HVAC new AC and Furnace, which Company?

[Billinsd]

I'm in San Diego, about 13 miles inland. Don't need much heat, don't need much AC, except from July to mid Sept, especially late August/early September could be 100F!!!

I looked at google reviews and got proposals from 5 companies. After meeting with 5 representatives, I decided I want a basic condenser AC and gas furnace and new duct work, 6 ducts. The house is 38 years old with original furnace, no AC, and no roof solar. I figured more efficient and more expensive AC and furnace heat pump systems will take me over 10 years to break even on cost. So, basic is for me.

In San Diego the HVAC business appears EXTREMELY CUT THROAT and if I'm not careful I'll get royally screwed!!

First company to come out, One hour heating and Air Francise representatives were super nice, tried to get real cozy with me. One guy was a hunter other lived close to me. They quoted $29,000 for a hybrid AC, heat pump and furnace with $2,000 "manager" special! $27,000. They tried to pressure me to do the work two days later for $18,000, dropped their price "to keep their crews busy" and it's not summer yet. I told the guy, if I was stupid I could have paid you $9,000 for more profit, I don't want to hire you, you have no morals or ethics!!!

After getting more proposals, I realized I just wanted a simple system. Basic AC, and furnace single stage and new duct work. Got prices down to $13k.

One hour heating and air rep said the company that quoted my $13k is terrible, they just throw it all together and are "owned by Russians". That's why they are rock bottom.

Can anyone give me advise on picking a company and what to look out for? Hep me please. LOL Bill

 

[Jpsmith1]

I'm happy to help.

If you'd like to message me we could even speak on the phone later if you'd like.

One Hour franchises are notorious for pressure sales tactics. $30k for an HVAC system is absolutely bugf*ck nuts unless they're replacing every piece of ductwork.

Manuals J, D and S are really important, especially in California. Probably code mandated on changeouts. Problem is, a dishonest person can pencilwhip the numbers and make anything work.

 

[Weldor]

Crazy numbers for sure. I replaced my 5 ton heatpump just after covid and new fed requirements. (old one dumped of course.) $6900 with crane and some new ductwork installed. Find a local owned company owner operator . Usually when you mett them you can tell if they are up and up. They have low overhead so prices usually reflect that.

 

[GSPHUNTER]

Give this guy a try. [email protected]. He put in two systems for me and a system for my friend. I work a/c for 38 years, he does nice work. I'm to old to be crawling around in the attic.

 

[2531usmc]

Home Depot and Lowe’s offfer home repair services like windows and hvac services. You pay somewhat of a premium, but you know they are not cheating you and they stand behind the work

 

[Bluefish]

For cost comparison, I just had a 3 ton a/c and 180k btu heater replaced last fall. Did a few minor duct changes. Was $12k. Installer said prices were going up 20% in 2025 due to a regulation change. Our old system was done by someone who didn’t know what they were doing. Lasted 25 years even though it didn’t have the air flow needed. I would say ask neighbors and workmates for recommendations.

 

[eddielasvegas]

Home Depot and Lowe’s offfer home repair services like windows and hvac services. You pay somewhat of a premium, but you know they are not cheating you and they stand behind the work

Not true based on my experience. That was my logic in 2010 when I contacted HD about replacing our 2 zone systems. Of course, HD contracts with a local installer and maybe if you get a good one (I did not) this approach will work. Most installers are crooks or incompetent.

As an example, and well after our install, the HD installer wanted $600 to replace 2 run capacitors. Yes, you read that right. And even though I had P&L warranty, whatever work or repair was needed it was always somehow not covered.

I was on a first name basis with the HD district manager. A true corprorate tool if there ever was one.

Good luck OP.

Eddie

 

[woods89]

You really need to find someone familiar with your local construction scene and get some referrals. Most homeowners don't have the tools to sort it out just by having multiple sales people show up. Not trying to be insulting here, but it's the reality I see as a GC.

