Anyone loading for Grendel on an AR?

[menhaden_man]

Picked up some dies from a guy on here two weeks ago and started messing with hand loads for my AR15 Grendel (18" stainless, 1:8 twist). Can't seem to get much out of the typical bullets (e.g., 123 grain factory loads)... by not much, I'm talking garbage 3ish MOA 5-shot groups at 100 yards.

I picked up some 90 grain Varmageddon at the hardware store and all of a sudden I'm getting ~1 MOA, sometimes better, over 30.5 g of H335, 2.240" OACL. I'm going to work with that round a little more but sure would like to get a 123 grain bullet to shoot right since I'd like to stack some does with it this fall and my two older kids are starting to shoot it with me in the back yard. Also hear that Varmageddon isn't a wise choice for anything bigger than a coyote. Wondering if the speed is helping, but the 1:8 twist seems counter-intuitive for smaller bullets. Don't know what I'm missing?

Does anyone have some wisdom they can share? I've been reloading 10+ years but would still consider myself pretty amateur compared to some of the guys on here. Thanks for any advice.

 

[orelkaddict]

In my experience its a damn picky caliber to load for!!! I almost gave up on mine before I figured out what it likes, and all of ours (3) like the hot and fast loads to shoot good. If you want I can PM you my load data that's working well.

 

[menhaden_man]

Excellent, PM sent... thanks again.

 

[JRMiller]

I have been using the same length 18" barrel ( a JP Precision) and same twist on one of my ARs for about five years now.
I struggled a bit too with anything 123 as well. I eventually got a "decent" load ( .7moa on good days, typically 1moa though). I dont use that load much though, just never met my expectations.
No go on 123 nosler CCs too. 1.50 moa on a good day.
Trieds some Le Highs too, not great.
Many told me that too small or too large of bullets wouldnt work well. But i tried anyways.
Low and behold i finally got two fantastic smaller loads with Speer 90 TNTs and 107 SMKs, and as crazy as it might sound two fantastic big loads, one with 140 SSTs and the other 143 ELDx.
The two smaller average .5moa. the two larger average .7moa, all very consistently.
I use the 90s/107s for accuracy/long range plinking.
I wont use the 140SSTs for hunting because my range at which the bullet will reliably expand is too short.
The 143 ELDX expands down to 1600 fps though (documented by Hornady), so i might try it as i would have reliable expansion out to 275-300 yards

PM me if you would like any load data

 

[justinspicher]

My 16” Grendel seems to shoot Hornady ammo just fine, even with a can on at 100yds.

 

[doverpack12]

I bought a BCA 18" complete upper in early November. Shot Federal 130 GMM, Hornady 123 ELD-m, AA 129 SST, and Nosler 129 ABLR to get a feel for what it liked. Primary use is intended for wolves and coyote on a ranch I manage predators for. I've loaded 200 something rounds now between load development and shooting because its easy to shoot up some ammo with an AR. I have what appears to be around 04.-0.6 MOA load with 130 Bergers and AR Comp. Also have what appears to be maybe 0.6-0.8 MOA load with 123 ELD-M. Both end up with about the same affective range of 550-600 for reliable expansion and can push out over 1000 if my scope has enough elevation to dial that far. AR-Comp was the first powder I tried after a fair amount of research, IMR 8208 XBR also seems pretty popular, with some CFE 223 followers. One thing that really tightened up groups for me was testing primers. I started working up a ladder for power weight looking for low ES in a node. Then went to seating depth from max mag length to 0.1" deeper in 0.02" increments. Then tried some different primers since I knew I wasn't on the upper pressure end. Some primers open the group and some tighten it. My loads for both are reliably under 15 FPS ES and most time with 5 shots in the single digits. Currently working on a 129 ABLR load because that bullet expands down to 1300 FPS and have what so far has shown to be a 1 fps ES load matching 130 Berger charge (pretty common for those two bullets in grendel to match charge weight) but the group was too large for me in the 1.5" range so going to play with seating and see if it will close down under 3/4". I really think there is something to finding the primer/powder/cartridge combo that your rifle likes. Haven't messed with that much until the Unknown Munitions threads and Robby's 270 WSM thread came up on here a little while ago but so far it has proven affective.

 

[justinspicher]

Dialed in the 12” Grendel with my can using Hornady 123gr Frontier rounds.

