Argali Alpine 20° vs SG Chilkoot 15°

[Gooden123]

I'm buying a new bag before heading to the Brooks Range late August. Torn between these two mostly because I have the SG Grumman pants/jacket which I love.

On the other side, I'm aware Brad is an active member and his bags are comfort rated. I think the Alpine is a couple ounces lighter than the Chilkoot as well.

I've tried to get a 10% code off Argali's site but it's not coming thru to 2 different email addresses (not in spam either) and 2 different phone numbers. Maybe bc it's the weekend? I'm trying to at least order a Carbon Magnacut, Serac Carbon, Dream Pillow, some small items and possibly the bag. Otherwise I can get the Chilkoot for $170 off retail ($480 vs $650)

I've been backpacking a long time and am aware of WM, FF, etc. They're great, no need to go there.

Thanks!

 

[Snowhunter11]

I also like my SG Grumman.. I have used the chillkoot 15f for a little over a year now and can say it is all of a 15f degree bag. Would likely get you to 0f with your coat and pants on. I would guess I have ~20-25 days at 10-40f nights. So far a happy camper.
Pros-
-It dries wet clothes at night well.
-warm and true comfort rating (for me)
-packs small and fairly lightweight
-down
Cons-
-Is a fairly tight fit(not for everyone) I am 6ft 190. I wouldn’t mind more room however I prefer to carry less weight on my back..
-down (some say this is not for wet environments I haven’t experienced this so I cannot say with certainty)

Also may I add the pad you choose is just as important for cold weather performance. I run a thermarest neoair nxt. A good 4 season pad with a fair R value is a must. Don’t ask me how I know.. I recommend testing your bag/pad in a similar temp to your expected temp at home if possible as well. Then you know what to expect and have near you when you sleep.

Unfortunately no experience with the argali. Best of luck with your search/purchase.

 

[Gooden123]

I also like my SG Grumman.. I have used the chillkoot 15f for a little over a year now and can say it is all of a 15f degree bag. Would likely get you to 0f with your coat and pants on. I would guess I have ~20-25 days at 10-40f nights. So far a happy camper.
Pros-
-It dries wet clothes at night well.
-warm and true comfort rating (for me)
-packs small and fairly lightweight
-down
Cons-
-Is a fairly tight fit(not for everyone) I am 6ft 190. I wouldn’t mind more room however I prefer to carry less weight on my back..
-down (some say this is not for wet environments I haven’t experienced this so I cannot say with certainty)

Also may I add the pad you choose is just as important for cold weather performance. I run a thermarest neoair nxt. A good 4 season pad with a fair R value is a must. Don’t ask me how I know.. I recommend testing your bag/pad in a similar temp to your expected temp at home if possible as well. Then you know what to expect and have near you when you sleep.

Unfortunately no experience with the argali. Best of luck with your search/purchase.

Excellent information. I love this forum. I'm 6'1 and 150 so pretty much a stick. I think that's why I sleep pretty cold too.

I'm pretty sure my pad is part of my problem but I'm hoping to get thru this hunt with it and a warmer bag. Currently I have a Nemo Tensor insulated but I think the R Value is only around 2.

My bag is a Thermarest Questar 20 and I think it was a failure trying to make a light, warm bag by "body mapping". Basically some areas have more down. So it has cold spots all over.

 

[98XJRC]

I use the SG Chilkoot 15 as well. I have no doubts that with the right clothing this bag will get you closer to zero. Most of my use is in the PA mountains in November and December. Temps are typically sub freezing with many nights being below 20. Typically we are in a valley a hundred yards from a stream, so the humidity levels are typically higher. I haven't had any moisture related issues with the bag or issues in general with it. With the combination of my Thermarest NeoAir Xtherm (I believe is has an R-7 rating) I sleep very comfortably in the bag.

My recommendation for most is to upgrade to a higher R value pad before searching for a warmer bag. The pad makes a bigger difference then most want to admit.

