Axis vs Victory - the FOC bandwagon

[Billy Goat]

I too just made the switch from Axis 300's to TKO RIP 250's for the sole reason of having a more durable arrow. I love the Axis shafts and think everyone should at least give them a go, but the last batch I got, all of them snapped or bent at the insert just from hitting a rhinehart target. Hence the need for something more durable. If you're looking to change for the sole reaosn of more FOC, I don't think it's worth the cost. FOC has been beaten to death here in the past month or two I feel and the cost/reward ratio isn't worth it IMO.

As for the arrows themselves, I couldn't be more pleased. My setup:

Carbon Defiant 34 29/80#
Victory TKO RIP 250 cut to 28in
75g brass insert, iron will SS collar (25g), and 100g Oz Cut
4 fletch AAE Max Stealth

How did they bend?

I haven't seen carbon bend before, got any pictures?

 

[ddd-shooter]

I must be the only one who thinks axis are tough as nails already?
I shoot through a few deer a year with one arrow usually. Been shooting axis for over ten years, never had an issue and won't switch just cuz someone thinks the front of my arrow isn't heavy enough, lol
I say if it ain't broken, don't fix it

 

[Turkeygetpwnd38]

I’m shooting both this year. I’ve been shooting axis 260s for 4 years now. Picked up some Victory rip TKOs just to get overall weight down a bit and see how I like them. So far I’m a fan, but time will tell. I’d go with whichever gets you to your target weight.
Any durability issues with axis is likely user error. I’ve shot them into trees/fences/posts, through elk/bison/deer/antelope, hit rocks shooting grouse, I’ve never broken an arrow. I have the same dozen from 4 years ago when I started using them and I shoot a lot.

 

[wayoh22]

How did they bend?

I haven't seen carbon bend before, got any pictures?

Poor choice of my word on my part. They snapped, did not bend. Good eye @Billy Goat

 

[Joe G]

Where is South shore archery?

 

[MattB]

Not worth it. If you have a bunch of extra money you want to blow tinkering, have at it. But if you think you will notice a difference in an additional 3% in FOC (or whatever) I would disagree. Mental masturbation. Guys were killing animals just fine with heavy GPI aluminum arrows and 100 gr. BH’s before FOC was even a thing. We now know those arrows likely had single digit FOC and some guys on the internet would suggest you couldn’t kill an animal with them. But we know better.

 

[Billy Goat]

Where is South shore archery?

I think Florida, but not certain.

South Shore Archery - South Shore Archery

southshorearcherysupply.com

 

[Joe G]

I think Florida, but not certain.

South Shore Archery - South Shore Archery

southshorearcherysupply.com

Thanks

I think Florida, but not certain.

South Shore Archery - South Shore Archery

southshorearcherysupply.com

thanks

 

[LONE HUNTER]

Not worth it. If you have a bunch of extra money you want to blow tinkering, have at it. But if you think you will notice a difference in an additional 3% in FOC (or whatever) I would disagree. Mental masturbation. Guys were killing animals just fine with heavy GPI aluminum arrows and 100 gr. BH’s before FOC was even a thing. We now know those arrows likely had single digit FOC and some guys on the internet would suggest you couldn’t kill an animal with them. But we know better.

I almost bought into the FOC craze (literally had the arrows in my basket on a website to purchase). I talked to few guys on here and read some information from both sides of the argument and really thought through my experiences as an archer over the last 18 years. I concluded that it probably does help, but not enough for me to crack my wallet open. I am not going to let an Appeal to Authority get me to throw good arrows away over it.

And to the OP it was the exact same arrow consideration you are making, currently shoot the Axis, was going to buy RIP TKO. My experience has been that Axis is quite durable but that doesnt mean the TKOs arent better.

 

[MT257]

I’ve used the axis in the past, but bough some RIP TKO and installed brass inserts. I’ve never measured FOC-ever and have seen some success. Is there a point in which one can have too much FOC?

 

[Jacob Chapman]

I'm in the opposite boat from you.

Had shot Axis for years, buddy convinced me to switch to the RIP TKO's...I have been less than impressed-going back to my old standby Easton's.

