Accuracy

[Cedarsavage]

So I built a rawhide backed bow a month or so back. 60lbs@26. Seems like I have good days and bad for accuracy. Bad is 10" circle at 18-20, good is 6" or less. If I open my groups up 99% of the time I'm hitting an arrow left out of a 3 arrow group. Usually this happens when I get sloppy on string alignment with the arrow (I'm using the fixed crawl). Usually, my first arrow is good, and if I shoot 3 arrows, put it down come back, shoot again, I tend to shoot better. Which is basically how it went down when I switched to a back tension with my wheels. I'm shooting arrows that are ten years old and have been shot out of a few different bows alot over the years. I'm a little concerned about consistency to hunt with this. I want to kill a deer with it, I know I have 6 months to improve but I'm picky about accuracy which is why I always dabble in trad and end up hunting with the compound. Am I being too hard on myself for the present time? Have you guys noticed "self" type bows are a little more difficult to be accurate with? What are most of you guys getting for average group size that hunt with trad?

 

[Poeschel]

Are you shooting at a spot target? If so, try something different. I like to throw random things around the yard, cans, balls...whatever. I find shooting at spots can mess with you if that’s all you do. Clear your head, shoot at something random, don’t use your rangefinder, just shoot. My groups tighten up big time when I put myself in more of a hunting type practice. Unknown yardage. One more thing. If you can’t get comfy at 20, just don’t shoot at an animal at 20. My last 3 whitetail kills were under 10 yards. One on the ground and 2 from a tree, only 8 feet up.

 

[sneaky]

Typical results from being overbowed and not having consistent form. Work on form with lighter weight setups and work your way up to hunting weight.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

[Poeschel]

Typical results from being overbowed and not having consistent form. Work on form with lighter weight setups and work your way up to hunting weight.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

What is hunting weight? I blow through white tails with a 40lb tomahawk longbow.

 

[sneaky]

What is hunting weight? I blow through white tails with a 40lb tomahawk longbow.

According to the OP it's 60#. I never shoot over 50 as it's not needed, especially with my DL. I know people who kill whitetails with 30# bows, but that wouldn't do much on an elk.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

[Poeschel]

According to the OP it's 60#. I never shoot over 50 as it's not needed, especially with my DL. I know people who kill whitetails with 30# bows, but that wouldn't do much on an elk.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

My bad, I misunderstood what you were getting at. I will agree that if the OP is new, 60# is too much weight.

 

[gdpolk]

I read several questions here:

What is an acceptable level of accuracy from a traditional bow for bowhunting?
Figure out at which range you can maintain 90-100% of your shots should be within the kill zone of the animal you intend to pursue. Get 20-25% closer to the animal than this max range for real world hunting. You owe it to the animal to be proficient and ethical.

Should you shoot traditional or compounds?
Do whatever makes you happy and most comfortable. I honestly no longer even own a compound or crossbow. But I watch a lot of animals walk that I would never think twice about with literally ANY other legal weapon to hunt with. I've also never lost one to my longbow. There is no badge of honor for shoooting traditional bows because they are more challenging. The badge of honor is from being a responsible and ethical hunter, regardless of the weapon used.

Are selfbows more challenging to shoot than a more modern construction traditional bow?
No. Consistency produces repeatablity. Having a bow that fits your hands well, good form, and properly tuned arrows is what gives you repeatable accuracy with any traditional archery equipment, regardless of the type or cost. Often you'll find traditional archery enthusiasts go through dozens of bows trying them all out until they settle on one that "just works better" for them because it has more repeatable ergonomics in their hands but the next user may struggle with that same bow.

Good days and bad days...what's up?
This is normal for any athlete of any sport. Sometimes we as humans are simply not as repeatable as a machine. That causes "bad days". Some days we are spot on and have "good days." The key here is when you have bad days, hang it up and don't reinforce the bad behaviors trying to push through. Only practice on good days with good form. It may help to practice with a lower weight bow to build repeatability in form without wearing out the muscles. I'd also STRONGLY encourage you to practice exactly how you hunt. Shooting in the woods at random distances and angles is a world different than shooting at a measured, preset distance over flat ground. Go stump shooting and roving and enjoy the time. Use it as a scouting trip AND a practice session. As you walk and scout, practice going through the woods quietly. Also because your spacing out your shots you'll get more shots in before tiring out and developing those bad habits or those pulled shots 3-5 shots in. This builds both skills AND confidence.

