Gun Trust

[colonel00]

I know there's a whole internet of info out there but sifting through it can be a challenge. Just wondering if anyone has any info to share on setting up a gun trust. Things to know or watch for, etc.

 

[HuntHarder]

Following as well. There has to be some guys on here with some info. Let's hear it

 

[huntinfool84]

I did it through a lawyer paid probably way too much but all my cans are through it but I'm still lost on how to add/remove people and just the general use of it. I'll be watching as well.


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[wapitibob]

Wth is a gun trust ?

 

[colonel00]

I'm still learning all of the intricacies but as I understand it, a gun trust is like an estate trust where you can have trustees that share ownership of something and you can setup transfer of the trust contents upon your death and it doesn't have to go through probate or other steps. This is especially beneficial for NFA items like suppressors, short barreled rifles, etc. Instead of me just going through the tax stamp process, paying the $200 and waiting forever for the gun to be registered to me alone, it is registered to the trust and anyone that is part of the trust can legally use said items.

A quick snip from a page I was just reading:

What a Gun Trust IS
A Gun Trust is, at its roots, an estate planning tool. It is specialized in that it allows for some flexibility when acquiring and transferring National Firearms Act regulated items. This generally refers to Title II items such as suppressors, short-barreled rifles and short-barreled shotguns.

Some of the benefits are:
* More than one person can be a Trustee and can thus possess and use the items held by the Trust without having to request individual permission from your local Chief Law Enforcement Officer (CLEO) or the BATFE.
* Since the items are held in the Trust, if the current Trustee in possession of the item dies, there is no transfer procedure. This, of course, assumes that you have set up the Trust to stay running after your death, and that you have assigned rights to other Trustees.
* Your heirs can avoid probate (of the items in the Trust) since the items are held by the Trust.
* Bypassing an executor of your estate (who may not know the rules related to firearms and how to dispose of NFA items), instead allowing a more qualified Trustee to manage the collection.
* And, of course, the most important benefit: generally faster processing by the BATFE.

What a Gun Trust IS NOT
First off, an NFA Gun Trust is not a way to “get one over” on the BATFE. An NFA Gun Trust will not allow you to violate or bypass state (nor federal) laws and restrictions.

The Trustee purchasing the item on behalf of the Trust must still comply with the Brady Act.
If you want to cross state lines (i.e. “interstate transfer”) with an NFA item (“any destructive device, machine gun, short-barreled rifle, or short-barreled shotgun”; there is no mention on the form regarding suppressors), which includes going to a competition, moving, hunting in another state, etc., you must notify the BATFE months in advance of the crossing via a Form 5320.20. [EDITED]
You cannot take an NFA item to a state that does not allow it. (e.g. you cannot take a short-barreled rifle to Washington, New York or California, as they are illegal to possess in those states). [EDITED: As of Apr 2nd, 2014, SB5956 allows for SBRs in Washington State]
If you plan to move (and take NFA items with you), you must file a Form 20 with the BATFE and let them know what the new registered address of the NFA items is going to be. You must do this many months in advance.
If a Trustee lives out of the state they can still be involved in the trust but can only access and use the restricted items in the state where the trust is registered, or in those states included on the filed Form 20.

Setting Up an NFA Gun Trust - The Firearm BlogThe Firearm Blog

 

[2hand]

It's a big question.

Check this out:
Gun Trusts & NFA Assist - Alex Kincaid Law Firm

I'm not an expert on these things I just know from a few classes from the above attorney and a little reading. You're far better off call the above person and they can fill you in.

That being said, a trust protects your assets under your terms. Trusts also are a living entity so they are able to be the "purchaser" on firearms which is beneficial for all firearms but (to me) more so with NFA fire arms.

Also, since the Trust owns them, and if you get sick or hospitalized, the court is not able to transfer them to another party. Typically once you have a trust, all you need to do to change those in it is complete a form with your attorney. This is important as NFA firearms are not suppose to be out of your control. Anyone on the trust document has full and in restricted access to use.

There is a lot more to them and why they are a smart investment. I'm sure someone more familiar will correct me.


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[colersu22]

NFA Gun Trust - Services

This is what my buddy and his dad used when they started buying cans and he said it was an easy process.

 

[Ohio Darin]

I went with 50-State Compliant ATF-Approved NFA Gun Trusts It was a pretty simple procedure where the website asks you series of questions then generates the trust. Also includes forms for adding and removing trustees. To complete the trust you just need to sign and have notarized. All instructions are clear and straight forward. They run specials here and there and currently $100. What I like about this one is the trust doesn't contain an inventory of your firearms included within the trust. I preferred this as I didn't want to make that information public knowledge.

 

[PresTex]

I’m on my phone so I can’t go too in depth but if I’d say the one thing to keep in mind when forming a gun trust post ATF 41F is who you want to be a “responsible party” on the trust. Before, you could simply put anyone you wanted as a trustee to give them access to any NFA items but after 41F was put in place it changed a few things. Now, anyone on the trust would have to go through the same red tape that an individual has to go through. Fingerprints, background check, photos, etc. I didn’t want to have to deal with this so my trust is set up so that I am that the only responsible party so to speak. The rest of my family has limited powers, meaning they can possess the items but they can’t buy or sell anything in the trust. However, I didnt have to drag everyone around getting fingerprints, photos, etc in order to purchase an NFA item.

That is probably an oversimplification but if you go to any gun trust lawyer with experience I’m sure they have already started doing this as most people want to deal with as little bullshit as possible.

If anyone plans to buy any NFA items, I would recommend buying through Capital Armory north of Austin, Tx. They have a lot of stock and make the process painless. Going through a dealer who doesn’t have a lot of experience can add weeks or months to your wait time and add a lot of headache if they mess up.


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[colonel00]

So has anyone run into issues going the DIY route? Sure seems pretty simple and straight forward but that's no surprise as they are trying to sell you the service. Just wondering if there are any hidden hangups that might make it smarter to go with an attorney.

 

[Ohio Darin]

I thought about doing this myself as we already have other family trusts plus I deal with contracts all the time. It was just too convenient to purchase one. Got it for $80 on sale on a fathers day. I like the idea of being able to ask questions as well vs flying blind. PresTex is correct about the responsible party and mine is set up this way. My wife is the successor trustee and this only comes into play if something should happen to me. She is also the beneficiary of the trust.

 

[fngTony]

I went through it last year. It was part of our trust, estate, living will that we did all at once with a lawyer. Every one has a unique situation with different state laws. Consult a lawyer.

 

[Brado16]

Did mine through NFA Lawyers- Dean was great help and answered any questions I had- Have not added anything prior 41F but mine is setup the same way as PresTex- I am the only responisble persone so with future purchases I will be the only individual to be required to submit photos/prints. Hard to beat for $99.