Help me build a rifle

gabenzeke

WKR
Joined
Oct 28, 2015
Messages
1,117
I've decided I want to slowly put together a custom build using a pre fit barrel. I'm hoping someone can help me with the parts I need based on what I eventually want. I'd like to run a 7 saum with 180 grain bergers. I'm going to use a bartlein carbon barrel, and ideally, I think it would go in an XLR element chassis. Where I'm getting hung up is which medium length action to start with and then which magazine and/or bottom metal that would work with that cartridge and load as well as the chassis and action? Definitely want box magazine rather than a floor plate. Other than barrel and trigger, what am I missing?

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

hereinaz

WKR
Rokslide Sponsor
Joined
Dec 21, 2016
Messages
3,015
Location
Arizona
Have you considered 7 Sherman Short Mag? It is a true short action. With a 26" tube I am getting 3050 fps with 180 Berger vld and RL 26. Can get those speeds with VV powders too. I run M5 bottom metal with Accurate mags. Its amazing for ease of loading and performance. I like that it is a small action, lighter and proven, and tons of choices for everything.

7 saum is best run in a medium action to get full benefit of the long bullets. I think you have it covered. I would choose Defiance for their XM.

The 180 is a great choice. It has hammered everything with one shot in the vitals. One deer ran 30 yards. 3 deer, 2 caribou, and 1 elk tipped over where they stood.

Take a look at the McMillan sentry if you want a chassis like stock.
 
OP
G

gabenzeke

WKR
Joined
Oct 28, 2015
Messages
1,117
Have you considered 7 Sherman Short Mag? It is a true short action. With a 26" tube I am getting 3050 fps with 180 Berger vld and RL 26. Can get those speeds with VV powders too. I run M5 bottom metal with Accurate mags. Its amazing for ease of loading and performance. I like that it is a small action, lighter and proven, and tons of choices for everything.

7 saum is best run in a medium action to get full benefit of the long bullets. I think you have it covered. I would choose Defiance for their XM.

The 180 is a great choice. It has hammered everything with one shot in the vitals. One deer ran 30 yards. 3 deer, 2 caribou, and 1 elk tipped over where they stood.

Take a look at the McMillan sentry if you want a chassis like stock.
Funny you mention it, I did go down the rabbit hole with the sherman calibers. Initially, I was going to have a smith put this together, but then I learned more about prefits and figured why not do it myself. The smith talked me out of the sherman calibers, though I specifically asked about the 7 max. So the 7ss fits in a regular short action even with the heavies? I'd be running a 22 inch tube, so likely would get quite a bit less velocity. How are you sourcing/making brass in times when ammo isn't rarer than unicorns? I'm actually considering selling my 300 rum to fund this project, but want to make sure it'll work on elk, moose, and bears no problem.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

hereinaz

WKR
Rokslide Sponsor
Joined
Dec 21, 2016
Messages
3,015
Location
Arizona
Your smith did you no favor, IMO. The cost of spinning up a barrel is a wash with what you can save going short action. I wonder what his reasoning was to not go Sherman. Maybe he has a point, but I haven't seen one that convinced me.

You want an awesome gun, then pay for it. Don't skimp. A prefit Proof vs what I can get you a Proof blank and a chamber job is minimal. A couple hundred bucks. I own a 7ss reamer and my smith has it. You can use it. PM me if you want to discuss it in detail. What you can save by getting a short action vs an XM will pay for it.

Rich has brass, which is good ADG brass.

No one will bat an eye at a 180 grain 30-06 for all the critters you want to kill. You can run the 180 partitions for bear and moose if you like and 180 vld for everything else. At 2950, they will smash stuff.

You can get a minimum of 2900 fps out of the 7ss and 180s with a 22" barrel. Max will push over 3000 fps I am building a 22" 7SS the next time. I expect 2950. If you want more, run the max and the 180s in the XM. They are a better case design than the saum.

Yes, I run 180 vld loaded long in an Accurate WSM mag in Hawkins bottom metal. Its designed for that.

