Wyoming with Nine PP

[wapitibob]

Send Buzz a pm.

 

[Tryin]

Send Buzz a pm.

I will do so.

I would also like to thank everyone that has responded to the thread and especially all those who have PM’d me so far. You guys are great, and the efforts are truly appreciated.

 

[Jimss]

Buzz, You're completely right...I'm not interested in helping anyone unless there's something in it for me! You know me so well! You could possibly ask any of the hunters I've shared hunts with if they felt it was well worth the trespass fee and pref pts? Yep....I only care about myself!

You might also take a look through all of my recent posts on this and other websites. You'll notice that I spend a great number of hours offering sound advice on equipment, techniques, units, etc. Yep, I only care about myself!

Buzz, some day you'll realize that I'm not your enemy! If you met and chatted with me face to face you would realize I'm not the selfish hunter you think I am!

 

[204guy]

Ethical or moral differences about what constitutes taking advantage of people aside. Jim how do you reconcile the fact that you're asking niave NRs to enter a very grey area of breaking WY law? It's interesting that WY puts some responsibility on the hunter to verify they're hunting with a licensed outfitter. I can't find the current text about recieving compensation as an unlicensed guide, but it's not legal either. Certainly points have a monetary value as they have to be purchased. I would also argue that the monetary value of a bunch of points is much higher than just the combined purchase price.

What number do you have them write on the back of their license? 123456789

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[Tryin]

Huh, I reckon I should read more of Wyoming’s regulations... I mainly assumed that it was kind of a “party draw” state with few or no stipulations on how the pool was acquired. Hmm.

Well, it looks like I will be doing the full DIY experience anyway, thanks to all of the encouragement here. Y’all make it sound rather doable, even if it is way outside my normal modus operandi.

 

[vanish]

Can you guys stop hijacking Tryin's thread.

Trying: Pronghorn in a 9 point unit will blow your mind. Leave your weapons locked up on the first day until you understand what you're working with.

 

[wytx]

Can you guys stop hijacking Tryin's thread.

Trying: Pronghorn in a 9 point unit will blow your mind. Leave your weapons locked up on the first day until you understand what you're working with.

Sorry but don't pass a buck on the first day you would harvest on the last day. Big bucks have a way of disappearing after you first see them.
I do agree. look over some animals, come out a day or 2 early. Let the family sight see while you scout.
You might be surprised what you can find in an area that takes well fewer than 9 PP.

Just my 2 cents but if a 55-65 inch buck looks the same through your scope get a new scope. They would probably be immature bucks at that size. Lots of advice on field judging bucks out there too.
Not a personal jab at your equipment, but it should be fairly easy to judge an immature buck from a mature one through a scope. Spotting scopes are a big asset when field judging antelope, saves miles of walking to get a closer look.

 

[wapitibob]

Huh, I reckon I should read more of Wyoming’s regulations... I mainly assumed that it was kind of a “party draw” state with few or no stipulations on how the pool was acquired. Hmm.

Well, it looks like I will be doing the full DIY experience anyway, thanks to all of the encouragement here. Y’all make it sound rather doable, even if it is way outside my normal modus operandi.

There is nothing illegal about you applying as a party with anyone, whether you know them or picked them off the street. Jimss scours the internet looking for people to party with so he can hunt antelope and elk every year, it's no secret. It does leave a sour taste with many as he jumps to the head of the line year after year, on hunts you could do yourself. As some of us have mentioned, we would not share our points at the point level you are at.

 

[Jimss]

I call hogwash on your assumptions that me and other hunters are doing anything illegal blending pts. I'm merely applying for party tags and hunting with others. I don't think I would be doing it if I knew it was illegal!

You may want ask Founder on Monstermuleys and Randy Newberg on Onyourownadventures if they consider it immoral and unethical to blend pref pts with other hunters...they are doing the same exact thing pretty much every year! There are a bunch of guys across the country that swap hunts. Do you consider swapping hunts illegal, unethical, and immoral...not even close! I'm not taking advantage of anyone and it's a win-win situation for everyone I hunt with! I certainly get a lot of satisfaction seeing the smiles on other hunters faces after their exciting, successful hunts!