The Argali bag honestly reminds be a lot for the SG Chilkoot. I have no doubt that it's a great bag and it would have been on my list to check out if I didn't have the SG. For reference I'm 6'1" 200 lbs and feel as though the SG bag has plenty of space particularly for a mummy bag.

 

[cornfedkiller]

No experience with the Argali, but have used the Chilkoot 15 for a couple years now. As others have said, it's pretty warm. I have never had it down to 15, but I've slept in it in the mid 30s several times and was perfectly fine in just boxers (no base layers)

I'm 5'9", 190 and don't have any complaints about space in the bag.

My only complaints is I wish the zipper went all the way down rather than 3/4", and I wish they came in different lengths because the 6'5" length of the bag makes for a lot of bunched up material at my feet.

The Argali looks almost identical - same baffle design, Pertex fabric, zipper, etc. I have no doubt its a great bag as well!

 

[BGNRSLK]

I would like to add my name to the hat to vouch for the Chillkoot 15.

I have used it primarily with a 3.8 R value pad now for about 2 years. I have used it from 10-55 degrees (I had to use it like a blanket). Never any issues with it, packs down well and is light.

I am a warm sleeper and with just a grid flex top and long-John esque bottom layer I was pleasantly warm at 10 degrees. If you had to add down layers you could totally get down to 0 degrees. I’d need some down booties for sure but I’d trust the bag.

 

[Gooden123]

I would like to add my name to the hat to vouch for the Chillkoot 15.

I have used it primarily with a 3.8 R value pad now for about 2 years. I have used it from 10-55 degrees (I had to use it like a blanket). Never any issues with it, packs down well and is light.

I am a warm sleeper and with just a grid flex top and long-John esque bottom layer I was pleasantly warm at 10 degrees. If you had to add down layers you could totally get down to 0 degrees. I’d need some down booties for sure but I’d trust the bag.

Oh sweet thanks! That was my next concern (being too hot) which would make me go for the Argali although only a 5° difference. It does have less fill. I rarely subject myself to anything below 20° but keep in mind I get cold easily. I'm still torn what to do but I think I'm comparing two identical bags in just about every way/spec.

Kind of leaning towards Argali because of some things Brad recently helped me out on without pushing their products on me. I also like trying different brands as long as I'm confident it won't be a mistake.

Thanks again

 

[WeiserBucks]

I've been backpacking a long time and am aware of WM, FF, etc. They're great, no need to go there.

Thanks!

Curious as to why you'd dismiss FF and WM?

 

[Gooden123]

Curious as to why you'd dismiss FF and WM?

I'm not at all in a negative way. They aren't in the same price range right now. The 2 bags mentioned are both under $500 right now

 

[Isildur]

I have a 27 year old WM - I believe it’s an Apache. It’s been well used and loved in backpacking and car camping and is every bit as functional as when it was new. It’s rated for 15F but I’ve slept in it close to 5F with a good base layer on. I would buy another one of their bags in a heartbeat.

 

[Gingerbeardman26]

I'm not at all in a negative way. They aren't in the same price range right now. The 2 bags mentioned are both under $500 right now

Where are you finding Argali bags for under $500? The FF Swift YF 20 is $539 and the Swift UL 20 is $639 both for regular length. They are almost identical to the Argali in weight and made in the USA. These are the widest mummy style bags they make. The wide Flickr bags, which I have used for a few years now, are under $500 and pretty versatile. I really like Argali and Stone Glacier stuff, but I don’t see the value in their sleeping bags for being made overseas.

 

[Gooden123]

Where are you finding Argali bags for under $500? The FF Swift YF 20 is $539 and the Swift UL 20 is $639 both for regular length. They are almost identical to the Argali in weight and made in the USA. These are the widest mummy style bags they make. The wide Flickr bags, which I have used for a few years now, are under $500 and pretty versatile. I really like Argali and Stone Glacier stuff, but I don’t see the value in their sleeping bags for being made overseas.

I actually looked into FF and WM again after posting this. For some reason I thought they were around $700.

I have GovX so I get discounts from pretty much everyone worth their salt in the hunting industry. Argali comes to 497.25 from Gohunt.com. Just answering your question, but I definitely hear what you're saying about everything.

