BE Focus vs Ethics

JeffRaines

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So I recently picked up some BE arrows and while I like the arrows, I opted for the FOCUS system and let’s just say I’m sick of these already. I’ve found that I’m probably gonna need to glue the outsert/collar onto the shafts. I can get them spinning right without gluing them on, but once I glue them on they spin like garbage. Without gluing the collars on the inserts will typically pull out after 10 or so shots.

FWIW I’ve had zero issues using VAP TKOs with the stock halfout so I don’t think it’s a glue issue and more of a design issue.

Does anyone have experience with both the Ethics archery and FOCUS inserts? Are they any better?
 

dkime

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So I recently picked up some BE arrows and while I like the arrows, I opted for the FOCUS system and let’s just say I’m sick of these already. I’ve found that I’m probably gonna need to glue the outsert/collar onto the shafts. I can get them spinning right without gluing them on, but once I glue them on they spin like garbage. Without gluing the collars on the inserts will typically pull out after 10 or so shots.

FWIW I’ve had zero issues using VAP TKOs with the stock halfout so I don’t think it’s a glue issue and more of a design issue.

Does anyone have experience with both the Ethics archery and FOCUS inserts? Are they any better?
This is why Day Six moved away from the center pin system and to the centric system. the collars still need glued on to the shaft but the collar doubles up on tolerance mitigation by marrying to the ID of the shaft, insert, and OD of the shaft.
 

Johbran

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Well damn I have some FOCOS ordered for my x impacts so I will be able
To respond soon. Just a question, did you try some blue loctite on the screw, or is the screw not working loose and the whole damn system pulling loose?
 
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JeffRaines

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Well damn I have some FOCOS ordered for my x impacts so I will be able
To respond soon. Just a question, did you try some blue loctite on the screw, or is the screw not working loose and the whole damn system pulling loose?
The whole damn system is pulling loose. I wish it was just the screw that would be an easy fix!

I feel like if I could glue the “outsert” portion of the insert to the shaft it would probably be fine, but like I mentioned in the original post they don’t spin right after gluing them.
 

doc holiday13

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The whole damn system is pulling loose. I wish it was just the screw that would be an easy fix!

I feel like if I could glue the “outsert” portion of the insert to the shaft it would probably be fine, but like I mentioned in the original post they don’t spin right after gluing them.

Are you using some cheapass glue? I've never had epoxy pull out once it cured
 
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JeffRaines

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Are you using some cheapass glue? I've never had epoxy pull out once it cured
Maybe I need to switch to epoxy, but I’m using the same glue that I used on the VAP halfouts and they’re in there with no issues.
 

roosiebull

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my experience with the FOCOS system was on 4mm arrows and short lived, i had the 100gr stainless version and they were the weakest component system i have ever had on an arrow, they bent super easy and the collar cracked pretty easy too... maybe the whole system is stronger if you glue the sleeve, but i could tell pretty quick i didn't want to do that, because they were still going to bend, then it's a permanent thing.

i don't particularly like half outs, but i like half outs way, way better than focos outserts. i was bending them with a 50# recurve not hitting anything super hard... a 5mm axis out of my 73# compound regularly survives the same type of impacts with way more energy behind it.

i have heard some say they like the focos system, so there is that.... they were terrible for me
 
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JeffRaines

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I ended up with a dozen standard diameter arrows today. I’m done with the half-outs and outsert bullshit. Sucks but it is what it is!
 

TheViking

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This is why Day Six moved away from the center pin system and to the centric system. the collars still need glued on to the shaft but the collar doubles up on tolerance mitigation by marrying to the ID of the shaft, insert, and OD of the shaft.

I’ve tinkered with every micro diameter outsert system there is, and Day Six is the best in my opinion. Having the sleeve married to the insert portion is huge. It is stronger and allows the system to be one piece.

Nexxus is good too, but they basically ripped of Day Six and aren’t USA made
 

TheTone

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I’ve tinkered with every micro diameter outsert system there is, and Day Six is the best in my opinion. Having the sleeve married to the insert portion is huge. It is stronger and allows the system to be one piece.

