Are Carbon barrels more “picky” than steel for factory ammo?

[Navyhunter]

Hey all, new to the forum, appreciate all the great advice on here!

I’m putting together a custom rifle build for long(ish) range out west hunting and I’ve had several reputable people in the industry tell me that if you’re not handloading, steel barrels tend to be less picky than carbon for factory ammo (even high quality factory). They said this was especially evident in magnum calibers. I want a 300 WM.

I have 3 kids 4 and under so unfortunately no time for hand loading at this point…

Does anyone have experience with this?

Thanks!!

 

[amassi]

Nonsense

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[Navyhunter]

I have a Proof Carbon barrel on my primary hunting rifle, which is a 7mm remington mag. I don’t have time to reload, and factory ammo is no problem.

Here’s a 21-shot aggregate from 7 consecutive range trips. Intent was to document repeatability of suppressor. Even with that extra variable, E.S. was about 3/4 MOA(ish)

https://www.rokslide.com/forums/threads/atf-form-1-6-5-creedmoor-suppressor.236041/post-2295583

That’s some great shooting. Thanks for the real world experience!

 

[BRTreedogs]

Whoever told you that doesn't have any idea what they are talking about.
Just tell the builder what brand of ammo you want to shoot. So they chamber it Sammi instead of longer for the high bc bullets most hand loaders want to shoot.

You can also have @Unknown Munitions build some ammo for you.

 

[Ryan Avery]

I have not witnessed this generally a bad barrel won't shoot anything particularly well.

I did have a conversation with a very reputable gunsmith a few months ago. He told me if he had a hundred quality steel barrels, maybe one wouldn't shoot. If he had a hundred carbon barrels, he would have six or seven that wouldn't shoot to his standard. He didn't have an answer to why.


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[Ucsdryder]

I have not witnessed this generally a bad barrel won't shoot anything particularly well.

I did have a conversation with a very reputable gunsmith a few months ago. He told me if he had a hundred quality steel barrels, maybe one wouldn't shoot. If he had a hundred carbon barrels, he would have six or seven that wouldn't shoot to his standard. He didn't have an answer to why.


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I read aomewhere that the process of putting a carbon wrap on a barrel required heat and sometimes the heat changes the diameter of the steel while wrapping the barrel with CF. Similar to heating a stuck nut on a bolt. The steel reacts to heat. Someone tell me I’m full of crap because I very well could be!!!

 

[DangerRanger]

I doubt anyone has a valid experiment to make claims like that. Sound alike something someone heard and spread along or something someone decided was true after having a picky carbon barrel.

And I’m a carbon “hater”

 

[Navyhunter]

I doubt anyone has a valid experiment to make claims like that. Sound alike something someone heard and spread along or something someone decided was true after having a picky carbon barrel.

And I’m a carbon “hater”

Can I ask why you are a “hater”?

 

[DangerRanger]

Can I ask why you are a “hater”?

Hater probably isn’t the correct term. I think they are 400$ extra to look cool. Mine shot fine, it did nothing better than a #4 or fluted #5

It deflected just as much with a can on it, it shot fine. It had noticeable mirage which I guess is “wicking heat” but imo heavy mirage may be worse for practical accuracy than heated barrel. And niether is really a problem within hunting round counts.

But if you think it looks cool sure. I paid my gunsmith a boat load to hand polish all the stainless on my hunting rifle because it looks cool.

 

[SDHNTR]

Hogwash! Ammo preference doesn’t discriminate between steel or carbon. Besides, there’s steel at the core of that carbon anyways.

 

[Navyhunter]

Hater probably isn’t the correct term. I think they are 400$ extra to look cool. Mine shot fine, it did nothing better than a #4 or fluted #5

It deflected just as much with a can on it, it shot fine. It had noticeable mirage which I guess is “wicking heat” but imo heavy mirage may be worse for practical accuracy than heated barrel. And niether is really a problem within hunting round counts.

But if you think it looks cool sure. I paid my gunsmith a boat load to hand polish all the stainless on my hunting rifle because it looks cool.

Thanks! Yeah, I’d be lying if I didn’t admit trying to make it look cool is half the fun.

 

[DangerRanger]

Nothing wrong with your rifles looking cool

 

[SDHNTR]

Thanks! Yeah, I’d be lying if I didn’t admit trying to make it look cool is half the fun.

Steel barreled rifles look cool too!

 

[Navyhunter]

Steel barreled rifles look cool too!

Totally agree!

 

[Navyhunter]

Steel barreled rifles look cool too!

That’s actually half my debate while putting the rifle together. I love the look of a cerakote steel barrel (maybe even more than the look of carbon) but the weight savings of carbon is really nice. I know you can put a deep flute or get a pencil barrel, but I like the look/performance of a thicker steel barrel.

 

[Wapiti1]

I read aomewhere that the process of putting a carbon wrap on a barrel required heat and sometimes the heat changes the diameter of the steel while wrapping the barrel with CF. Similar to heating a stuck nut on a bolt. The steel reacts to heat. Someone tell me I’m full of crap because I very well could be!!!

Nah. Pre-preg carbon cures at 275-300F and typically is held for an hour with a controlled cool. Too low to do anything to steel. You'd need to hit at least 450F for at least 45 minutes to get the steel to do anything, and that would only be stress relief. No warping, recrystallization, phase changes, etc at those low temps.

The CF used is also chosen to match the thermal growth characteristics of the steel, so they don't fight each other in use.

That said, you're doing a lot of machining to a steel barrel in order to wrap it. Then you are wrapping it. All additional steps that can introduce error. And the barrel you started with matters too. With that logic, the hit rate would naturally be lower for carbon wrap. It is for light contour all steel barrels too because no bore is perfectly centered the entire length, and machining can create issues. So can fluting.

But you are buying a small batch, high attention to detail product, so I wouldn't worry about it. I'd worry about weight, length, twist and how you want it finished.

Jeremy

 

[Ucsdryder]

Nah. Pre-preg carbon cures at 275-300F and typically is held for an hour with a controlled cool. Too low to do anything to steel. You'd need to hit at least 450F for at least 45 minutes to get the steel to do anything, and that would only be stress relief. No warping, recrystallization, phase changes, etc at those low temps.

The CF used is also chosen to match the thermal growth characteristics of the steel, so they don't fight each other in use.

That said, you're doing a lot of machining to a steel barrel in order to wrap it. Then you are wrapping it. All additional steps that can introduce error. And the barrel you started with matters too. With that logic, the hit rate would naturally be lower for carbon wrap. It is for light contour all steel barrels too because no bore is perfectly centered the entire length, and machining can create issues. So can fluting.

But you are buying a small batch, high attention to detail product, so I wouldn't worry about it. I'd worry about weight, length, twist and how you want it finished.

Jeremy

Dang it…as usual I had no idea wtf I was talking about!

 

[Wapiti1]

Dang it…as usual I had no idea wtf I was talking about!

It's not exactly common information. I make steel for a living.

Jeremy

 

[762 ULTRAMAGA]

I had serious issues with the one CF barrel I owned, after that I called sever barrel makers that also offer CF.
They all said what Ryan eluded to, there's more chance of cf wrapped barrels having issues.
The way I understood it was that the pencil thin blank can have stress induced during wrapping and actualy cause variations in bore diameter as well.
Bartlein is the safest bet but pretty much saves zero weight

 

[roosiebull]

Hogwash! Ammo preference doesn’t discriminate between steel or carbon.

#carbonbarrelsmatter