traditional with both feet?

Now, assume the answer is yes. Where the hell does one start? What resources do you recommend for gearing up and building proper fundamentals? I have done a little research. I've watched some of Ryan's videos. A lot of the stuff might as well be in Chinese because I don't understand much.

If I get into this I realize you want to start light at first to build up fundamentals. I shoot 28" draw, one bow 72# and one 74#. Any recs on a good cheap starter bow to see if it's something i want to pursue? And starting weight? Ultimately My goal would be to have a nice custom setup capable of killing elk at 20-25 yds by next Sept. Is that doable? Is two bow purchases the way to go or do you think if I started out with a nice custom 50# right off the bat I'd be Ok,and satisfied?

Lots of questions....Thanks

Whisky

gobbler1662 · Oct 10, 2014

Whisky, glad to see your thinking about taking the trad plunge. Two years ago I was at the same point. Bows that could shoot 350, and accurate to 100 yards plus. I needed to get back to basics. So I took the advise of a friend and sold my compound and off I went. I started with a Martin X-200 recurve that was a 55 pound bow. After shooting a 65 pound compound for 20 plus years the recurve was no big deal to draw back.Now I am shooting a 65 pound Great Northern longbow with ease. Last year was my first full season hunting with the recurve and even though I passed up a questionable shot on a nice bull I came up empty handed. So last winter I made it a priority to shoot daily and join a winter traditional league and get really good with a trad bow. It paid off, this year as I was able to harvest a really nice 6 point bull with my recurve. Now I will tell you one thing that I didn't see coming with switching to traditional. You kind of get hooked on all the exotic woods and end up buying way more bows then you need. Currently I have 1 recurve and 3 longbows. Just warning you its a bad habit. Ha ha, but seriously good luck and never look back.

justinspicher · Oct 10, 2014

I did this seven years ago and haven't ever looked back. Call the guys at rmsgear.com. They have a huge stickbow inventory and are areictly stickbow guys. They can really help a guy out who is just starting out.

1 (877) 843-5559

Rizzy · Oct 10, 2014

I started with the trad gear this season for Elk. I built my own longbow in the garage earlier in the year (good winter project) and that's what I used. It cost about 10$ worth of hardwood and shoots as good as I can at this point. It was a real gratifying experience and I will be at it again next year. I'm currently building another bow, which is just as much fun as hunting with it. I chose to focus on Elk first due to the advantage of the rut season and larger target. I am consistent out to about 18 yards, which made it even more challenging. I stepped into this as a challenge rather than a way to fill a tag. I live in Elk country more or less so this is a lot easier to do. I can understand why someone who travels across the country to hunt one week out of the year will not want to gamble their expensive tag on a lower odds method of harvest. With that said, I had a lot of chances to fill a tag with a cow or spike so If I was after meat it would have actually been a lot higher odds of success than the rifle seasons for me. Although I didn't tag out, my standards stayed the same this season, raghorn or better.

I think you have to jump in with both feet to get proficient, at least early on when building a sequence and form. There are a ton of videos on youtube about form, tunning, equipment, and even building your own board bow, just dive in

FreeRange · Oct 10, 2014

After shooting a recurve this year for the first time in a long time, I decided to spend the next off-season working towards being able to hunt without the wheels. Prior to that I was planning on upgrading my clunky old single-cam PSE to a fast, modern dual-cam, now I won't be doing that and am happy to be going in the opposite direction. I'm going to purchase a Sammick Sage in the next couple of weeks with fairly light limbs I know I won't hunt with and build up in weight as I develop my form. I know it's not a super sweet bow but it's functional for my purposes starting out for the first year at least I figure.

Eagle · Oct 10, 2014

First things first, you'll need to bareshaft tune in order to get perfect broadhead flight with your bow, and that can be as tedious and mind numbing as any tuning you'll do with a compound, so be forewarned.

My advice to a beginner, buy the masters of the barebow videos, specifically the one where Rod Jenkins go in depth, I believe that's volume 3. If you can find a class Rod is teaching in your area, go and soak up all you can. He will shorten your learning curve a great deal. Blank bale shooting is your biggest friend while establishing form. Start out with a bow in the 30-40 pound range until you get your form flawless. Once you have your form set, slowly start building up in weight in 5 pound increments until you reach a weight you are happy with. With that, and ILF compatible riser will be the way to go so that you can buy and sell sets of limbs fairly easily and cheaply. The sammick sage is often recommended, but I have no experience with that bow.

Good luck with your endeavor, I hope your shoulders are healthy, as mine have caused me to go back to a compound part time, I can't shoot often enough with my shoulders to shoot exclusively trad.

Ryan K Sanpei · Oct 10, 2014

In terms of videos, these may be a little easier to understand. Please keep in mind, some of these need to be updated.

http://www.stalkerstickbows.com/new-to-shooting/

http://www.stalkerstickbows.com/new-to-stickbows/

Whisky · Oct 10, 2014

Those are great Ryan. I watched a bunch yesterday.

Ryan K Sanpei · Oct 10, 2014

If you can't find a bow to "borrow", Samick makes some inexpensive bows. Use something similar to these bows to see if you like trad and you could always use it to build up in weight. If you buy a 3 pc bow, you can always just buy extra limbs instead of buying a new bow as you move up in poundage.

http://www.lancasterarchery.com/samick-sage-takedown-recurve-bow.html

Once you've found your desired weight, then you consider ordering a custom built bow.

Keep the questions coming...

Forestryguy · Oct 10, 2014

I got to this same point two years ago. I sold my Mathews to a friends wife for his wedding gift and picked up a used long bow cheap from one of the local archery shops. I hunted most of last year with it, then got the itch to be able to shoot farther again. I am going to shoot compound this season and then it is getting sold and I am going back to the longbow. I am the same way and tired of tuning for absolute perfection, and I would rather say I shot an animal that I stalked up on at 10 yds than I shot it at 60yds.