I'd steer clear of the 13k company. The $9,000 price drop with the other company would also be a deal breaker for me, as that doesn't give me much confidence in them.

You need someone who's been in business for some time, has good referrals and a decent warranty, and whose prices actually mean something. You just have to find them, lol.

Wish you good luck!

 

[Billinsd]

I’ve narrowed it down. I talked to an owner of one company last night. He gave me the history of HVAC in San Diego for the last 35 years. These guys all know each other and it sounds like a really hard and crazy business!! They all trash each other and some of it is true. I had to learn about residential systems, new systems, California regulations and guess the future. I learned something from each salesman, company and doing research. I don’t have solar, don’t plan to, because it would take me 15+ years to break even. I want to go with R410 Freon that’s being phased out. I want a simple two phase furnace, mostly because it’s quieter. And I want a simple condenser, Seer 15 2 if fine. One place only has heat pumps, but the price is about the same as a condenser, owners said $300 more. I don’t have to use the compressor. I’m going with simple, tried and true Trane equipment and T410. Low proposal is $13k with 6 new ducts. I’ll probably go next proposal at $14k, because this company has a better vibe and the $13k company has a very shady reputation. Thanks all!!!!
Bill

 

[Jpsmith1]

Home Depot and Lowe’s offfer home repair services like windows and hvac services. You pay somewhat of a premium, but you know they are not cheating you and they stand behind the work

Generally not the highest quality work. You pay a premium because 2 companies are making a profit.

 

[Jpsmith1]

I’ve narrowed it down. I talked to an owner of one company last night. He gave me the history of HVAC in San Diego for the last 35 years. These guys all know each other and it sounds like a really hard and crazy business!! They all trash each other and some of it is true. I had to learn about residential systems, new systems, California regulations and guess the future. I learned something from each salesman, company and doing research. I don’t have solar, don’t plan to, because it would take me 15+ years to break even. I want to go with R410 Freon that’s being phased out. I want a simple two phase furnace, mostly because it’s quieter. And I want a simple condenser, Seer 15 2 if fine. One place only has heat pumps, but the price is about the same as a condenser, owners said $300 more. I don’t have to use the compressor. I’m going with simple, tried and true Trane equipment and T410. Low proposal is $13k with 6 new ducts. I’ll probably go next proposal at $14k, because this company has a better vibe and the $13k company has a very shady reputation. Thanks all!!!!
Bill

I'd caution against 410a.

Current WHOLESALE Prices of R22 are in excess of $50/lb and companies are charging 250+ per pound for it. 410a will follow within the lifespan of the new equipment you're buying.

Don't buy the hype about A2l refrigerants being dangerous. They just aren’t

 

[Billinsd]

I'd steer clear of the 13k company. The $9,000 price drop with the other company would also be a deal breaker for me, as that doesn't give me much confidence in them.

You need someone who's been in business for some time, has good referrals and a decent warranty, and whose prices actually mean something. You just have to find them, lol.

Yep, yep, and yep! The $9,000 drop has become $12,000 LOL!!! The problem with referrals is there’s a lot of accusations of companies buying reviews, etc. Other Contractors said the $13K guy sued Yelp to remove a bad review. A co-worker said his relatives that are distant relations to this company, said the steer clear! Thanks Bill

 

[Billinsd]

I'd caution against 410a.

Current WHOLESALE Prices of R22 are in excess of $50/lb and companies are charging 250+ per pound for it. 410a will follow within the lifespan of the new equipment you're buying.

Don't buy the hype about A2l refrigerants being dangerous. They just aren’t

Only guy that told me that wants to sell me A21 system. Most guys said 410a is a gamble, like you said. Only downside with A21 is its new technology, could be bugs, etc. Others said 410a is a gamble, you are right!

 

[Billinsd]

I'd caution against 410a.

Current WHOLESALE Prices of R22 are in excess of $50/lb and companies are charging 250+ per pound for it. 410a will follow within the lifespan of the new equipment you're buying.

