6.5 creed and 156gr Bergers

[Miflatlander91]

I had a box of these come in and loaded a few up the other night. After talking to Berger and with the above advice, I loaded 2 per with H4350 at 38.5, 39.0, 39.5, 40.0, and 40.5. Brass is Lapua small primer, primers are CCI BR-4. COAL is 2.815. Barrel is a 22'' Hawk Hill.
Velocities were as follows (ALWAYS WORK UP CAREFULLY IN YOUR OWN RIFLE!)

38.5-2460,2465
39.0-2489,2496
39.5-2542,2521
40.0-2566,2551
40.5-2576,2601

I found no pressure signs at 40.5. Primers are still fully rounded. Bolt lift was easy. For some reason my rifle ejector marks everything, even my really tame loads, so I just watch my primers and bolt lift.
At this point I guess I will keep working up carefully. I'm going to tighten up my charge weight jumps to .2-.3 grains from here on out as I can't imagine I have a long ways to go.
If I can get 2650 I will be quite happy!
OP, if you want me to start my own thread just let me know. I don't want to hijack.

Interested in this I shoot the 140s and 4350 currently but kicked around getting a box 2 try because y not


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[woods89]

I continued working up tonight. Shot 40.7, 40.9, 41.1, and 41.3. I'm going to post a pic of my cases. At 41.3 I am just starting to get a bit of an edge on the primers. Corners are still almost fully round, however. As I posted before, this rifle ejector marks everything, which you can see all the way from 38.5 grains on up. Bolt lift is easy. Velocities as follows. ( WORK UP CAREFULLY IN YOUR OWN RIFLE!)

40.7 2585,2603
40.9 2630,2619
41.1 2632,2610
41.3 2654,2651
40.7 38.5
40.9 39.0
41.1 39.5
41.3 40.0
40.5

I'm open to some advice here. Do you guys see something that alarms you?I'm 1 full grain above Berger's max. 2650 has me pretty happy, and I'm a little leary to keep working up. There is a little flow around the firing pin mark also, but this is a stock Remington bolt and I think the fit is a little loose.

 

[Brent]

I continued working up tonight. Shot 40.7, 40.9, 41.1, and 41.3. I'm going to post a pic of my cases. At 41.3 I am just starting to get a bit of an edge on the primers. Corners are still almost fully round, however. As I posted before, this rifle ejector marks everything, which you can see all the way from 38.5 grains on up. Bolt lift is easy. Velocities as follows. ( WORK UP CAREFULLY IN YOUR OWN RIFLE!)

40.7 2585,2603
40.9 2630,2619
41.1 2632,2610
41.3 2654,2651View attachment 187628
40.7 38.5
40.9 39.0
41.1 39.5
41.3 40.0
40.5

I'm open to some advice here. Do you guys see something that alarms you?I'm 1 full grain above Berger's max. 2650 has me pretty happy, and I'm a little leary to keep working up. There is a little flow around the firing pin mark also, but this is a stock Remington bolt and I think the fit is a little loose.

I'm a little unsure which charges correspond with which cases, but there appears to be a difference in your ejector marks. The cases on the far left are indicating higher pressure. Maybe, it's the lighting. The ES on 41.3 looks good, though. How were the groups.

Another powder to try is RL16, it's burn rate is grain for grain comparable to H4350, but you'll most likely see additional fps. It might just get you to a reliable 2700 fps with the same powder charge and pressure.

 

[tdhanses]

I had a box of these come in and loaded a few up the other night. After talking to Berger and with the above advice, I loaded 2 per with H4350 at 38.5, 39.0, 39.5, 40.0, and 40.5. Brass is Lapua small primer, primers are CCI BR-4. COAL is 2.815. Barrel is a 22'' Hawk Hill.
Velocities were as follows (ALWAYS WORK UP CAREFULLY IN YOUR OWN RIFLE!)

38.5-2460,2465
39.0-2489,2496
39.5-2542,2521
40.0-2566,2551
40.5-2576,2601

I found no pressure signs at 40.5. Primers are still fully rounded. Bolt lift was easy. For some reason my rifle ejector marks everything, even my really tame loads, so I just watch my primers and bolt lift.
At this point I guess I will keep working up carefully. I'm going to tighten up my charge weight jumps to .2-.3 grains from here on out as I can't imagine I have a long ways to go.
If I can get 2650 I will be quite happy!
OP, if you want me to start my own thread just let me know. I don't want to hijack.

