Broadheads absolutely will not tune to FPs

[MuleDeerMike]

For the last 5 days I've been trying for the life of me to get my broadheads to lineup with my field points and no matter what I do they won't tune closer than 1 inch apart windage at 20 yards. Elevation is perfect. Spine is correct, centershot is correct, cams are correctly timed, etc. Both my field tips and broadheads are grouping sub 1 MOA out to 60 yards. The groups are several inches apart at that distance though (FPs are way left and BHs are center). I'm incredibly frustrated. They used to tune fine back when my arrows and draw length were a little longer (and incorrect). I've tried adjusting my draw weight up and down and adjusting the rest both directions horizontally at every poundage and nothing closes the 1 inch gap at 20 yards. Shooting a bowtech carbon knight at 28" inch draw, 68 lbs, 27.5" FMJ 340 with a 100gr slick trick. This isnt a huge issue as my broadheads are shooting great groups at long distances but it's super annoying when I want to shoot just field tips out to 80 yards and they're grouping within a couple inches but barely hitting the left side of the target. Any ideas?

 

[jmez]

Going to have to shim the cams. If broadheads are hitting center and FP's are left then you have tail left arrow flight pushing the BH's to the right. Shim cams to the left.

 

[Wrench]

I just went through this. I ended up shooting paper with my heads and points. I needed to add a twist to my yoke and come off the draw weight a fuzz. Now it's perfect every time.

 

[doverpack12]

For the last 5 days I've been trying for the life of me to get my broadheads to lineup with my field points and no matter what I do they won't tune closer than 1 inch apart windage at 20 yards. Elevation is perfect. Spine is correct, centershot is correct, cams are correctly timed, etc. Both my field tips and broadheads are grouping sub 1 MOA out to 60 yards. The groups are several inches apart at that distance though (FPs are way left and BHs are center). I'm incredibly frustrated. They used to tune fine back when my arrows and draw length were a little longer (and incorrect). I've tried adjusting my draw weight up and down and adjusting the rest both directions horizontally at every poundage and nothing closes the 1 inch gap at 20 yards. Shooting a bowtech carbon knight at 28" inch draw, 68 lbs, 27.5" FMJ 340 with a 100gr slick trick. This isnt a huge issue as my broadheads are shooting great groups at long distances but it's super annoying when I want to shoot just field tips out to 80 yards and they're grouping within a couple inches but barely hitting the left side of the target. Any ideas?

You do have a few options. If they are that close it won’t take much rest right adjustment to correct. You could modify grip very slightly to achieve the rest right effect you just have to use a little pressure one side or the other and watch which way the rest mobs as the riser rotates slightly. You can find a cable slide that allows the cables to sit slightly farther away from the rod and closer to the arrow. Last option and only necessary if you are dead set on keeping rest
Centershot exact and the above don’t work is to shim the cams left a little

 

[MuleDeerMike]

Interesting. Never shimmed a cam before. My rest is pretty much perfect at this point. No horizontal movement is bringing them closer together like in the past. Any windage adjustment is moving them both equally one way or the other to an extent until I move it a little further and they start separating again. I tried this at several different poundages, 1/4 turn at a time. No yolk on my bow so that isn't an option. My string is a few years old now and I shoot alot, I wonder how much that could potentially affect it? If at all. My rest is a QAD HDX for what it's worth.

 

[Brendan]

Shimming cams is pretty standard for those who can do it when you don't have yokes to work with. Allows you to move the powerstroke of the string left or right to ensure it's centered right behind the arrow. Doesn't ever change like it can with yokes, but you need a press and the appropriate size shims.

Might be worth spraying some foot powder on your rest and cables to see if you have a minor amount of fletching contact, that can drive you crazy trying to tune. Otherwise - good options given above. Shimming the cams or moving the rest should fix it unless there's something else going on (Spine, contact, broadheads not spinning true, etc.)

 

[MallardSX2]

Shoot your arrows as 60 yards and adjust the sight over...

Shimming cams and twisting strings? lol You guys always make me chuckle.
I'm not saying that it wont help the situation but you'll be chasing things in circles and its almost game time.
Shimming cams and twisting strings, modifying your grip, and adjusting draw weights. These will all require paper tuning and then it will require all of your pins to be adjusted slightly.

This should have been done months ago if you were going to do this.

Making changes to your bow at the 1 yard line is the best way to loose confidence in your setup right before touchdown time...

Take my advice....Its almost hunting season. Be realistic, move the sight and hunt. Mess with your equipment after the season.

I have been an avid archery hunter for 25 years. I have only gotten broadheads to fly perfectly on a couple of occasions.