YMMV-good luck with your choice!

 

[MT257]

I'm in the opposite boat from you.

Had shot Axis for years, buddy convinced me to switch to the RIP TKO's...I have been less than impressed-going back to my old standby Easton's.

YMMV-good luck with your choice!

I’ve never had the axis fail on me either. What were you not impressed with as far as the rip tko?

 

[Zac]

A lot of people seem to like the RIPS. I think the only reason to go with them over an Axis is due to the weight savings. I know they are not consistent lot to lot as the Axis are. This is why people find so much variance in their collar system. This is due to them being manufactured in Mexico. I believe they use the same plant as Gold Tip. I think they are fine as long as you use a hidden insert. However I think the struggle right now is finding them in stock somewhere.

 

[Jacob Chapman]

I’ve never had the axis fail on me either. What were you not impressed with as far as the rip tko?

They just haven’t been durable for me. Had multiple shots on animals break when I don’t believe they should have. Maybe it was a fluke deal, but I lost confidence in the arrows, back to the old standard

 

[Joe G]

Easton bound and down looks like!

 

[5MilesBack]

A lot of people seem to like the RIPS. I think the only reason to go with them over an Axis is due to the weight savings. I know they are not consistent lot to lot as the Axis are.

I haven't tried their Match version, but regular Axis have never been as consistently accurate for me as other .204" options that I've tried. I use HIT's and Bohning A-nocks in all my 204's so the components are exactly the same. All that leaves is the shafts themselves. I always nock tune, but even after that I can randomly shoot 10 arrows (5 of two different types) at 60+ yards and the groups have always been larger with the Axis. That's my main reason for continuing to go a different direction for my arrows.

 

[5MilesBack]

I’ve used the axis in the past, but bough some RIP TKO and installed brass inserts. I’ve never measured FOC-ever and have seen some success. Is there a point in which one can have too much FOC?

I would say that as long as good and true flight isn't diminished then it isn't "too much". I believe that some folks sacrifice perfect arrow flight just to get to some magical level of FOC.

 

[MT257]

I would say that as long as good and true flight isn't diminished then it isn't "too much". I believe that some folks sacrifice perfect arrow flight just to get to some magical level of FOC.

I’m honestly just curious- like I said I have never measured FOC and only added 75gr brass inserts to get a heavier finished weight. I should like just shoot them and see how it goes and probably never should have measured the foc.

 

[Zac]

I haven't tried their Match version, but regular Axis have never been as consistently accurate for me as other .204" options that I've tried. I use HIT's and Bohning A-nocks in all my 204's so the components are exactly the same. All that leaves is the shafts themselves. I always nock tune, but even after that I can randomly shoot 10 arrows (5 of two different types) at 60+ yards and the groups have always been larger with the Axis. That's my main reason for continuing to go a different direction for my arrows.

Yeah I'm not cheerleading for them. I realize alot of accomplished archers such as yourself prefer different shafts. Nock tuning could be the great equalizer. I haven't found this necessary with axis as long as I cut some distance off the nock end. I think nock tuning is more to seat the nock flush in pulltrusion type shafts than it is to match the stiff side of the shaft. If a guy builds a dozen arrows to shoot per season and nock tunes then there probably is no benefit to the Axis. Goldtip uses more carbon, and Victory uses their multidirectional wrap, both of these probably beat Axis in durability. Axis is just going to be more consistent from lot to lot.

 

[5MilesBack]

I’m honestly just curious- like I said I have never measured FOC and only added 75gr brass inserts to get a heavier finished weight. I should like just shoot them and see how it goes and probably never should have measured the foc.

I put 75gr brass HIT's in my RIP TKO's and shoot 125's, and I still haven't measured or calculated what the FOC is. Don't know. But they do fly well, and they hit stuff hard. I have a bunch of other arrows with just 16gr HIT's in them that weigh the same as these in overall weight. Yet the RIP TKO's consistently hit my back stop through my target, and the others don't. So I'm guessing there's some benefit to the extra FOC but I don't worry about it.