 

[Gingerbeardman26]

I didn’t intend to sound combative, and I’m not suggesting that the Argali and Stone Glacier bags aren’t good quality. I was simply pointing out the price disparity isn’t what people think it is, at least as far as FF bags go, especially when you consider materials and country of origin. In the case of the bags I mentioned, I feel like they are an apples to apples comparison to the Argali.

 

[Gooden123]

I didn’t intend to sound combative, and I’m not suggesting that the Argali and Stone Glacier bags aren’t good quality. I was simply pointing out the price disparity isn’t what people think it is, at least as far as FF bags go, especially when you consider materials and country of origin. In the case of the bags I mentioned, I feel like they are an apples to apples comparison to the Argali.

No sir I didn't take it as combative. I'm here for this kind of advice. I'm pretty much strictly a bow hunter and my season is from August till the middle/end of November. All of these bags will be a serious upgrade for me and more than adequate. I'm just tired of being cold in my Thermarest Questar 20 which is a 32° comfort rated bag with 'body mapping'.. it has cold spots all over it bc they tried to put the fill in strategic areas to cut weight I guess. Or maybe cost. Either way it sucks and isn't coming to Alaska.

 

[doverpack12]

I have a chilkoot 15 and couldn’t be happier with it. I’m fairly big at 6’1” and broad shoulders, 225. Not many people make me look small. The chilkoot has significantly more room than the cut of most other bags. Too warm most of the time but the part nobody gives enough credit to is the fabric on the SG down products having a Y yarn shape which creates very good wind resistance. Most don’t appreciate that until you’ve froze all night with the wind blowing through your bag.

I’m sure the argali is great but I can tell you the SG is going to be very hard to beat.

Features I could appreciate are arm holes and a center zip. Those make a big difference for me especially getting up and ready in the morning. Just add a lot of comfort and help keep you mentally focused.

 

[199p]

I would replace my pad 1st. Get something with a good r value and ull prob find your bag is fine

 

[Gooden123]

I would replace my pad 1st. Get something with a good r value and ull prob find your bag is fine

The R Value on my pad is 5.4 . They made some changes around the years I bought my Tensor. That should be plenty. Either way I know I need a new bag.

 

[LongWayAround]

I'm 5'8" 200-210 and I'm a side sleeper. I have no complaints with the space in my chilkoot 15 and find it very warm. I have slept in my truck bed (under a topper but no window) down to single digit temperatures.

Argali Brad's video with down and water was cool and removed any concerns I would have about untreated down in wet weather.

I use an insulated Nemo tensor as my air pad, often paired with a closed-cell foam pad.

I think it's probably a wash between Argali and Stone Glacier, but I'm not sure how the dimensions compare.

 

[Gooden123]

I'm 5'8" 200-210 and I'm a side sleeper. I have no complaints with the space in my chilkoot 15 and find it very warm. I have slept in my truck bed (under a topper but no window) down to single digit temperatures.

Argali Brad's video with down and water was cool and removed any concerns I would have about untreated down in wet weather.

I use an insulated Nemo tensor as my air pad, often paired with a closed-cell foam pad.

I think it's probably a wash between Argali and Stone Glacier, but I'm not sure how the dimensions compare.

Thanks I'll definitely check it out and agree it's a wash. I think I'm going with Argali in hopes it's not quite as warm. I'll never be in below 20° conditions on purpose and if I am, I'll put on the Grummans or something.

I'll definitely check out the video. I've seen other tests where the natural oils in certain downs is adequate so I'm already a believer. Have you ever seen the YT video where a US Special Forces team tests out the Grumman and Chilkoot in a drill? They jump in icy waters in Montana then get in the Grummans, then in the Chilkoot to dry off and warm up. Or something to that effect. That's what sold me on the Grumman.

 

[LongWayAround]

@Gooden123 I have seen that video. It was very enlightening.

I would roast if I wore the Grumman jacket in the Chilkoot. That sucker is warm!