Archery Hunter Killed by ML Hunter

TheTone

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terrible, preventable situation. A loss all the way around.

One of the areas I have elk hunted in Idaho has a rifle cow hunt that overlaps part of archery season. It has always been a concern of mine in certain areas. I’ve had rifle cow hunters walking in to my calling before and when I realized it I always quit calling and tried to make my way out of the area safely. I hate the overlap part and would love to see it disappear
 

txhunter581

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True. But there are some units that have no point restrictions

So many details that are unknown
This happened in unit 71. There is a 4 point rule for elk. So an E/S tag would not mean any ek was legal.

Not sure if a decoy was used and possibly played a part in this tragedy, but I think any decoy used should have blaze orange in it.
 

orionthehunter1

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This happened in unit 71. There is a 4 point rule for elk. So an E/S tag would not mean any ek was legal.

Not sure if a decoy was used and possibly played a part in this tragedy, but I think any decoy used should have blaze orange in it.
Unconfirmed but some locals are saying the archer did have a bow mounted decoy. Not saying it should have happened but I could at least understand it a little more if the guy only saw the decoy and mistook it for a live elk which could be possible at a further distance and certain light
 

Billy Goat

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I remember a guy years ago going on about how realistic blow up dolls have gotten, said they were real realistic. He was dead serious.



I'm not saying that as a joke, but when you are looking for an elk, every snapped branch is an elk, when you come face to face with an elk, it's an elk, even if it's a decoy.


I'm not certain they issue E/S tags for muzzleloader in that area, but if they do a decoy seems like it could have really lead to a bad situation.



This is just a horrible situation for all involved, at first I thought possibly it was an argument over a dead elk escalated, seems now that isn't the case, but still not many facts out.


One fact is a hunter isn't returning home, and another might or might not be but his life changed forever.
Prayers for both.



Also remember, lots of people think something can't or won't happen until it does.
 

woods89

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Why put your crosshairs on something that you are unsure of? Isn't that exactly what your post is saying not to do?
That's a fair point, and you're making me think about my practices, which is good.

We had jumped a group of bulls out of a little saddle. They weren't badly spooked and headed up the other side of the saddle and stopped. I had a line on one of them, but I didn't know which one as they were in and out of timber before they stopped. I knew it was not only an elk, but a bull, and I just wanted that last confirmation of 4 points before I sent a bullet, even though I was 90%+ sure it was.

Had I had any inkling that it could be something other than an elk I would have acted in a more conservative manner. In retrospect perhaps that account was a bit of a tangent from the subject of this thread, although it's probably a good discussion to have.
 

sndmn11

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That's a fair point, and you're making me think about my practices, which is good.

I think that is one of those actions that is a gateway to bad habits. Aren't we taught not to cover something with our muzzle we are absolutely sure we want to destroy?

I talked to a customer a few years ago who had a quality mule deer tag and said that he got over the jitters when he was younger by dry firing on game. Turns out on this several point hunt he ended up shooting the first deer he saw, a small buck that ate great. Want to guess how it ended up being shot?
 

woods89

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I think that is one of those actions that is a gateway to bad habits. Aren't we taught not to cover something with our muzzle we are absolutely sure we want to destroy?

I talked to a customer a few years ago who had a quality mule deer tag and said that he got over the jitters when he was younger by dry firing on game. Turns out on this several point hunt he ended up shooting the first deer he saw, a small buck that ate great. Want to guess how it ended up being shot?
I can easily see how the "dry firing "incident could happen, and agree, that's probably not a good idea.

As far as the situation I had, I felt very comfortable with it at the time, as someone who thinks about safety quite a bit. That said, I do find that as time goes on I act with more and more caution around firearms, and I agree that one should be very careful where that muzzle points.

Good luck with your hunts this year!
 

Where's Bruce?

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If someone mathed out the hunter shoots hunter in Colorado September hunting seasons base on personal recreation days, the percentage would come out to probably far less than .000001% chance.

The only thing that would have prevented this from occuring would have been for the person who pulled the trigger to have been the only person in the woods that day, or for them not be allowed in the woods. That person chose to shoot for whatever reason, and the victim's hunting weapon had nothing to do with that.

Are you really this dumb? The only thing that would have prevented this from occurring would have been for the person who pulled the trigger to have exercised common sense with gun safety. The victim's hunting weapon (archery using a deek) had everything to do with this horror. ML hunters should not be allowed to share the same season/unit for elk as archers. Separate em somehow. Learn from these awful events.
 

crich

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Unconfirmed but some locals are saying the archer did have a bow mounted decoy. Not saying it should have happened but I could at least understand it a little more if the guy only saw the decoy and mistook it for a live elk which could be possible at a further distance and certain light
Ive always thought bow mounted decoys were a little sketchy for this reason.
 

sndmn11

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Are you really this dumb? The only thing that would have prevented this from occurring would have been for the person who pulled the trigger to have exercised common sense with gun safety. The victim's hunting weapon (archery using a deek) had everything to do with this horror. ML hunters should not be allowed to share the same season/unit for elk as archers. Separate em somehow. Learn from these awful events.