Nexxus is good too, but they basically ripped of Day Six and aren’t USA made
I’m pretty sure day six was an Australian product at first as well and then the name or product was bought and moved here. I wonder if nexxus is just old/original day six?
 

dkime

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I’m pretty sure day six was an Australian product at first as well and then the name or product was bought and moved here. I wonder if nexxus is just old/original day six?

They are not. I don’t want to derail the thread


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

TheViking

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I’m pretty sure day six was an Australian product at first as well and then the name or product was bought and moved here. I wonder if nexxus is just old/original day six?

Negative.

Nexxus is a new company, an offshoot of Ozcut broadheads. Nick Morton is co-owner of both of those companies.
 

doc holiday13

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my experience with the FOCOS system was on 4mm arrows and short lived, i had the 100gr stainless version and they were the weakest component system i have ever had on an arrow, they bent super easy and the collar cracked pretty easy too... maybe the whole system is stronger if you glue the sleeve, but i could tell pretty quick i didn't want to do that, because they were still going to bend, then it's a permanent thing.

i don't particularly like half outs, but i like half outs way, way better than focos outserts. i was bending them with a 50# recurve not hitting anything super hard... a 5mm axis out of my 73# compound regularly survives the same type of impacts with way more energy behind it.

i have heard some say they like the focos system, so there is that.... they were terrible for me

Hmmm it almost sounds like you're raining on my future parade LOL.. I was thinking of going with X impact's and 100g stainless system.. I guess I'll go for the Ethics system instead
 
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JeffRaines

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Hmmm it almost sounds like you're raining on my future parade LOL.. I was thinking of going with X impact's and 100g stainless system.. I guess I'll go for the Ethics system instead
Yeah I wouldn’t waste my money on the focus system again… and another glue update - I’m using the same glue on 50gr inserts with my hunter pros with no issues so it ain’t the glue. The focus system is just a shitty design IMO.

Not having to worry with halfouts/outserts is nice. You can’t tell me theres any noticeable difference between standard diameter arrows and small/micros for hunters… and this is coming from someone who’s used them for the last 6 years.
 

doc holiday13

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Yeah I wouldn’t waste my money on the focus system again… and another glue update - I’m using the same glue on 50gr inserts with my hunter pros with no issues so it ain’t the glue. The focus system is just a shitty design IMO.

Not having to worry with halfouts/outserts is nice. You can’t tell me theres any noticeable difference between standard diameter arrows and small/micros for hunters… and this is coming from someone who’s used them for the last 6 years.

I've been using Axis 5mm carbons for about a decade and My only issue has been arrows and broadheads breaking off in the unsupported section of carbon between the insert and broadhead OR not getting a pass through and the deer falling over on the arrow(which would break any arrow)

Its taken me 10 years to break 9 of my original dozen arrows, soo I'm changing up kinds of stuff for this next season. Adding reinforcement collars and heavier broadheads are a "priority" so I might be going to 4mm carbons to save some weight on the shaft and put it towards the front of the arrow.
 

ndbuck09

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been running the ethics system on my x impacts for years now. aluminum insert with the stainless collar. I once shot one of those metal targets at 20 yards that has the hole for the vitals where you'd be safe and not hit the metal. Well I missed and hit the metal. My arrow bounced backwards and only damage was that the field point tip was dented in. I took that arrow home and spun it and it still spun true! Now, I can't unscrew the field point but I still occasionally shoot that arrow here two years later!

All that to say that the Ethics system is very very tough! When you follow their instructions and videos, it goes together rock solid. You do want to use a slower setting type glue so that you can spin the arrow, rotate the sleeve a quarter turn, spin the arrow, etc. I've always been able to get em spinning true.
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CodeMonkey

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I shot the FOCOS for a few months on my 300 spine X Impacts. They were LOUD. Remember in school when you used to fold a piece of paper over and blow really hard to make a high pitch whistle? That's what these components do in the air since the tolerances are pretty loose.

Edited to add: I'm sure the problem would go away if I glued the outsert, but that defeats one of the selling points of the system (being able to change out the aluminum part that is likely to bend/break).
 
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