Scope problems, need advise on replacement!

ramont

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Nov 19, 2017
Messages
259
Location
Montana
Ah, the .1mil is .36, a full MIL is 3.6in@100 yds, 3.4377 MOA to equal a MIL@100. I was in a hurry when I typed the other response.

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I was going to point that out just to help clarify.

For the OP both units (MOA and MIL) are radians - units of angular measure. They are based on the radius of a circle and it's relationship to the circumference of the circle. Think of one degree of a circle, that's an arc, the radius of the arc is the range to the target, the arc length (the small part of the circumference of the circle that is in that one degree) is the amount change per MOA or MIL. The longer the radius (the range to the target) the bigger the arc length is (the amount of change per MOA or MIL).


100 clicks on a MOA scope with 1/4 MOA adjustments is equal to 100 x .25 = 25 MOA of change.
100 clicks on a MIL scope with .1 Mil adjustments is equal to 100 x 0.1 = 10 MIL of change.

Without a specified range we have no idea how many inches either unit represents but let's assume 100 yards.

At 100 yards, 100 clicks on a 1/4 MOA per click scope would equal 25 MOA (approx. 1" per MOA) of change which is roughly 25 x 1" = 25 inches.
At 100 yards, 100 clicks on a .1 MIL per click scope would equal 10 MIL (approx 3.6" per MIL) of change which is roughly 10 x 3.6" = 36 inches.

At 1000 yards you would still have the same number of MOA and MIL change (25 and 10) but since each radian is now 10 times larger (10 inches per MOA and 36 inches per MIL) you end up with larger total changes.

250 inches for 25 MOA
360 inches for 10 MIL

I will say however that with modern scopes it is all pretty much mute anyways because most will be calibrated to move 25 MOA or 10 MIL for one full rotation of the elevation knob so either scope would require just one rotation up for 100 clicks.

In the real world MIL scopes are usually easier to write the adjustment numbers down because you usually only have a number in the teens as opposed to an MOA value that is usually in the 30s or 40s. For example; a bullet drops 450 inches at 1000 yards, you'd have a come-up of 45 MOA or 12.5 MILs, which is easier to write on a drop card and stick to your stock and read quickly in the field? And turning the knobs to their marked position is much easier when you move them 12.5 major increments rather than 45 major increments. MOA scope would usually require 1 full rotation of the knob plus another 20 major increments while the MIL scope would require 1 full rotation and 2.5 major increments beyond that.
 
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Formidilosus

Super Moderator
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
8,017
My question was for Formidilosus, he said that MOA is less capable of adjusting for come-ups.



Not less capable, that it removes some options when it comes to wind and elevation holds.


So how do you make wind calls using MOA without a ballistic program?
 

luke moffat

Super Moderator
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Messages
102
My question was for Formidilosus, he said that MOA is less capable of adjusting for come-ups.

It's good that it was clarified how MOAs and MRADs reflect different numbers of inches but you have to remember that MRADs (Mildots) were developed for the military and the need for fast range adjustments took precedence over precision, if I hit a guy in the chest at 1000 yards it doesn't really matter to me if I hit him in the lungs or the heart, he'll still be out of the game. So yes, MOAs are more precise but you have to turn the knobs more at longer ranges than you with Mils. The question is do you need the precision or the speed? I use Mildots for my long range target shooting scopes and MOA for my hunting scopes. My precision at 1000 yards on paper isn't good enough to overcome the comparative lack of precision that Mils create. On paper I have no real guilt if I'm off by a few inches but on an animal I want every bit of precision that I can get, I don't want to think that I missed an ethical shot because the equipment wasn't precise enough.

Maybe go to 1/8 MOA turrets then??
 

Formidilosus

Super Moderator
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
8,017
My question was for Formidilosus, he said that MOA is less capable of adjusting for come-ups.

It's good that it was clarified how MOAs and MRADs reflect different numbers of inches but you have to remember that MRADs (Mildots) were developed for the military and the need for fast range adjustments took precedence over precision, if I hit a guy in the chest at 1000 yards it doesn't really matter to me if I hit him in the lungs or the heart, he'll still be out of the game. So yes, MOAs are more precise but you have to turn the knobs more at longer ranges than you with Mils. The question is do you need the precision or the speed? I use Mildots for my long range target shooting scopes and MOA for my hunting scopes. My precision at 1000 yards on paper isn't good enough to overcome the comparative lack of precision that Mils create. On paper I have no real guilt if I'm off by a few inches but on an animal I want every bit of precision that I can get, I don't want to think that I missed an ethical shot because the equipment wasn't precise enough.


Do you understand what the max difference possible is between .25 MOA and .1 mil?
 

Sodbuster

WKR
Joined
Jan 9, 2016
Messages
713
Location
Missouri
I just mounted up a Nightforce SHV 3-10X42 on a friends Brpwning H.C. Creedmoor a few nights ago. Very nice scope.
 

Andy T

FNG
Joined
Sep 29, 2018
Messages
28
Location
Northeast USA
The most important thing is getting a scope where the turrets match the reticle so adjustments are easily made. Once you are comfortable in a certain system (MIL or MOA), just stick with it. One is not better than another.
 
OP
S
Joined
Apr 14, 2018
Messages
566
Well I ended up getting an nxs at a really good deal but not positive I am going to keep it because I really would like ffp. I got it at such a deal that if I really don’t like it I can sell or trade it and not lose anything. Time will tell. Thanks everyone for the replies. Nice to hear from people with more experience than myself


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