TX1
FNG
- Joined
- Jun 30, 2015
- Messages
- 39
First I would like to thank everyone on this site for all the information that is posted it has helped me beyond measure. I just wish I could get my brother, and his friend (1st year elk hunter) to spend the time and read even a little of the information here. I will say they did to a point and even more after some events that took place that did not have to.
Background
We hunted in Pagosa Springs near Rainbow Creek, ages 50, 50 & 51
1st time to backpack in, 5 miles one way with planned 10 day hunt, My wife dropped us at the trail head on Thursday and off we went. My pack weight for 10 days was 65lbs all in, food, sleep system, rifle & ammo, optics I mean everything except the clothes I was wearing. I cant tell you my brothers pack weight because when he first started packing his pack I weighed everything for him and finally gave up as he did not care. When he had what he wanted in the pack I put him on a scale and it was 51lbs without food and a few other things. After that point he stripped things out and he stripped it again before my wife dropped us off. To the point the one item he was responsible for (water filter pump) did not make it to camp on either trip I anticipated this as this is not my 1st rodeo hunting with him and I put a sawyer inline filter on my water bladder. The 3rd guys pack had to be over 80lbs as he had everything but a kitchen sink in it.
I chose to make one trip in with that weight and trained for it to the best of my abilities, my brothers friend also chose one trip in and one out, my brother chose two trips yes 20 miles total (5 x 4)
He at least took into consideration some suggestions when purchasing items like sleeping bag, sleeping pad, walking sticks when 1st buying gear and later he and my brother listened on other items after the real world set in. It was however too late in many respects.
Weather
Thursday until Saturday night clear and mild temps during the day cool at night with rain in the forecast for Friday only which changed drastically and it rained almost everyday from Saturday on out. I planned for this as you can't count on the weather in the mountains I don't care what the weatherman says.
Gear - I don't have an affiliation with any company or website its just what I went with after doing some research or reading it here. These are my opinions and observations you may have or had a different experience.
The good
1. Kifaru paratipi and box stove (mine) - someone here said there is something to be said about a fire ant the end of the day in crappy weather and they are right. All performed within their limitations and abilities and I made sure I did not set up in a low spot where water would pool or run in. I was dry and warm and so was my gear a few wet spot around the outside but that was to be expected with a floorless shelter. I would like to find a way to modify to add some vents to let moisture out.
2. Kifaru -20 slickbag - I would rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it I also like to sleep warm when the temp drops. I took the weight penalty for the added protection and was comfortable even after the weather went to crap
3. Esbit stove (cup and round base fire screen) - boiled my water for MH meals up to 9200ft with no problems, I don't drink coffee but for my purposes it worked and the fuel tabs doubled as emergency fire starters and in 1/4's started the fire in the box stove.
4. Trekking poles - $39.00 per pole Cabelas brand with flip locks You do not have enough money to buy them from me during that hunt and they are still going strong. I spray painted them to get the gloss and bright colors out.
5. Nemo Cosmo Air with pillow top - I wanted to be comfortable and sleep good I accepted the weight penalty
6. Kifaru duplex frame - Has been discussed to death on here. It just works and was worth the cost.
7. Kifaru Mountain Rambler with guide lid - Its like a swiss army knife and balanced well I have bought my 1st and last pack.
8. Sawyer in line filter - worked as advertised and worth $20 bucks
9. I priced different clothing systems but could not justify $2k for Sitka and I like multicam so I went with the ECWCS gen III from Fort Bragg Surplus all items were new with tags I just washed in nikwax to make sure they were good to go. I bought levels 3, 4, 5, 6 & level 7 puffy coat. it performed very well and with one exception was very quiet the exception being the rain pants. The top and bottoms are made of different material and while the rain jacket was quiet I would only recommend the bottoms while sitting they are not quiet enough for walking and hunting, The system definitely saw hot, cold, rain and snow and I was able to add or shed to meet the need at hand. I usually had the level 5 on and the level 6 rain jacket in my day pack (guide lid). At $550 shipped I was really happy.
10. Mountain House meals - I did not find one I did not like
11. Garmin Rino 650 - I started out years ago with 110 to load maps they told me I needed the 120 so last year Cabelas had the 120 on closeout so I picked one up thinking I would finally get the topo maps feature well I did for all areas around Colorado except the area I was hunting it was 4mb too big so after spending $100 on the topo I went shopping again and Cabelas had the 650 on sale from $499 I think to $329 so I got it, purchased the 24k topo and birdseye. if you go this route purchase the optional AA battery pack for $24 on line it makes the radio profile thicker but worth it vs an additional lithium batter pack for $65. I was able to preload waypoints and areas on the map on my computer then download to the unit before we ever left Texas.