 

[Cedarsavage]

Typical results from being overbowed and not having consistent form. Work on form with lighter weight setups and work your way up to hunting weight.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

So that's kinda what I was wondering. I have a 46lb recurve I shoot much more consistently. I've shot recurves off and on over the years so I'm kinda new I guess. I'm always a little curious of being overbowed, but I have good strength deadlift around 600lbs, can do a bunch of pullups, crossfit etc. Do you guys think it'd be worth retillering and dropping another 5-10 lbs?

 

[Cedarsavage]

I read several questions here:

What is an acceptable level of accuracy from a traditional bow for bowhunting?
Figure out at which range you can maintain 90-100% of your shots should be within the kill zone of the animal you intend to pursue. Get 20-25% closer to the animal than this max range for real world hunting. You owe it to the animal to be proficient and ethical.

Should you shoot traditional or compounds?
Do whatever makes you happy and most comfortable. I honestly no longer even own a compound or crossbow. But I watch a lot of animals walk that I would never think twice about with literally ANY other legal weapon to hunt with. I've also never lost one to my longbow. There is no badge of honor for shoooting traditional bows because they are more challenging. The badge of honor is from being a responsible and ethical hunter, regardless of the weapon used.

Are selfbows more challenging to shoot than a more modern construction traditional bow?
No. Consistency produces repeatablity. Having a bow that fits your hands well, good form, and properly tuned arrows is what gives you repeatable accuracy with any traditional archery equipment, regardless of the type or cost. Often you'll find traditional archery enthusiasts go through dozens of bows trying them all out until they settle on one that "just works better" for them because it has more repeatable ergonomics in their hands but the next user may struggle with that same bow.

Good days and bad days...what's up?
This is normal for any athlete of any sport. Sometimes we as humans are simply not as repeatable as a machine. That causes "bad days". Some days we are spot on and have "good days." The key here is when you have bad days, hang it up and don't reinforce the bad behaviors trying to push through. Only practice on good days with good form. It may help to practice with a lower weight bow to build repeatability in form without wearing out the muscles. I'd also STRONGLY encourage you to practice exactly how you hunt. Shooting in the woods at random distances and angles is a world different than shooting at a measured, preset distance over flat ground. Go stump shooting and roving and enjoy the time. Use it as a scouting trip AND a practice session. As you walk and scout, practice going through the woods quietly. Also because your spacing out your shots you'll get more shots in before tiring out and developing those bad habits or those pulled shots 3-5 shots in. This builds both skills AND confidence.

Helpful response. I'll try stumps tomorrow. I'm definitely guilty of trying to "shoot my way out of a bad day." I got frustrated yesterday and I definitely wasn't mentally as present as I should have been.

 

[Beendare]

I know a guy that was kicked out of Africa for wounding animals with his self made longbow.

Then he went to a self imposed 7 yard limit.....and I dunno how his is doing these days...he was getting up there in age.

Yeah hunting accuracy is where you can hit a 6" spot every time.....I strive for accuracy much better than that.

_____

 

[wytx]

I would take some draw weight off that selfbow. Sounds like a little too much weight for you.
We all pull shots or have a bad release on occasion but you need to have some consistency with your shooting.
Have you tried shooting with your hunting clothes on yet ? The long sleeves and other bundle some layers will affect your draw.

 

[LostArra]

Are selfbows more challenging to shoot than a more modern construction traditional bow?
No. Consistency produces repeatablity.

A selfbow may not be more challenging to just "shoot' but they are definitely more challenging to shoot accurately at a variety of distances. Any traditional 3D shoot will reflect those differences in scores. Limb efficiency varies with selfbows along with options for tuning adjustments. Even a well crafted, well tuned all-natural selfbow will not compare to one of Beendare's ILF rigs when it comes to tuning options and bow efficiency.

Selfbow and compound with a sight? Opposite ends of the efficiency/tuning spectrum.

I agree that selfbows can be very accurate weapons (and almost always more quiet) but when hunting you just need to shorten your shot distances and be able to judge that distance accurately in the field.

Anyone would be frustrated comparing his compound accuracy at 20 yards to his selfbow accuracy regardless of draw weight. Two very different weapons that happen to shoot pointy sticks.

 

[Cedarsavage]

I would take some draw weight off that selfbow. Sounds like a little too much weight for you.
We all pull shots or have a bad release on occasion but you need to have some consistency with your shooting.
Have you tried shooting with your hunting clothes on yet ? The long sleeves and other bundle some layers will affect your draw.

Yeah a bit. I think I’m gonna start retillering tonight and shoot for around 50. Shot a bit this morning and shot better more consistent groups but I feel a little shakier than I’d like at full draw.

 

[North Idaho Stickbow]

Selfbows sure have a lot of appeal to me, but man; I don’t dare take one out to get an animal. Good luck to you! Maybe one day I’ll try it.