Here is my 11 pound rifle, as is. And there is my hunting zero. Yeah yeah, other holes, but those are from another rifle. I can post a video showing half moa group at 500 yards and poking a sitka at 575 right in his chest. I love it.20201031_143200.jpg20210302_072340.jpg20210309_194714.jpg
 

Str8shtr

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Oct 4, 2017
Messages
125
You'll be pry be limited by mag length if you use a chassis. The 7 saum with 180s really doesn't work in a short action too well. I'm guessing you'd have a tough time finding a chassis for a medium length action. The 7ss with 180s will run in a short action. You could do a tikka action and get a prefit in 7 saum. Tikkas work great with the short mag cases. With a true short action the only good option is a 7ss.
 

hereinaz

WKR
Rokslide Sponsor
Joined
Dec 21, 2016
Messages
3,015
Location
Arizona
You'll be pry be limited by mag length if you use a chassis. The 7 saum with 180s really doesn't work in a short action too well. I'm guessing you'd have a tough time finding a chassis for a medium length action. The 7ss with 180s will run in a short action. You could do a tikka action and get a prefit in 7 saum. Tikkas work great with the short mag cases. With a true short action the only good option is a 7ss.
Right on all points... Tikka is a medium action an excellent option for 7 saum, but I don't know if the chassis is made for it.
 
Joined
Sep 19, 2020
Messages
96
How about a defiance XM? Calling for a 3.2 max COAL and if I’m not mistaken the tenacity as well as the ruckus accept prefits. Might be going a different route on your chassis options tho I know mpa makes their ba comp with a xm action length
 

wyosam

WKR
Joined
Aug 5, 2019
Messages
982
XLR element is made for tikka, and should work very well. The tikka action is perfect for those rounds that are technically short action, but are really handicapped in a SA with long bullets.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
OP
G

gabenzeke

WKR
Joined
Oct 28, 2015
Messages
1,117
Your smith did you no favor, IMO. The cost of spinning up a barrel is a wash with what you can save going short action. I wonder what his reasoning was to not go Sherman. Maybe he has a point, but I haven't seen one that convinced me.

You want an awesome gun, then pay for it. Don't skimp. A prefit Proof vs what I can get you a Proof blank and a chamber job is minimal. A couple hundred bucks. I own a 7ss reamer and my smith has it. You can use it. PM me if you want to discuss it in detail. What you can save by getting a short action vs an XM will pay for it.

Rich has brass, which is good ADG brass.

No one will bat an eye at a 180 grain 30-06 for all the critters you want to kill. You can run the 180 partitions for bear and moose if you like and 180 vld for everything else. At 2950, they will smash stuff.

You can get a minimum of 2900 fps out of the 7ss and 180s with a 22" barrel. Max will push over 3000 fps I am building a 22" 7SS the next time. I expect 2950. If you want more, run the max and the 180s in the XM. They are a better case design than the saum.

Yes, I run 180 vld loaded long in an Accurate WSM mag in Hawkins bottom metal. Its designed for that.

Here is my 11 pound rifle, as is. And there is my hunting zero. Yeah yeah, other holes, but those are from another rifle. I can post a video showing half moa group at 500 yards and poking a sitka at 575 right in his chest. I love it.View attachment 282198View attachment 282199View attachment 282200
I just went back and read the email, he didn't provide much detail, just that he wasn't impressed with the max, and it was less work to shoot the saum or wsm and they will do the job. I'm all but sold on the sherman, but does he have brass on hand? I was under the impression the only way to get brass now was to buy dies and he'd sell you 50 pcs of brass that way. I just may pm you to discuss the reamer, just doing a little more research. I appreciate your help.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

hereinaz

WKR
Rokslide Sponsor
Joined
Dec 21, 2016
Messages
3,015
Location
Arizona
Yeah, the max, wsm and saum can do it, but not in a short action. 2900 is plenty of velocity to hammer really far.

I don't want to try to hard to convince you. You don't have a bad plan with the wsm.