I move my sight exactly 1 week before the season to match where my broadheads hit.

Why? Maybe its because I'm just lazy. But lazy didn't put all of my animals on the wall.

 

[bsnedeker]

Shoot your arrows as 60 yards and adjust the sight over...

Shimming cams and twisting strings? lol You guys always make me chuckle.
I'm not saying that it wont help the situation but you'll be chasing things in circles and its almost game time.
Shimming cams and twisting strings, modifying your grip, and adjusting draw weights. These will all require paper tuning and then it will require all of your pins to be adjusted slightly.

This should have been done months ago if you were going to do this.

Making changes to your bow at the 1 yard line is the best way to loose confidence in your setup right before touchdown time...

Take my advice....Its almost hunting season. Be realistic, move the sight and hunt. Mess with your equipment after the season.

I have been an avid archery hunter for 25 years. I have only gotten broadheads to fly perfectly on a couple of occasions.

I move my sight exactly 1 week before the season to match where my broadheads hit.

Why? Maybe its because I'm just lazy. But lazy didn't put all of my animals on the wall.

100% this!

 

[doverpack12]

For the last 5 days I've been trying for the life of me to get my broadheads to lineup with my field points and no matter what I do they won't tune closer than 1 inch apart windage at 20 yards. Elevation is perfect. Spine is correct, centershot is correct, cams are correctly timed, etc. Both my field tips and broadheads are grouping sub 1 MOA out to 60 yards. The groups are several inches apart at that distance though (FPs are way left and BHs are center). I'm incredibly frustrated. They used to tune fine back when my arrows and draw length were a little longer (and incorrect). I've tried adjusting my draw weight up and down and adjusting the rest both directions horizontally at every poundage and nothing closes the 1 inch gap at 20 yards. Shooting a bowtech carbon knight at 28" inch draw, 68 lbs, 27.5" FMJ 340 with a 100gr slick trick. This isnt a huge issue as my broadheads are shooting great groups at long distances but it's super annoying when I want to shoot just field tips out to 80 yards and they're grouping within a couple inches but barely hitting the left side of the target. Any ideas?

I agree with not changing anything right now if you have a hunt or season starting soon. If rest won’t close the gap then it’s something else. In this case with everything else in line I would say it’s grip. Binary cam bows can require just a little different grip position that hybrid or solo cams. Usually this is a counterclockwise rotation or placing slightly more of the bottom of your hand further to the right side of the grip.

 

[SKYNET KC]

Shoot your arrows as 60 yards and adjust the sight over...

Shimming cams and twisting strings? lol You guys always make me chuckle.
I'm not saying that it wont help the situation but you'll be chasing things in circles and its almost game time.
Shimming cams and twisting strings, modifying your grip, and adjusting draw weights. These will all require paper tuning and then it will require all of your pins to be adjusted slightly.

This should have been done months ago if you were going to do this.

Making changes to your bow at the 1 yard line is the best way to loose confidence in your setup right before touchdown time...

Take my advice....Its almost hunting season. Be realistic, move the sight and hunt. Mess with your equipment after the season.

I have been an avid archery hunter for 25 years. I have only gotten broadheads to fly perfectly on a couple of occasions.

I move my sight exactly 1 week before the season to match where my broadheads hit.

Why? Maybe its because I'm just lazy. But lazy didn't put all of my animals on the wall.

The problem with moving your sights is you're putting a bandaid on one of the most important factors of penetration - arrow flight.

Arrow flight is the #2 contributor to penetration, only to structural integrity. If your broadheads and field points are grouping together, your arrows aren't flying as well as they could and it WILL inhibit penetration potential.

Shimming your cam slightly, or yoke tuning a twist or two shouldn't change much on your setup. Not sure why you'd even care about how it changes your paper tune, as that's really only a preliminary tuning step anyway.

I'm glad you've had success with your method, but for some of us that won't cut it.

 

[5MilesBack]

The problem with moving your sights is you're putting a bandaid on one of the most important factors of penetration - arrow flight.

Yep, this is the reason why you fix it.

But I wouldn't be messing with the rest and tuning adjustments from shooting at 20 yards. I'd be shooting 60 yards and then doing micro-adjustments, the adjustments will actually show up while shooting 60 yards. Also.......with the QAD, make sure you re-time that rest after every adjustment. It doesn't take much to change the timing on those things, and any fletching contact is going to throw your results off.

 

[bsnedeker]

The problem with moving your sights is you're putting a bandaid on one of the most important factors of penetration - arrow flight.

Arrow flight is the #2 contributor to penetration, only to structural integrity. If your broadheads and field points are grouping together, your arrows aren't flying as well as they could and it WILL inhibit penetration potential.