I read everything I could get ahold of and watched many videos. I have a lot to still learn and I know that my form is not the greatest, but I can hit a pie plate at 20yds.

Whisky · Oct 10, 2014

How much DL difference am I looking at when going to a Longbow?
Ryan, one of your videos said half inch?
I thought I read in Byron Ferguson's book 1.5-2" less then compound length?

I'm currently considering a 40lb Bear Montana, and possibly ordering a couple test kits from 3Rivers for spine testing. Thoughts?

What else would a guy need right off the bat? I have an arrow saw, t square.
Stringer
Nock points
Glove/tab?
Quiver?
Rests and pads
Feathers I suppose
???

Thanks

Ryan K Sanpei · Oct 10, 2014

DL is a tough one. Here's an example..

When I shot compounds, I was 26" with a caliper and 26.5" with a back tension. When I first started shooting stick bows, I started at 25". After a few years and getting my form "correct" I'm at 26.5". Yes, I've seen up to 2" in discrepancies at times but for the most part 1" to .5". It'll really depend on "how" you shoot the stick bow. (your form)

Yes, finding the right spine can be tough at first. Test kits are good if you don't have any friends with lighter spined arrows laying around.

A Bear Montana is a good start. Keep in mind, most of those factory bows are scaled at 28". The draw curve is about 3 pounds a couple inches below and above. (usually 2.5/3lbs around the marked weight. 3.5lbs and higher is when a bow begins to "stack") This will vary from bow to bow... So lets say your draw is 29", the 40lb factory bow may be about 43lbs at your draw.

I prefer tip to tip stringers. With longbows, stringing is not too crucial, just keep tips away from face. With recurves, try not to torque the bow as you may twist the limb tips.
https://blackwidowbows.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=114_122&product_id=378

I tie my own nock points.
http://youtu.be/75A8Y9ahNQA

I prefer a tab, nothing wrong with a glove. I shoot one similar to this but it has cordovan.
https://blackwidowbows.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=114_121&product_id=296

Here's why I like tabs.
http://www.rokslide.com/forums/showthread.php?22200-How-amp-Why-I-Prefer-to-use-a-Cordovan-Tab

Many good bow quivers out there. I've used a GN for years. Strong, lightweight and durable.
https://blackwidowbows.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=114_118&product_id=288

I've had good luck with calf hair rest/strike plates. Durable and slick.
https://blackwidowbows.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=114_122&product_id=394

Feathers is a good start. I prefer trueflight. Here's a write up on orientation.
http://www.rokslide.com/forums/showthread.php?21704-Fletching-Orientation-amp-Shelf-Contact

SDHNTR · Oct 10, 2014

Go for it. It brought the fun back into shooting a bow for me. But realize there is still the potential for frustration, great frustration. I missed 9 animals inside of 20 yards with a stick before I killed one. There were many times I wanted to throw the thing off a mountain. But the gratification is great and I do find pleasure in hitting the field without feeling like a walking sporting goods store.

Ryan K Sanpei · Oct 10, 2014

Whisky,
The only thing you can't ask me about is tuning LOL! I spend just as much time tuning a stickbow as I do a compound. I bareshaft, paper tune and group field points, broadheads and bareshafts. It's a little extreme, but I strive for the best broadhead flight that I can get.

Kebler · Oct 10, 2014

I'd buy a 45lb samick sage, get some 500 spine arrows and leave them full lenght, to start with. You can get that bow, 6 arrows and a glove for under 200 bucks.

Kebler · Oct 10, 2014

I started with the sage, it will do everything you want it, also I'd upgrade the sting to a SBD string, 10 strand.

Rizzy · Oct 10, 2014

I used this guide for tuning and it seemed to work good.

http://www.acsbows.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/tuninglongbowsandrecurves.pdf

A quiver attached to your bow like what Ryan posted is a lot better for hunting. I tried an over the shoulder quiver while on one of my Elk hunts this season and it was a nightmare.

Kebler · Oct 10, 2014

Also watch all the videos you can find of Rick welches students shooting online, you can buy his video the accuracy factory. I did not attend his school, but picked up on his method and anchor point, which actually increased my draw by 1" inch.

Kebler · Oct 10, 2014

I missed the longbow part, I am assuming your wanting a longbow, that's what I shot. I'm currently waiting on my new one from maddog archery, he builds reflex/deflex longbows at a working mans price.

i have shot the bear montana and its a great bow, super quiet and smooth

if you go with a 40lber, I would get a 600 spine arrow, you can buy gold tip blemished arrows for 50 bucks a dozen from big jims bow company, so you would want 15/35 spine and leave them full lenght since you have a saw then you can cut them.

id just run standard inserts and all that jazz, 100 grain heads

you will be short drawing till you find your form, then you can make adjustments.

for tuning, I'd just paper tune, you can get a longbow to shoot bullet holes just like a wheel bow, I been able to acheive bullet holes with 10 different bows, bare shafting can lie to the novice, since release has allot to do with it.

paper won't lie

Kebler · Oct 10, 2014

I'd tie on nock points like Ryan's video

id shot a golve

id shoot 3 under to start out

if you got an email, I can send you a pic of what welches anchor looks like, and save you lots of video watching to try and figure it out, if you choose that method, it's very similar to what you do with a compund

Take the Trad Plunge?

WKR

WKR

WKR

WKR

WKR

WKR

WKR

WKR

WKR

WKR

WKR

WKR

WKR

WKR

Lil-Rokslider

Lil-Rokslider

WKR

Lil-Rokslider

Lil-Rokslider

Lil-Rokslider

Similar threads

Featured Video

Stats

Latest Articles