If 7ss hits all the check boxes, buy the dies and get the 50 brass. Put more on order. I think he has some 338 headstamped but its all 7mm SS from ADG now. 50 is plenty to get started. Load development is too easy. At least you know where and how to get good brass. In a pinch you can use 7 saum.

I have some extra I might sell. I think a buddy may have extra too.

The reamer is brand new.


20210414_073955.jpg
 
Joined
Oct 6, 2020
Messages
1,192
Location
northwest
I've decided I want to slowly put together a custom build using a pre fit barrel. I'm hoping someone can help me with the parts I need based on what I eventually want. I'd like to run a 7 saum with 180 grain bergers. I'm going to use a bartlein carbon barrel, and ideally, I think it would go in an XLR element chassis. Where I'm getting hung up is which medium length action to start with and then which magazine and/or bottom metal that would work with that cartridge and load as well as the chassis and action? Definitely want box magazine rather than a floor plate. Other than barrel and trigger, what am I missing?

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
I imagine you're trying to keep your build fairly light so here's a few suggestions having built something similar.
I have a 22" 7 wsm that I can switch out to 30 nosler on a defiance anTi LA.
The anTi is awesome and the wsm loaded to 3.2" with 195's feeds perfectly.
I'd get the xm length without a doubt for the saum.
Are you dead set on a chassis style stock?
I personally don't like them for hunting, in my opinion there are better CF stocks out there that you could use with DBM bottom metal.
Just a thought..

As for the Sherman mags I had one and was not impressed at all, mine was the 30 Sherman and I only got a 50 fps increase over the standard prc.
Fire forming was a PITA and hardly worth it for such a small gain, my 30 nos is 2" shorter and still beat the 30 SM with only 2 extra grains of H1000.
I really dig the wsm with its 35 degree shoulder, high velocity, and effortless accuracy.
Nothing against the saum though it's just slower
 
Joined
Dec 30, 2014
Messages
8,175
Yeah, the max, wsm and saum can do it, but not in a short action. 2900 is plenty of velocity to hammer really far.

I don't want to try to hard to convince you. You don't have a bad plan with the wsm.

If 7ss hits all the check boxes, buy the dies and get the 50 brass. Put more on order. I think he has some 338 headstamped but its all 7mm SS from ADG now. 50 is plenty to get started. Load development is too easy. At least you know where and how to get good brass. In a pinch you can use 7 saum.

I have some extra I might sell. I think a buddy may have extra too.

The reamer is brand new.


View attachment 282262

Brass doesn't look like 40 degree shoulders, I'm assuming the 7SS brass needs to be fireformed?

I believe XLR makes a XM length element so there is no issue there beyond the fact that your options are pretty limited for XM legnth magazines. Might be easier to flip a short action element if OP decides it isn't for them too.

I chose SAUM over SS because I already had SAUM dies from my early days of 6.5 SAUM when brass had to be formed from 7 and didn't want to deal with fireforming. 7SS is a very intriguing option for running a short action though.
 

hereinaz

WKR
Rokslide Sponsor
Joined
Dec 21, 2016
Messages
3,015
Location
Arizona
Brass doesn't look like 40 degree shoulders, I'm assuming the 7SS brass needs to be fireformed?

I believe XLR makes a XM length element so there is no issue there beyond the fact that your options are pretty limited for XM legnth magazines. Might be easier to flip a short action element if OP decides it isn't for them too.

I chose SAUM over SS because I already had SAUM dies from my early days of 6.5 SAUM when brass had to be formed from 7 and didn't want to deal with fireforming. 7SS is a very intriguing option for running a short action though.
Yes, this is his old brass, made to 7ss specs but needs fireformed. 7 saum brass needs trimming and neck turning I think to use as 7ss.

Funny, like 6br, fireforming loads are awesome.