 

[Beendare]

A selfbow may not be more challenging to just "shoot' but they are definitely more challenging to shoot accurately at a variety of distances. Any traditional 3D shoot will reflect those differences in scores. Limb efficiency varies with selfbows along with options for tuning adjustments. Even a well crafted, well tuned all-natural selfbow will not compare to one of Beendare's ILF rigs when it comes to tuning options and bow efficiency.

Agreed. There is a big difference between a stick bow with a center shot window...vs a longbow or recurve without.

My ILF bows have a centershot window......its a lot more forgiving of arrow spine.

Having a shoot around riser ups the game a bit........consistent form, perfect arrow selection and many other factors play a part. The degree of difficulty is higher with a shoot around riser. Then add that the self bows without a shelf...ones you shoot off of your finger add a bit more challenge to consistency.

______

 

[Cedarsavage]

Selfbows sure have a lot of appeal to me, but man; I don’t dare take one out to get an animal. Good luck to you! Maybe one day I’ll try it.

I’ve wanted to kill a deer with a complete scratch build since I was a kid. I built this as a practice run since I hadn’t built a bow in about 10 years. I cut an ash tree a couple years ago that was gonna be the stave. That twisted really bad in the drying process so I’m thinking of hunting with this bow for the upcoming season and trying to find someone who will let me cut an ash stave in the meantime. I have some broadheads I made, and some rawhide from this past seasons whitetail that I’d like to use as a backing.

 

[Cedarsavage]

Agreed. There is a big difference between a stick bow with a center shot window...vs a longbow or recurve without.

My ILF bows have a centershot window......its a lot more forgiving of arrow spine.

Having a shoot around riser ups the game a bit........consistent form, perfect arrow selection and many other factors play a part. The degree of difficulty is higher with a shoot around riser. Then add that the self bows without a shelf...ones you shoot off of your finger add a bit more challenge to consistency.

______

That’s kinda what I was asking when I asked if they were harder to be accurate with. It seems like I’ve always had a harder time with the self bows I’ve made than with glass backed

 

[LostArra]

I’ve wanted to kill a deer with a complete scratch build since I was a kid. I built this as a practice run since I hadn’t built a bow in about 10 years. I cut an ash tree a couple years ago that was gonna be the stave. That twisted really bad in the drying process so I’m thinking of hunting with this bow for the upcoming season and trying to find someone who will let me cut an ash stave in the meantime. I have some broadheads I made, and some rawhide from this past seasons whitetail that I’d like to use as a backing.

What arrows are you shooting from your selfbow? Since the trad police don't have you in lockup I assume you're shooting wood shafts which is another challenge in itself with weight, spine, grain orientation all extremely more variable than carbon or aluminum.

Do you have access to an osage stave? It's a tough and forgiving bow wood once it's dry and you get the back down to a nice ring. I'm biased but I would highly recommend it over any white wood I've used (hickory, ash, pecan, hackberry, oak).

Not everyone gets the itch to kill a deer with a bow and arrow you have made yourself. I get it and devoted a couple of seasons until I got it done. I still hunt with my osage selfbow occasionally usually during early season with leaves still on the trees when my chances of a shorter shot are greater. Good luck.

 

[Cedarsavage]

What arrows are you shooting from your selfbow? Since the trad police don't have you in lockup I assume you're shooting wood shafts which is another challenge in itself with weight, spine, grain orientation all extremely more variable than carbon or aluminum.

Do you have access to an osage stave? It's a tough and forgiving bow wood once it's dry and you get the back down to a nice ring. I'm biased but I would highly recommend it over any white wood I've used (hickory, ash, pecan, hackberry, oak).

Not everyone gets the itch to kill a deer with a bow and arrow you have made yourself. I get it and devoted a couple of seasons until I got it done. I still hunt with my osage selfbow occasionally usually during early season with leaves still on the trees when my chances of a shorter shot are greater. Good luck.

Speaking of trad police...I been shooting some 400 spine carbons. It’s what I have and I was trying to avoid spending the money on new shafts. I built an Osage bow from a dimensional piece with a bamboo backing. But never from a stave. I do have a bunch of sinew from the past six or so deer. I’ve entertained the idea of sinew backing and recurving one

 

[gdpolk]

I shoot carbons almost exclusively these days and all I own are trad bows. They are the most consistent in weight and spine, straightest, strongest, most forgiving, and quickest recovering from archers paradox material out there. The lure of the longbow is the simplicity of equipment and enriched experience of the hunt. What shaft material you use doesn't really change that for me, although I do enjoy making wood shafted arrows as a craft.