Something some of you may not understand is that when points are blended all the hunters that draw tags are burning all their points. If I happen to apply with 2 guys with 9 pref pts they both loose their pts and it makes it easier for hunters with 9 pts to draw great tags in the following years. If I had close to max pts I'd be tickled to death that other hunters are dropping out! This may actually help those hunters with 9+ pts draw high demand tags. I actually don't draw tags every year but when I do my pts return to 0. It's been a while since I've drawn deer and elk tags so those that think I do this each year are sadly mistaken!

 

[Bulldawg]

I call hogwash on your assumptions that me and other hunters are doing anything illegal blending pts. I'm merely applying for party tags and hunting with others. I don't think I would be doing it if I knew it was illegal!

Do you consider swapping hunts illegal, unethical, and immoral...

1. The minute you say “I will take you to a place to find big bucks and show you how to do it ONLY if you blend your points with me, you are technically breaking the law by the way that it is written in the book. You are receiving compensation.

2. Swapping hunts is illegal. Immoral? I don’t think it is, but it is illegal.

I think what people are getting at is not the fact that it’s illegal or immoral, it’s just kinda sleazy.


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[realunlucky]

Im definitely doing something wrong I can't even get my wife to split her points with me. Going to be working on my sells pitch for sure.

 

[Jimss]

I guess this is where some of us will agree that we disagree. I'm not taking any compensation....I'm just going hunting with other hunters with the same interest in hunting trophy antelope...and possibly other game. Where is it written in any book that this is illegal? Also, where in the books does it say it's illegal to swap hunts? Just about every website has swap hunt forums!

I think some of you have blown this totally out of proportion! Why do some hunters burn max pref pts and pay an outfitter thousands of dollars to go on a guided hunts? There are some pretty shady outfitters out there that may actually "take advantage" of hunters?! I can think of a number of advantages for someone to blend pref pts with someone that has intimate knowledge of game and a unit to share a hunt. Some hunters enjoy doing it all on their own. I am one of those DIY guys and understand completely how it's possible to do this in Wyo and other Western states for trophy antelope!

I also can see a lot of advantages for hunting with someone that has year's experience in an area and field judging critters. Not everyone has the time, knowledge, experience, or desire to do it on their own and would rather hunt with a friend that can bring a smile to their faces! Heck yes it's fun to see a smile on a new found friends face when they harvest a whopper booner buck...especially after looking over virtually hundreds of antelope bucks! Believe it or not I pay the same trespass fee as everyone else to hunt a private ranch. Could I hunt public land....yes...but is it worth it to have access to locked gates with thousands of acres of private land and trophy bucks....heck yes! Similar to hunting private land in Colorado, Montana, or any other Western state there is often a definite advantage to having access to private land.

Believe it or not, I have gone hunting with a few internet "friends" over the years on great hunts here in Colo....just for the satisfaction of the smile factor! There were no pref pt blending or anything else involved. I happen to get a kick out of spending quality time in bighorn sheep and mtn goat country. If I hear someone has drawn a once in a lifetime sheep or goat tag in a unit that I know well I'm super excited to scout and accompany others on their hunt. Is it sleazy, immoral, or illegal for me to do this...even if I'm not a licensed guide? I am guessing it's ok, right?

 

[MTElkChaser]

Huh, I reckon I should read more of Wyoming’s regulations... I mainly assumed that it was kind of a “party draw” state with few or no stipulations on how the pool was acquired. Hmm.

Well, it looks like I will be doing the full DIY experience anyway, thanks to all of the encouragement here. Y’all make it sound rather doable, even if it is way outside my normal modus operandi.

I think part of the “fun” of my 1st Wyoming Antelope hunt was not knowing what I was doing or what to expect. Despite that, I was still successful, saw lots of great bucks, and harvested a really good one.

It’s not that hard and especially if you have the points for a great Unit. Wyoming Game and Fish Department does a great job helping out NR’s - from their informative website to answering the phones and giving great advice.

Do your research, but also do yourself a favor and go out their not knowing everything to expect - it will be an adventure that you’ll remember the rest of your life. And if you spend enough days out there - I can almost guarantee success.