 

[menhaden_man]

I bought a BCA 18" complete upper in early November. Shot Federal 130 GMM, Hornady 123 ELD-m, AA 129 SST, and Nosler 129 ABLR to get a feel for what it liked. Primary use is intended for wolves and coyote on a ranch I manage predators for. I've loaded 200 something rounds now between load development and shooting because its easy to shoot up some ammo with an AR. I have what appears to be around 04.-0.6 MOA load with 130 Bergers and AR Comp. Also have what appears to be maybe 0.6-0.8 MOA load with 123 ELD-M. Both end up with about the same affective range of 550-600 for reliable expansion and can push out over 1000 if my scope has enough elevation to dial that far. AR-Comp was the first powder I tried after a fair amount of research, IMR 8208 XBR also seems pretty popular, with some CFE 223 followers. One thing that really tightened up groups for me was testing primers. I started working up a ladder for power weight looking for low ES in a node. Then went to seating depth from max mag length to 0.1" deeper in 0.02" increments. Then tried some different primers since I knew I wasn't on the upper pressure end. Some primers open the group and some tighten it. My loads for both are reliably under 15 FPS ES and most time with 5 shots in the single digits. Currently working on a 129 ABLR load because that bullet expands down to 1300 FPS and have what so far has shown to be a 1 fps ES load matching 130 Berger charge (pretty common for those two bullets in grendel to match charge weight) but the group was too large for me in the 1.5" range so going to play with seating and see if it will close down under 3/4". I really think there is something to finding the primer/powder/cartridge combo that your rifle likes. Haven't messed with that much until the Unknown Munitions threads and Robby's 270 WSM thread came up on here a little while ago but so far it has proven affective.

Any suggestions on primers? I’ve probably overlooked primers to be honest. I’ve got a pile of CCI 400s, but I think the 450s are the ticket (all out and so is the hardware store). I’ve got some of those AR Match primers so will give this a shot next.

Are you loading hot in general? Mine seems to like speed better than bullets, though I’m not very far into goofing around. I’ve got H335, CFE223, and Benchmark... might as well try some AR comp .

Also curious if you’re loading to overall or ogive length. Thanks again... a fun round for sure and my kids can shoulder it too.

 

[menhaden_man]

Dialed in the 12” Grendel with my can using Hornady 123gr Frontier rounds. View attachment 179710

That’ll work! 12” and a can is pretty slick for that round. I’ve got a Liberty Mystic X I was gonna try on mine once I’ve got a solid round set up.

 

[justinspicher]

I am extremely pleased with it so far. Palmetto State Armory has the complete upper on sale with free shipping so I snagged one. It comes with an adjustable gas block as well, which was already set and ready to go, even with my can on it.

 

[menhaden_man]

I am extremely pleased with it so far. Palmetto State Armory has the complete upper on sale with free shipping so I snagged one. It comes with an adjustable gas block as well, which was already set and ready to go, even with my can on it.

What can are you using?

 

[justinspicher]

I have a Silencerco Omega.

 

[doverpack12]

Any suggestions on primers? I’ve probably overlooked primers to be honest. I’ve got a pile of CCI 400s, but I think the 450s are the ticket (all out and so is the hardware store). I’ve got some of those AR Match primers so will give this a shot next.

Are you loading hot in general? Mine seems to like speed better than bullets, though I’m not very far into goofing around. I’ve got H335, CFE223, and Benchmark... might as well try some AR comp .

Also curious if you’re loading to overall or ogive length. Thanks again... a fun round for sure and my kids can shoulder it too.

mine liked CCI BR4 the most. I’ve read mostly 450 or BR4 and some Winchester. I tried CCI 41 and fed 205 match AR as well.
I wouldn’t say I’m loading hot as I never hit what I would call pressure and I’m not at the top of my ladders. Running 2390 fps with 130 Berger and 2560 fps with 123 ELD with 20” barrel and VG6 break. At those speeds I don’t think either has a noticeable advantage toward maximum usable range based on velocity and expansion. Still planning to stretch them out to decide which to go with and mess with the 129 ABLR more as well.
I always load based on ogive, but because of the mags I did set my first seating depth at max coal mag length after I confirmed I would be out of the lands there. Worked-backwards from there after I had a powder charge selected.

 

[Dmtindell]

In my experience its a damn picky caliber to load for!!! I almost gave up on mine before I figured out what it likes, and all of ours (3) like the hot and fast loads to shoot good. If you want I can PM you my load data that's working well.

Any chance I could get the load data your talking about. I have a couple grendels. One with a 20" proof barrel, I can tell it wants to shoot good but I just cant find the right load!!??

 

[FLS]

123 SMK over 28.0 8208 in Hornady brass lit by a BR4 gave me best results out of a 24” gasser.
123 Amax factory loads were so good I didn’t do a lot of load development.

 

[menhaden_man]

123 SMK over 28.0 8208 in Hornady brass lit by a BR4 gave me best results out of a 24” gasser.
123 Amax factory loads were so good I didn’t do a lot of load development.

What length are you loading them to? Any idea on velocity? Asking because I've got a 3 or 4 other powders that'll work in the Grendel that I'd like to burn before jumping to another. Thanks for the advice.

 

[FLS]

Loaded to mag length. 2.260”. Approx 2600, I think, don’t have ballistic profile in this phone anymore. I loaded 107 SMK over TAC, but they never shot as well as the 123s.

 

[razorsharptokill]

130 Gr. Sierrra TGK over 27.0 gr of TAC. 1/2 MOA out of my Palmetto upper.

 

[menhaden_man]

130 Gr. Sierrra TGK over 27.0 gr of TAC. 1/2 MOA out of my Palmetto upper.

Are you loading to mag length?

 

[razorsharptokill]

Are you loading to mag length?

2.260"View attachment 259034