How am I dumb? I did the math for you.

A person doesn't one single time handle their firearm dangerously and have it result poorly. The shooter did not identify his target, assuming he did not plan to shoot the other person, and that is the result of not doing so repeatedly to the point of it becoming a bad habit. At some point in time the poor safety practices of the shooter would have had the same outcome whether it was a muzzleloader only season, a rifle only, a shotgun only, etc.
The guy shot a bipedal 200lb person instead of a four legged 600lb brown and tan ungulate. They don't look anything alike or behave the same.

As you put it, common sense; one person's lack of it should not negate hundreds of thousands of man hours yearly where September Colorado hunters are not shooting each other. The punishment should lie souly in the hands of the shooter and should not be socialized.
 

3forks

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How am I dumb? I did the math for you.

A person doesn't one single time handle their firearm dangerously and have it result poorly. The shooter did not identify his target, assuming he did not plan to shoot the other person, and that is the result of not doing so repeatedly to the point of it becoming a bad habit. At some point in time the poor safety practices of the shooter would have had the same outcome whether it was a muzzleloader only season, a rifle only, a shotgun only, etc.
The guy shot a bipedal 200lb person instead of a four legged 600lb brown and tan ungulate. They don't look anything alike or behave the same.

As you put it, common sense; one person's lack of it should not negate hundreds of thousands of man hours yearly where September Colorado hunters are not shooting each other. The punishment should lie souly in the hands of the shooter and should not be socialized.
Agreed.

The actions of one irresponsible person should not be the catalyst for knee jerk reactions, and to me, this is the same thing as those who argue for gun control.

I called out someone on this forum a while back because they said they used the scope on their rifle to watch some guys that killed an elk he was trying to stalk. I was amazed at how many people on that thread liked his post and seemed to think he did nothing wrong by scoping the other hunters.

Just as in life, you’re going to have a certain percentage of hunters that are irresponsible and unsafe out there the same as you would come across bad parents, drunk drivers, morons, etc.
 

Gerbdog

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Sad, truly tragic and avoidable, near where i was at this past weekend also, i always leave the decoy in the truck during ML season here in CO. If it costs me an elk fine, ill come back and try again next year, but i dont trust stupid in the woods and ive seen enough stupid in the woods to know its not worth the risk. Heck i try to avoid hunting during ML season anyway ... but its been a tough year and the elk arent cooperating with me.
 

sndmn11

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I called out someone on this forum a while back because they said they used the scope on their rifle to watch some guys that killed an elk he was trying to stalk. I was amazed at how many people on that thread liked his post and seemed to think he did nothing wrong by scoping the other hunters.

Exactly, unsafe practices lead to accidents of life and limb or the legal kind. Just like above with crosshairs on an animal one isn't sure is legal.
 

NB7

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Why put your crosshairs on something that you are unsure of? Isn't that exactly what your post is saying not to do?
I think he's saying he already had it identified as a bull, he was only verifying antler points for legality. I don't see anything wrong with that
 

sndmn11

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I think he's saying he already had it identified as a bull, he was only verifying antler points for legality. I don't see anything wrong with that

Would standard practice when you get home from work be to draw your pistol and point it at your wife until you can identify she isn't an imposter?

The bullet goes where the crosshairs are. If the legality of an animal has not been identified, why on earth would the crosshairs be on it? It is not a target until it is absolutely identified and verified. That is how things get shot that aren't supposed to be shot like people, or moose instead of elk, or cows instead of bulls, or spikes instead of raghorns.

Don't aim at something you are not certain you want to destroy. Making exceptions to that rule turns hypotheticals into reality. How many tragic stories start with, "But, I...", or, "I was only just...", or, "I do it all the time..."?
 

rideold

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I thought using your rifle scope to identify/watch was against game regulations. I have always worked under the idea that your binos/spotter are used to identify/find/glass/watch etc. and the rifle scope is used only when taking a shot.
 

AZ_Hunter_2000

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Sad, truly tragic and avoidable, near where i was at this past weekend also, i always leave the decoy in the truck during ML season here in CO. If it costs me an elk fine, ill come back and try again next year, but i dont trust stupid in the woods and ive seen enough stupid in the woods to know its not worth the risk. Heck i try to avoid hunting during ML season anyway ... but its been a tough year and the elk arent cooperating with me.
I think he's saying he already had it identified as a bull, he was only verifying antler points for legality. I don't see anything wrong with that
Folks should buy binoculars that at least match, if not exceed, the optical clarity of their rifle scope. Much safer for all parties involved (except the target species).
 
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