Shimming your cam slightly, or yoke tuning a twist or two shouldn't change much on your setup. Not sure why you'd even care about how it changes your paper tune, as that's really only a preliminary tuning step anyway.

I'm glad you've had success with your method, but for some of us that won't cut it.

While you may be technically correct, the 90% pass-through rate I've seen with my setup speaks for itself.

 

[MallardSX2]

Make no mistake about it. I agree with you guys that it can be fixed and it should be.

Thinking that minor tuning to get 6" of POI out of an arrow at 60 yards is going to affect arrow penetration in a significant way is questionable...
Its not like the arrow is flying 2' to the right. Even if it was.... the penetration difference would be negligible and hard to measure without a micrometer......

BUT, I do agree with you in saying that perfect arrow flight will result in the deepest penetration.

I dont disagree with anyone here on their thoughts. They are ALL valid points.
I'm trying to help the guy out here and give him a quick fix to his problem when he is at the 1 yard line.

 

[bmart2622]

Skynet is right on, don move your sight, that is terrible advice. It is a veru minor tuning issue that is causing it and moving your sight wont fix that, it will only cover it up. I am amazed at the amount of people who do this and hit the field with an untuned bow.

 

[Buffalomtn]

Make no mistake about it. I agree with you guys that it can be fixed and it should be.

Thinking that minor tuning to get 6" of POI out of an arrow at 60 yards is going to affect arrow penetration in a significant way is questionable...
Its not like the arrow is flying 2' to the right. Even if it was.... the penetration difference would be negligible and hard to measure without a micrometer......

BUT, I do agree with you in saying that perfect arrow flight will result in the deepest penetration.

I dont disagree with anyone here on their thoughts. They are ALL valid points.
I'm trying to help the guy out here and give him a quick fix to his problem when he is at the 1 yard line.

If you have perfect form you are probably correct. If you or conditions in the field don’t allow you to execute a perfect shot a bow that is not tuned will be far less forgiving. It is not just about penetration.
If the OP has a shop nearby or a friend with a press it will take less than an hour to fix. Sounds like there is plenty of time to get it right.

 

[bohntr]

You guys crack me up....move your sight and go hunt! Tinker later......my test (3 years ago) with a hooter shooter machine PROVED that field points and multiple broadheads will not fly EXACTLY the same at extended distances.....although some were within 1/4', which with human error one would never realize a difference.

My point is, get a good flying quality head, make you minor adjustment on your sight, and go hunt. Penetration issues??? Well, I've been pulling strings for over 40 years and I can't remember the last time my arrow hasn't passed clean through an animal. You're making too much out of a minor issue with a quick fix. JMO

 

[jmez]

The OP also asked for ideas to fix the problem. He never specified a timetable. Maybe he isn't hunting for a month. Even if he is this isn't a hard fix with shimming. If you have a press it takes about 5 min to do. The entire process should take less than an hour. He already isn't confident in the current set up. If he were I doubt he'd be on here getting ideas.

 

[bmart2622]

I would shoot it at further distance and see what kind of groups you get. If you shoot a broadhead/field point group as tight as you shoot just field points then I would say you are good to go

 

[SKYNET KC]

You guys crack me up....move your sight and go hunt! Tinker later......my test (3 years ago) with a hooter shooter machine PROVED that field points and multiple broadheads will not fly EXACTLY the same at extended distances.....although some were within 1/4', which with human error one would never realize a difference.

My point is, get a good flying quality head, make you minor adjustment on your sight, and go hunt. Penetration issues??? Well, I've been pulling strings for over 40 years and I can't remember the last time my arrow hasn't passed clean through an animal. You're making too much out of a minor issue with a quick fix. JMO

Even machines like hooter shooters apply torque on a bow. There's a guy in New Jersey, I think, that has been doing tests on various shooting machines and the affects they have on bow tuning. He's basically proven that this is the case.

Anyway, my point is, your test was probably not valid. When I shot a compound, I put my field tips, Silverflame XXL, Maasia, and Samurai broadheads all within my typical grouping distance out to 80 yards. These are all broadheads with completely different profiles and characteristics. I was able to do that because my bow AND arrow were tuned correctly.

I would argue that if the broadhead is quality and well made, and the tuning process is taken care of, you have to be in very odd circumstances to cause broadheads to not hit with field points. Some of those circumstances being too high of velocity, or extremely low FOC.

 

[Darryl Dunsloppy]

While I agree with the tuning recommendations, I would switch arrows (not now though). I had almost the exact same set up and DL, poundage etc. and I switched to 300 spines and it cured a lot of ailments with the Carbon Knight.