Future of CO OTC Elk Tags

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I’ve heard whisperings that Colorado OTC elk hunting is going away. Went fishing today and asked a guy from CPW (fisheries biologist from the looks of it, so not his area of expertise). He said they’re debating getting rid of OTC for archery but that it would be a “long drawn out process”.
I can’t imagine they’d completely pull the plug next year, but has anyone else heard this? Seems like it would make more sense to make 2nd/3rd season draw only first.
 
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Would be shocked if it happens next year for even archery. But we are headed down that road eventually. I would welcome it.
 
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Did he specify if it was OTC all together or just unlimited OTC?
Didn’t talk to him long, as he was setting out for more important things than talking to me. But no, he did not. Putting a cap on OTC at the very least for NR would make sense to me.
 
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Agreed. Too many people to be enjoy
I wouldn’t mind if Colorado went to an all draw system for elk.
I wouldn’t mind either. I think it’s headed that way, but doing it immediately when people have been building points for 15 years and hunting OTC when they don’t draw is a PR disaster for CPW. I can foresee them phasing it out incrementally over the next few years.
 

WTFJohn

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I wouldn't mind seeing changes to the OTC system. For the NR talking about $$, they probably don't know that Parks Passes are being added to all vehicle registrations (with an opt-out) at $40/per, which will fund the same things their tags did - new parking lots and bathrooms at state parks, with the leftovers going to Fisheries and Wildlife.

The reality is there is too much recreation and hunting pressure in a lot of areas now due to the population boom in CO and the popularity of western hunting. The animals come out of winter stressed and starving; get pushed around by eager hikers and bikers before calving season, get ravaged by bears and lions during calving season, pushed around more thru the summer (high mtn sunrise pics, 24 hr ultramarathons, backpackers, sheep herders, etc...), bugled at to the point of going silent and nocturnal in Sept by everyone and their cousin, then picked off by rifle hunters on their way to winter range that gets smaller every year due to human encroachment. Drought and fires exacerbate the situation, as the winter range may not have regrown any food (or it grew a subdivision) and the summer range may have burned up.

The trajectory we are on is not sustainable, hopefully it's addressed before we get too far into the 'bust' part of the cycle.
 
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I was just mentioning this the other day. I hunt several different units and this would really put a hitch in my September plans as it's common for me to chase elk from one unit, and end up in the other.
 

Poser

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I wouldn't mind seeing changes to the OTC system. For the NR talking about $$, they probably don't know that Parks Passes are being added to all vehicle registrations (with an opt-out) at $40/per, which will fund the same things their tags did - new parking lots and bathrooms at state parks, with the leftovers going to Fisheries and Wildlife.

The reality is there is too much recreation and hunting pressure in a lot of areas now due to the population boom in CO and the popularity of western hunting. The animals come out of winter stressed and starving; get pushed around by eager hikers and bikers before calving season, get ravaged by bears and lions during calving season, pushed around more thru the summer (high mtn sunrise pics, 24 hr ultramarathons, backpackers, sheep herders, etc...), bugled at to the point of going silent and nocturnal in Sept by everyone and their cousin, then picked off by rifle hunters on their way to winter range that gets smaller every year due to human encroachment. Drought and fires exacerbate the situation, as the winter range may not have regrown any food (or it grew a subdivision) and the summer range may have burned up.

The trajectory we are on is not sustainable, hopefully it's addressed before we get too far into the 'bust' part of the cycle.

Good points and observations and I agree on all aspects. I think the difficult position for CPW is how few of these aspects (recreational pressure effects and habitat fragmentation) they can actually control. Increasing bear tags and killing a few more bears in a low percentage pursuit only has a minuscule effect, but it’s on of the few proactive measures they can take to assist with calf recruitment.

While I don’t expect to see OTC go away in 2022, I think it would be beneficial statewide and 1p and 0p units could easily be maintained with a limited number of tags. I also support splitting archery into 2 seasons. I am always shocked by the amount of archery hunters who come to CO with 30 days of vacation set aside to hunt. I get it, archery is a lower percentage affair, but thousands of guys out in the woods every day for a full 3-4 weeks, many of them staying until every tag in their party is filled is amounting to too much sustained pressure. Split it up into 2 week segments or even 2 10-12 day segments and give MLs their own week or have a break in there.
 

WTFJohn

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Good points and observations and I agree on all aspects. I think the difficult position for CPW is how few of these aspects (recreational pressure effects and habitat fragmentation) they can actually control. Increasing bear tags and killing a few more bears in a low percentage pursuit only has a minuscule effect, but it’s on of the few proactive measures they can take to assist with calf recruitment.

While I don’t expect to see OTC go away in 2022, I think it would be beneficial statewide and 1p and 0p units could easily be maintained with a limited number of tags. I also support splitting archery into 2 seasons. I am always shocked by the amount of archery hunters who come to CO with 30 days of vacation set aside to hunt. I get it, archery is a lower percentage affair, but thousands of guys out in the woods every day for a full 3-4 weeks, many of them staying until every tag in their party is filled is amounting to too much sustained pressure. Split it up into 2 week segments or even 2 10-12 day segments and give MLs their own week or have a break in there.

CPW could open the concurrent mountain lion season for rifle 1-4 like it's written, but weak state-level leadership won't take the heat for it. The cheaper bear tags are a good start though.

I'd expect more units to go off the OTC list during this BGSS, with a full re-evaluation statewide on the next one. Two archery seasons seems like a good step to implement at the same time, but I doubt they'd make that many changes at once.
 
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I think it will be accomplished over time by just gradually converting OTC units to draw. Several units we have hunted OTC in the past have been converted. We chose not to hunt this year rather than try and learn a new unit after we didn't draw our 1st choice. We were totally ok with that BTW.... so it does work. Shoot, some years we just go up and camp if we don't draw. We might scout a bit for subsequent seasons, but we probably spend more time sleeping and hitting the microbreweries than up in the woods.
 

Poser

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I think it will be accomplished over time by just gradually converting OTC units to draw. Several units we have hunted OTC in the past have been converted. We chose not to hunt this year rather than try and learn a new unit after we didn't draw our 1st choice. We were totally ok with that BTW.... so it does work. Shoot, some years we just go up and camp if we don't draw. We might scout a bit for subsequent seasons, but we probably spend more time sleeping and hitting the microbreweries than up in the woods.

This is true. I also think some slight shifts in hunting culture could help here. For example, 2 guys go hunting every year with 2 tags. Maybe it makes more sense for those 2 guys to alternate building 1p and drawing 1 tag and still go hunting together. There is this idea of abundance where a party of 3 must kill 3 bulls or even have 3 tags to make the trip worthwhile for everyone.
 
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This is true. I also think some slight shifts in hunting culture could help here. For example, 2 guys go hunting every year with 2 tags. Maybe it makes more sense for those 2 guys to alternate building 1p and drawing 1 tag and still go hunting together. There is this idea of abundance where a party of 3 must kill 3 bulls or even have 3 tags to make the trip worthwhile for everyone.
We have just as much fun hunting with one gun/bow and one guy calling, etc... My brother has a ton of Utah pts and that is our plan there. I am way behind but by the time we got ready to go back, I'd be the hunter.
 
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We all know there is a way for CPW to do this, make it work and still be good hunting for everyone. However, that wont be the case. It will be changed once the resource has been almost exhausted.
 
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