12. Danner Pronghorn 200 - comfortable and my feet never got wet not to say the boot did not but my feet didn't. I have a pair of lacross pacs I have had since 2003 as a backup for colder temps and they still work like the day I bought them.
13. My brothers friend bought the cabelas outfitter pack and frame system, it had load lifters and appeared to work well for him. He purchased a cabelas 15 degree bag and neoair pad and reported he was warm and comfortable each night.
All in all I think I was ready for anything I actually encountered and was comfortable the whole time.
14. Their cooking systems - Jetboil I think and something else worked well, faster than my esbit but weighed more
15. My brother had a mountain hardware 0 degree bag not sure how it worked once the rain set in see the ugly
The bad
1. My brothers friend purchased Cabelas insulated boots (whitetail hunter I think) they broke down and saturated and the sole on one toe started separating after a couple of days. Since he had not worn them to beak them in prior to the hunt they did not last long before showing a failure. His feet failed a lot quicker as he had blisters from the hike in I tried to get him to break them in but it fell on deaf ears.
2. My brother started out buying a Eberlestock team elk pack, I think it would be an ok day pack or maybe a couple of days but not 10 days, Next he bought a Alps Outdoorz Commander with me still advising him to get a Kifaru as he still had time. My observations were that we were able to lift the straps using the pins and holes provided after he finally told me he was having problems to get the load lifted up. However the waist belt buckles kept slipping loose after a few minutes of movement allowing the load to fall back on to his shoulders. He would not let me tie them in knots to keep them tight and suffered greatly under loads.
3. Not really bad but his friend had a 20 year old sierra designs 3 season tent and the rainfly tore due to age the first light rain he trid duct tape but that did not work. When he finally told me I broke out the alcohol wipes from my 1st aid kit anf the tenacious tape (thanks Rokslide) and he was repaired and back in action.
4. My brothers Rocky boots broke down and saturated with water after couple of days.
The Ugly
1. Remember the plan was 5 miles in for 10 days unless one of us actually shot an elk, we went in on Thursday but had to come out on Monday.
2. My brother bought a 4 season tent I don't know if I can name the brand or not but after the 1st light rain it had some moisture in it which we thought was condensation. Well he got sick that 1st day and stayed in the tent probably from 20 miles of carrying stuff in. From there it just got worse instead of buying a good sleeping pad he went really really cheap to the point that he had an old foam 3" thick mattress he cut to size rolled up and packed in. Well the tent he bought while rated as a 4 season is only rated that way as it is for expedition use and at $550 plus the cheap foam pad it kicked off a complete system failure. When we Got back to the cabin on day 5 I looked it up and the reviews state the same problem and that is it is not a waterproof tent. Had it been then the foam pad would have worked I guess but as it was as the rain progressed the tent filled up with water which the foam pad proceeded to sponge up which in turn saturated the sleeping bag with him in it. I fired up the box stove in my tent and started drying him out talk about condensation.
3. Rain gear or lack there of - My brother had some kind of vinyl poncho which tore the 1st time he put it on at the head and neck which happened to be when he was getting out of his rain soaked tent. His friend and I had gotten up opening morning to be at a point to look at the meadows on the North face 2 hours prior to 1st light. You could hear what sounded like a train coming up the valley, it went from 60ish and sprinkles to a 20 degree temp drop and raining. As it was coming I pulled off my shell and put on my fleece and the shell back on by the time it hit I was ready. After a few minutes I saw is friend standing and shivering I looked and he had put on his rain poncho which looked like a cheap thin trashbag with 2 holes for arms and one for his head. I pulled my level 6 rain jacket out of my pack and let him use it and he said this thing is great I can already feel the heat building up.
they both had the Cabelas heavy wool guide series bibs and jacket it was just not cold enough for them to wear them and I think they left them at the cabin. both had on cotton clothing which I had tried to tell them about but they knew better than me and I wanted to hunt not argue with them. We came out on Monday morning to get them dried out and try again which never worked due to the weather and their gear. I did get them to Walmart and at least get them to buy some frog toggs. Both would use fanny packs that did not allow them to have an extra rain jacket, fleece etc or to shed layers and have someplace to store what they took off or put on as the weather changed so they never had it to begin with. They did have wool and or synthetic thermal underwear.