Good luck, but most of all, have fun with it!

 

[204guy]

Something some of you may not understand is that when points are blended all the hunters that draw tags are burning all their points. If I happen to apply with 2 guys with 9 pref pts they both loose their pts and it makes it easier for hunters with 9 pts to draw great tags in the following years. If I had close to max pts I'd be tickled to death that other hunters are dropping out! This may actually help those hunters with 9+ pts draw high demand tags. I actually don't draw tags every year but when I do my pts return to 0. It's been a while since I've drawn deer and elk tags so those that think I do this each year are sadly mistaken!

HAHA, I'm dying here.

 

[204guy]

Huh, I reckon I should read more of Wyoming’s regulations... I mainly assumed that it was kind of a “party draw” state with few or no stipulations on how the pool was acquired. Hmm.

Well, it looks like I will be doing the full DIY experience anyway, thanks to all of the encouragement here. Y’all make it sound rather doable, even if it is way outside my normal modus operandi.

As has been stated above there is nothing illegal about any party apps with anyone. The problem is compensation given in exchange for "unlicensed guiding or outfitting services" If anything I typed above implied otherwise I apologize. I'm not sure but it looks like someone could pay a high point holder to do a party app. The guiding part is the sticking point.

Only you know what Jimss propositioned you, I just wanted people to be aware that WY also holds the "bookie" responsible for making sure their guide is licensed when reaching a guiding agreement. I'm no friend to the Outfitting industry BTW.

Again I want to apologize for your thread going so sideways. If Buzz hasn't lined you out yet, the hardest part is going to be finding a town to keep your family busy in Sept. for a couple days while you hunt. Cody, Lander, and maybe Thermopolis hot springs are all that come to mind, with a good unit nearby. Gohunt or similar might be worth investing in. And you'll definitely need, and need to know how to use ON-X or similar. I'd probably start a new thread again after the winter.

 

[Jimss]

204guy, I'm not taking any compensation! I'm merely applying and hunting with internet friends....end of story!

It's kindof comical. Take a look over on the Rokslide muledeer forum and you'll notice a post "Wyo point problem". Quite a few guy's recommendations are to share pts and go hunting with friends! A couple of the posts actually mention averaging pts with Founder on MM. The reason I believe this is comical is that I bring this up and Buzz and his cronies jump all over me and call me "Sleazy" unethical, immoral, and illegal. Hey Buzz, I don't see you hammering away at Randy Newberg....or Founder! I wonder if Buzz has some sort of vendetta against me?

I don't know about you guys, but I'm pretty much burned out on this topic. If anyone wants to join me on a great hunt in Wyo...look me up! We'll have a great time and you'll leave with an ear to ear smile on your face! If you plan on hunting on your own...send me a message and I'd be glad to offer unit advice and field judging pointers that will hopefully make your hunt a success!

 

[BuzzH]

Tryin….check your pms when you get the chance.

 

[Jimss]

Glad to see that you agree with me on this Buzz!

 

[BuzzH]

Sebastian,

I don't agree with you on this at all.

Randy uses the party application the way it was intended to be used, applying with close personal friends and his family (son, uncle, etc). You wont be catching Randy trolling internet boards looking to use a strangers points to get himself a tag.

Nor will you catch him offering to scout for someone in exchange for using their points like Brian does...and yes, I have called him on it.

You and Brian are in a different category...in it for selfish reasons and would sell your soul and hunting area out, for a tag.

You don't care about making anyone happy but yourself. If you did, you wouldn't troll boards looking to get a tag for yourself using others points, and offer help to someone for nothing in return. Just like I did here.

You're a bottom feeder...take with both hands and give nothing back.

 

[BuzzH]

Jimss,

Oh, and one last question there Mr. Ethics...how many times have you let someone (a stranger) with less points party with you so they could draw a tag also?

When you had max points in Wyoming for deer, elk and pronghorn...were you looking to make someone else happy, and put a smile on their face from ear to ear, by allowing them to party with you, using your max points?

You don't need to answer...everyone already knows.