Don't buy the hype about A2l refrigerants being dangerous. They just aren’t

How does this look? Price is $15,600 after rebates etc.
Thanks Bill


Scope of Work:

• Install TRUE variable speed, TRUE communicating, high efficiency, all electric heat pump system
• Enlarge and relocate ducts in attic to insulated R-6 ducts with air balance dampers as needed
• Replace and relocate thermostat to upstairs (comes with 12 months of free cloud service)
• All supply registers will be upgraded to bar style

System​

Daikin DH7VS-ENERGY STAR CERT Heat Pump 3 Ton​

Condenser

Daikin, 17.5 SEER2 Enhanced Variable Speed Inverter Heat Pump with R-32, 3 Ton, Heat Pump​

As part of the FIT series, the Daikin Fit system is a side discharge, smart HVAC system that won’t compromise on comfort and connects to ducted solutions traditional to the unitary market. - In a market saturated with expensive high-tiered inverters, the system provides a premium mid-efficiency inverter at an affordable rate. - The low profile of the outdoor unit offers solutions when a traditional cube style cannot.
Read More
Includes14 items

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

FVE-R32-36k- 115V 115V Daikin FIT VariableSpeed ECM Multi-Position, Air Handler with Internal EEV Communicating and R-32 Refrigerant​

DFVE-R32 115V 115V Daikin FIT VariableSpeed ECM Multi-Position, Air Handlerwith Internal EEV Communicating andR-32 Refrigerant.
Read More

Air Quality / Quantity: 1

Daikin Merv 15 - Air Filter & Cabinet​

The Daikin. . One. Premium Air Cleaner is an in-line air cleaner that treats home air for certain airborne particulate matter and chemicals found in the home. The high efficiency MERV 15 media filter removes more than 85% of particles down to 0.3 microns in size at rated flow. The Daikin. One. Premium Air Cleaner also includes a room temperature catalyst (RTC) insert that helps remove formaldehyde and ozone from the air stream. Intuitively designed with outer dimensions that match original equipment furnace and air handler cabinets for quick installation. Whole home filtration. Go beyond just merely heating and cooling the air in your home,
Read More

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

Daikin Warranty - 12 Years Parts, 2 Years Labor & 5 Year Unit Replacment Guarantee​

System comes with a manufacturers parts warranty of 12 years and Guthrie and Sons labor warranty for 2 years from the date of completion. *Daikin also carries a 5 year unit replacment guarentee for major component failure. Please refer to the manufacutures warranty for more details as well as limits and restrictions regarding unit replacment under warranty.
Read More

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

Surge Protection For Indoor and Outdoor Unit - A Must With Every Install​

Power surges are the silent killer for home appliances and HVAC equipment. Most homeowners protect their electronics, but leave more valued equipment unsecured. Surges can wipe out equipment and leave you searching for answers. Search no more. The easy-to-install AG3000 surge protector is the perfect add-on for HVAC equipment. AG3000 HVAC Surge Protection. Connects to the HVAC disconnect to protect high-efficiency furnaces, a/c systems, hydronic heating systems, and ductless mini-splits from surges and spikes. Status indicator for diagnostics. Model Overview:. - 120/240 VAC Single Split Phase SPD for use on a variety of HVAC Equipment. - Only
Read More

Services / Quantity: 1

Furnace (or) Air Handler Code Kit​

Includes, plenum, disconnect (or) power cord, fuses, gas flex w/ valve and drip leg (if needed).
Read More

Services / Quantity: 1

A/C (or) Heat Pump Installation Code Kit​

Level ground a sneeded, install new equipment pad, power disconnect, whip, and slow-blow fuses as required by the State and local code.
Read More

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

Water Safety Float Switch​

Install Safety Float Switch On Indoor A-Coil As Needed For Drain Protection On A/C Unit. - The most reliable switch on the market. - Magnetic reed switch. - Easy to install, no need to be level.