He kept saying he had never had it rain in October and I kept saying it is the mountains and you have to be ready for anything. I guess the moral of this novel is I was happy with how my gear performed and the information I have spent the last 6 months reading on this site
Background
We hunted in Pagosa Springs near Rainbow Creek, ages 50, 50 & 51
1st time to backpack in, 5 miles one way with planned 10 day hunt, My wife dropped us at the trail head on Thursday and off we went. My pack weight for 10 days was 65lbs all in, food, sleep system, rifle & ammo, optics I mean everything except the clothes I was wearing. I cant tell you my brothers pack weight because when he first started packing his pack I weighed everything for him and finally gave up as he did not care. When he had what he wanted in the pack I put him on a scale and it was 51lbs without food and a few other things. After that point he stripped things out and he stripped it again before my wife dropped us off. To the point the one item he was responsible for (water filter pump) did not make it to camp on either trip I anticipated this as this is not my 1st rodeo hunting with him and I put a sawyer inline filter on my water bladder. The 3rd guys pack had to be over 80lbs as he had everything but a kitchen sink in it.
I chose to make one trip in with that weight and trained for it to the best of my abilities, my brothers friend also chose one trip in and one out, my brother chose two trips yes 20 miles total (5 x 4)
He at least took into consideration some suggestions when purchasing items like sleeping bag, sleeping pad, walking sticks when 1st buying gear and later he and my brother listened on other items after the real world set in. It was however too late in many respects.
Weather
Thursday until Saturday night clear and mild temps during the day cool at night with rain in the forecast for Friday only which changed drastically and it rained almost everyday from Saturday on out. I planned for this as you can't count on the weather in the mountains I don't care what the weatherman says.
Gear - I don't have an affiliation with any company or website its just what I went with after doing some research or reading it here. These are my opinions and observations you may have or had a different experience.
The good
1. Kifaru paratipi and box stove (mine) - someone here said there is something to be said about a fire ant the end of the day in crappy weather and they are right. All performed within their limitations and abilities and I made sure I did not set up in a low spot where water would pool or run in. I was dry and warm and so was my gear a few wet spot around the outside but that was to be expected with a floorless shelter. I would like to find a way to modify to add some vents to let moisture out.
2. Kifaru -20 slickbag - I would rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it I also like to sleep warm when the temp drops. I took the weight penalty for the added protection and was comfortable even after the weather went to crap
3. Esbit stove (cup and round base fire screen) - boiled my water for MH meals up to 9200ft with no problems, I don't drink coffee but for my purposes it worked and the fuel tabs doubled as emergency fire starters and in 1/4's started the fire in the box stove.
4. Trekking poles - $39.00 per pole Cabelas brand with flip locks You do not have enough money to buy them from me during that hunt and they are still going strong. I spray painted them to get the gloss and bright colors out.
5. Nemo Cosmo Air with pillow top - I wanted to be comfortable and sleep good I accepted the weight penalty
6. Kifaru duplex frame - Has been discussed to death on here. It just works and was worth the cost.
7. Kifaru Mountain Rambler with guide lid - Its like a swiss army knife and balanced well I have bought my 1st and last pack.
8. Sawyer in line filter - worked as advertised and worth $20 bucks
9. I priced different clothing systems but could not justify $2k for Sitka and I like multicam so I went with the ECWCS gen III from Fort Bragg Surplus all items were new with tags I just washed in nikwax to make sure they were good to go. I bought levels 3, 4, 5, 6 & level 7 puffy coat. it performed very well and with one exception was very quiet the exception being the rain pants. The top and bottoms are made of different material and while the rain jacket was quiet I would only recommend the bottoms while sitting they are not quiet enough for walking and hunting, The system definitely saw hot, cold, rain and snow and I was able to add or shed to meet the need at hand. I usually had the level 5 on and the level 6 rain jacket in my day pack (guide lid). At $550 shipped I was really happy.
10. Mountain House meals - I did not find one I did not like
11. Garmin Rino 650 - I started out years ago with 110 to load maps they told me I needed the 120 so last year Cabelas had the 120 on closeout so I picked one up thinking I would finally get the topo maps feature well I did for all areas around Colorado except the area I was hunting it was 4mb too big so after spending $100 on the topo I went shopping again and Cabelas had the 650 on sale from $499 I think to $329 so I got it, purchased the 24k topo and birdseye. if you go this route purchase the optional AA battery pack for $24 on line it makes the radio profile thicker but worth it vs an additional lithium batter pack for $65. I was able to preload waypoints and areas on the map on my computer then download to the unit before we ever left Texas.