7 saum and wsm can both make it happen. The 7ss just checks all the boxes for me. I couldn't settle for less than everything, and short action is what made it easy over anything else once I saw the 180 at 3000 fps in a 26" barrel.
 

hereinaz

WKR
Rokslide Sponsor
Joined
Dec 21, 2016
Messages
3,015
Location
Arizona
I imagine you're trying to keep your build fairly light so here's a few suggestions having built something similar.
I have a 22" 7 wsm that I can switch out to 30 nosler on a defiance anTi LA.
The anTi is awesome and the wsm loaded to 3.2" with 195's feeds perfectly.
I'd get the xm length without a doubt for the saum.
Are you dead set on a chassis style stock?
I personally don't like them for hunting, in my opinion there are better CF stocks out there that you could use with DBM bottom metal.
Just a thought..

As for the Sherman mags I had one and was not impressed at all, mine was the 30 Sherman and I only got a 50 fps increase over the standard prc.
Fire forming was a PITA and hardly worth it for such a small gain, my 30 nos is 2" shorter and still beat the 30 SM with only 2 extra grains of H1000.
I really dig the wsm with its 35 degree shoulder, high velocity, and effortless accuracy.
Nothing against the saum though it's just slower
Yeah, there isn't much there on the 30 sm. Doesn't do anything for me either over the other 30 cal offerings.

But, the 7 ss is faster and fits easily in a short action mags. That's where the juice is worth the extra squeeze. Fireforming is easy and shooting 100 rounds helped me break in and learn the rifle. I didn't just burn them on paper. I am already shooting a lot, and so none of it was wasted.

If a guy already has a long or xm action, then there isn't much difference between wsm, saum and ss.
 
OP
G

gabenzeke

WKR
Joined
Oct 28, 2015
Messages
1,117
I imagine you're trying to keep your build fairly light so here's a few suggestions having built something similar.
I have a 22" 7 wsm that I can switch out to 30 nosler on a defiance anTi LA.
The anTi is awesome and the wsm loaded to 3.2" with 195's feeds perfectly.
I'd get the xm length without a doubt for the saum.
Are you dead set on a chassis style stock?
I personally don't like them for hunting, in my opinion there are better CF stocks out there that you could use with DBM bottom metal.
Just a thought..

As for the Sherman mags I had one and was not impressed at all, mine was the 30 Sherman and I only got a 50 fps increase over the standard prc.
Fire forming was a PITA and hardly worth it for such a small gain, my 30 nos is 2" shorter and still beat the 30 SM with only 2 extra grains of H1000.
I really dig the wsm with its 35 degree shoulder, high velocity, and effortless accuracy.
Nothing against the saum though it's just slower
Any suggestions on stocks? Not totally set on a chassis

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

hereinaz

WKR
Rokslide Sponsor
Joined
Dec 21, 2016
Messages
3,015
Location
Arizona
AG composite is an excellent choice. Mcmillian and Manners are gold srandard. I didn't bed my AG or McMillan and both shoot great. I had an adjustable check AG, but sold it to save weight and I learned to shoot without it.

I like the feel of stocks more than chassis. In cold weather, its nice holding fiberglass and carbon fiber over aluminum or magnesium.

IMO, unless you love chassis, go with a stock that fits. I wouldn't experiment with it. But, that's me.
 
Joined
Mar 1, 2017
Messages
1,934
Location
Eagle River, AK
If you are building on a medium action and plan to use drop magazine and sort of DIY then definitely look at the 7 WSM. You will get more performance with the heavies than a 7saum. (I have a 7 SAUM in a short action, which is what it was designed for)
 
OP
G

gabenzeke

WKR
Joined
Oct 28, 2015
Messages
1,117
Ok, I think this is my last question, other than borden, does anyone make a short action in right bolt left port? Bonus if it's titanium.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 
Joined
Oct 6, 2020
Messages
1,192
Location
northwest
Any suggestions on stocks? Not totally set on a chassis

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
I like the McMillan game hunter but it was a little short for me on length of pull (I have long arms)
Now I use an Allterra Arms carbon hunter and really dig it.
I see you're looking into Titanium, do some research there are downsides to going that route.
I had one once, never again
 
Top