Heck no, this is a thread on 156’s and the 6.5cm so you’re post just adds more info.

 

[tdhanses]

I continued working up tonight. Shot 40.7, 40.9, 41.1, and 41.3. I'm going to post a pic of my cases. At 41.3 I am just starting to get a bit of an edge on the primers. Corners are still almost fully round, however. As I posted before, this rifle ejector marks everything, which you can see all the way from 38.5 grains on up. Bolt lift is easy. Velocities as follows. ( WORK UP CAREFULLY IN YOUR OWN RIFLE!)

40.7 2585,2603
40.9 2630,2619
41.1 2632,2610
41.3 2654,2651View attachment 187628
40.7 38.5
40.9 39.0
41.1 39.5
41.3 40.0
40.5

I'm open to some advice here. Do you guys see something that alarms you?I'm 1 full grain above Berger's max. 2650 has me pretty happy, and I'm a little leary to keep working up. There is a little flow around the firing pin mark also, but this is a stock Remington bolt and I think the fit is a little loose.

The firing pin marks look very similar to mine and may just be a sloppy pin if you are not shooting a custom.

 

[woods89]

I'm a little unsure which charges correspond with which cases, but there appears to be a difference in your ejector marks. The cases on the far left are indicating higher pressure. Maybe, it's the lighting. The ES on 41.3 looks good, though. How were the groups.

Another powder to try is RL16, it's burn rate is grain for grain comparable to H4350, but you'll most likely see additional fps. It might just get you to a reliable 2700 fps with the same powder charge and pressure.

I had a magnetospeed on the barrel, and with two shots it was a little hard to tell, as far as groups. My next step will be to shoot some groups without the chrono.
My feeling after shooting is that those loads over 41 grains are pushing the line. 41.3 was bottom left so what you are seeing is likely accurate.
I do think I will file this load away for future elk trips and probaby shoot 140 gr Elite Hunters for deer and steel. I can get close to 2750 with them without pushing it, and it feels a lot easier on my rifle. I'm a 300-400 yd shooter for game so the 140s work quite well. There is a good chance that the 156 EH will be in my rifle for my next elk trip in 2021, though. I will likely continue to work with them a bit, just to get some better info.
If I run into some RL 16 I may pick up a pound.

 

[woods89]

Heck no, this is a thread on 156’s and the 6.5cm so you’re post just adds more info.

Awesome. I love these kind of threads, and your info was very helpful for me.

 

[tdhanses]

Awesome. I love these kind of threads, and your info was very helpful for me.

I’m at 41.8 with RL16 and getting right at 2700ft/s, it’s a sweet spot for my setup.

 

[sram9102]

Not the bullets you guys are running bit I've been working up a load for my 6.5 with 143 eldx's and haven't hit any pressure issues 43 grains of H4350. I'm running 2670ish with a 20" tikka.

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[Brent]

I had a magnetospeed on the barrel, and with two shots it was a little hard to tell, as far as groups. My next step will be to shoot some groups without the chrono.
My feeling after shooting is that those loads over 41 grains are pushing the line. 41.3 was bottom left so what you are seeing is likely accurate.
I do think I will file this load away for future elk trips and probaby shoot 140 gr Elite Hunters for deer and steel. I can get close to 2750 with them without pushing it, and it feels a lot easier on my rifle. I'm a 300-400 yd shooter for game so the 140s work quite well. There is a good chance that the 156 EH will be in my rifle for my next elk trip in 2021, though. I will likely continue to work with them a bit, just to get some better info.
If I run into some RL 16 I may pick up a pound.

I shot a few through mine and got some good data with RL16 in Hornady cases. My sweet spot ended up at 2680 fps at 40.7 grains loaded to the same BTO measurement as my 140 EH load. I could push it higher, but I'm fairly sure I won't make it to the next node without running into pressure. My 140 load is 42 grains of RL16 at 2855 fps.

I'm losing 175 fps with the 156 compared to the 140 with both bullets loaded in the accuracy nodes. This may be an indicator that the 4350 burn rate is best suited for <150 grain bullets. A slower burning powder while seating the 156 closer to the lands to free up some case capacity would probably raise my velocity ceiling.