12. Danner Pronghorn 200 - comfortable and my feet never got wet not to say the boot did not but my feet didn't. I have a pair of lacross pacs I have had since 2003 as a backup for colder temps and they still work like the day I bought them.
13. My brothers friend bought the cabelas outfitter pack and frame system, it had load lifters and appeared to work well for him. He purchased a cabelas 15 degree bag and neoair pad and reported he was warm and comfortable each night.
All in all I think I was ready for anything I actually encountered and was comfortable the whole time.
14. Their cooking systems - Jetboil I think and something else worked well, faster than my esbit but weighed more
15. My brother had a mountain hardware 0 degree bag not sure how it worked once the rain set in see the ugly
The bad
1. My brothers friend purchased Cabelas insulated boots (whitetail hunter I think) they broke down and saturated and the sole on one toe started separating after a couple of days. Since he had not worn them to beak them in prior to the hunt they did not last long before showing a failure. His feet failed a lot quicker as he had blisters from the hike in I tried to get him to break them in but it fell on deaf ears.
2. My brother started out buying a Eberlestock team elk pack, I think it would be an ok day pack or maybe a couple of days but not 10 days, Next he bought a Alps Outdoorz Commander with me still advising him to get a Kifaru as he still had time. My observations were that we were able to lift the straps using the pins and holes provided after he finally told me he was having problems to get the load lifted up. However the waist belt buckles kept slipping loose after a few minutes of movement allowing the load to fall back on to his shoulders. He would not let me tie them in knots to keep them tight and suffered greatly under loads.
3. Not really bad but his friend had a 20 year old sierra designs 3 season tent and the rainfly tore due to age the first light rain he trid duct tape but that did not work. When he finally told me I broke out the alcohol wipes from my 1st aid kit anf the tenacious tape (thanks Rokslide) and he was repaired and back in action.
4. My brothers Rocky boots broke down and saturated with water after couple of days.
The Ugly
1. Remember the plan was 5 miles in for 10 days unless one of us actually shot an elk, we went in on Thursday but had to come out on Monday.
2. My brother bought a 4 season tent I don't know if I can name the brand or not but after the 1st light rain it had some moisture in it which we thought was condensation. Well he got sick that 1st day and stayed in the tent probably from 20 miles of carrying stuff in. From there it just got worse instead of buying a good sleeping pad he went really really cheap to the point that he had an old foam 3" thick mattress he cut to size rolled up and packed in. Well the tent he bought while rated as a 4 season is only rated that way as it is for expedition use and at $550 plus the cheap foam pad it kicked off a complete system failure. When we Got back to the cabin on day 5 I looked it up and the reviews state the same problem and that is it is not a waterproof tent. Had it been then the foam pad would have worked I guess but as it was as the rain progressed the tent filled up with water which the foam pad proceeded to sponge up which in turn saturated the sleeping bag with him in it. I fired up the box stove in my tent and started drying him out talk about condensation.
3. Rain gear or lack there of - My brother had some kind of vinyl poncho which tore the 1st time he put it on at the head and neck which happened to be when he was getting out of his rain soaked tent. His friend and I had gotten up opening morning to be at a point to look at the meadows on the North face 2 hours prior to 1st light. You could hear what sounded like a train coming up the valley, it went from 60ish and sprinkles to a 20 degree temp drop and raining. As it was coming I pulled off my shell and put on my fleece and the shell back on by the time it hit I was ready. After a few minutes I saw is friend standing and shivering I looked and he had put on his rain poncho which looked like a cheap thin trashbag with 2 holes for arms and one for his head. I pulled my level 6 rain jacket out of my pack and let him use it and he said this thing is great I can already feel the heat building up.
they both had the Cabelas heavy wool guide series bibs and jacket it was just not cold enough for them to wear them and I think they left them at the cabin. both had on cotton clothing which I had tried to tell them about but they knew better than me and I wanted to hunt not argue with them. We came out on Monday morning to get them dried out and try again which never worked due to the weather and their gear. I did get them to Walmart and at least get them to buy some frog toggs. Both would use fanny packs that did not allow them to have an extra rain jacket, fleece etc or to shed layers and have someplace to store what they took off or put on as the weather changed so they never had it to begin with. They did have wool and or synthetic thermal underwear.
He kept saying he had never had it rain in October and I kept saying it is the mountains and you have to be ready for anything. I guess the moral of this novel is I was happy with how my gear performed and the information I have spent the last 6 months reading on this site