 

[woods89]

I shot a few through mine and got some good data with RL16 in Hornady cases. My sweet spot ended up at 2680 fps at 40.7 grains loaded to the same BTO measurement as my 140 EH load. I could push it higher, but I'm fairly sure I won't make it to the next node without running into pressure. My 140 load is 42 grains of RL16 at 2855 fps.

I'm losing 175 fps with the 156 compared to the 140 with both bullets loaded in the accuracy nodes. This may be an indicator that the 4350 burn rate is best suited for <150 grain bullets. A slower burning powder while seating the 156 closer to the lands to free up some case capacity would probably raise my velocity ceiling.

Good info. I agree, from what I see, under 150 gr bullets is where H4350 shines. I think at some point I will grab a lb of Reloder 16.

 

[Kimber7man]

Anyone having any luck with the factory Berger 156 loads for the 6.5 creedmoor? My tikka will not shoot these straight. I think the best 3 shot group I got was around 1 moa. The 135 classic load I’m getting .5 moa. I’m thinking I might not be getting high enough velocity to stabilize them.

My 20” Gap likes them. 10 at 100 yards. (It loves the 135 classic load too). Loving this rifle....

 

[Mr. W]

My brother is putting together some of these. He plans on handing me a box to try out. It is a nice trade, I give him my used brass and he gives me some hand loads to test out. Interested to see how these do compared to the ELD 147's.

 

[tdhanses]

Good info. I agree, from what I see, under 150 gr bullets is where H4350 shines. I think at some point I will grab a lb of Reloder 16.

Another thing I’ve found is the 156’s like a lot of jump, I’m .09 off the lands. I highly recommend the Berger guide to seating depth when working these up.

 

[woods89]

I ordered some primers tonight from Reloading Unlimited and they had RL 16 in stock, so I ordered a pound. We will see what that does.
The primers I ordered are CCI 450. Going to try them with these 156's instead of BR-4's, as that is what Berger reccommended.

 

[woods89]

I finally got a chance to shoot some of these with RL16. Brass is Lapua SRP (freshly annealed) and primers are CCI 450.

Loaded up 3 each at 40.5, 40.7, 40.9, 41.1, and 41.3. Interestingly enough, with my small sample size it appears that RL16 and H4350 run within 5-10 fps of each other at each charge weight. What did change is that I have basically zero pressure signs now. Primers are beautifully round. Bolt lift is slick.

I'm quite sure I have room to go up, however, 41.3 gr with each powder has run right at 2650, and with both RL16 and H4350 3 shots have run 3 fps velocity spread. Obviously a larger sample size will be good, but this is noticeably tighter than other charge weights. This load with RL16 put 3 shots in .6'' with Magnetospeed attached off a shaky plastic table so accuracy is quite acceptable. This was my most accurate load of all 5 charge weights. If this is an accuracy node with low ES I certainly am happy. I am doubtful I can catch another node without hitting pressure but who knows. More testing is probably in order.

This load carries 1800 fps to 700+yds depending on environmentals. It will be in my rifle the next time I wind up in the Rockies with an elk tag, and I will be more than comfortable shooting it out to 400 yds or so. I will likely see about shooting a doe this fall with it to gauge terminal performance, although from what I have seen online it does very well.

 

[Mulyhuntr]

I’m at 41.8 with RL16 and getting right at 2700ft/s, it’s a sweet spot for my setup.

Impressive velocity from a 20” tube. I only get 2740 from a 24” tikka superlite with 42.3 rl16 and 147s in Peterson brass.

 

[renagde]

Does anyone have a 7.5 twist 6.5 creedmoor barrel? What kind of affect will that have with the 156?

 

[woods89]

Does anyone have a 7.5 twist 6.5 creedmoor barrel? What kind of affect will that have with the 156?

I'm not an expert, but it would certainly give you some margin as far as bullet stability. When I ordered this barrel, I planned on just shooting 140's so I went with an 8 twist. If I was ordering today I would order a 7.5 twist.

 

[tdhanses]

Impressive velocity from a 20” tube. I only get 2740 from a 24” tikka superlite with 42.3 rl16 and 147s in Peterson brass.

With factory Hornady match 147’s ammo I’m getting 2621, I think I just have a really fast barrel, I also don’t believe the cm drops much in speed with a shorter barrel like some say.