 

[Reburn]

How does this look? Price is $15,600 after rebates etc.
Thanks Bill


Scope of Work:

• Install TRUE variable speed, TRUE communicating, high efficiency, all electric heat pump system
• Enlarge and relocate ducts in attic to insulated R-6 ducts with air balance dampers as needed
• Replace and relocate thermostat to upstairs (comes with 12 months of free cloud service)
• All supply registers will be upgraded to bar style

System​

Daikin DH7VS-ENERGY STAR CERT Heat Pump 3 Ton​

Condenser

Daikin, 17.5 SEER2 Enhanced Variable Speed Inverter Heat Pump with R-32, 3 Ton, Heat Pump​

As part of the FIT series, the Daikin Fit system is a side discharge, smart HVAC system that won’t compromise on comfort and connects to ducted solutions traditional to the unitary market. - In a market saturated with expensive high-tiered inverters, the system provides a premium mid-efficiency inverter at an affordable rate. - The low profile of the outdoor unit offers solutions when a traditional cube style cannot.
Read More
Includes14 items

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

FVE-R32-36k- 115V 115V Daikin FIT VariableSpeed ECM Multi-Position, Air Handler with Internal EEV Communicating and R-32 Refrigerant​

DFVE-R32 115V 115V Daikin FIT VariableSpeed ECM Multi-Position, Air Handlerwith Internal EEV Communicating andR-32 Refrigerant.
Read More

Air Quality / Quantity: 1

Daikin Merv 15 - Air Filter & Cabinet​

The Daikin. . One. Premium Air Cleaner is an in-line air cleaner that treats home air for certain airborne particulate matter and chemicals found in the home. The high efficiency MERV 15 media filter removes more than 85% of particles down to 0.3 microns in size at rated flow. The Daikin. One. Premium Air Cleaner also includes a room temperature catalyst (RTC) insert that helps remove formaldehyde and ozone from the air stream. Intuitively designed with outer dimensions that match original equipment furnace and air handler cabinets for quick installation. Whole home filtration. Go beyond just merely heating and cooling the air in your home,
Read More

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

Daikin Warranty - 12 Years Parts, 2 Years Labor & 5 Year Unit Replacment Guarantee​

System comes with a manufacturers parts warranty of 12 years and Guthrie and Sons labor warranty for 2 years from the date of completion. *Daikin also carries a 5 year unit replacment guarentee for major component failure. Please refer to the manufacutures warranty for more details as well as limits and restrictions regarding unit replacment under warranty.
Read More

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

Surge Protection For Indoor and Outdoor Unit - A Must With Every Install​

Power surges are the silent killer for home appliances and HVAC equipment. Most homeowners protect their electronics, but leave more valued equipment unsecured. Surges can wipe out equipment and leave you searching for answers. Search no more. The easy-to-install AG3000 surge protector is the perfect add-on for HVAC equipment. AG3000 HVAC Surge Protection. Connects to the HVAC disconnect to protect high-efficiency furnaces, a/c systems, hydronic heating systems, and ductless mini-splits from surges and spikes. Status indicator for diagnostics. Model Overview:. - 120/240 VAC Single Split Phase SPD for use on a variety of HVAC Equipment. - Only
Read More

Services / Quantity: 1

Furnace (or) Air Handler Code Kit​

Includes, plenum, disconnect (or) power cord, fuses, gas flex w/ valve and drip leg (if needed).
Read More

Services / Quantity: 1

A/C (or) Heat Pump Installation Code Kit​

Level ground a sneeded, install new equipment pad, power disconnect, whip, and slow-blow fuses as required by the State and local code.
Read More

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

Water Safety Float Switch​

Install Safety Float Switch On Indoor A-Coil As Needed For Drain Protection On A/C Unit. - The most reliable switch on the market. - Magnetic reed switch. - Easy to install, no need to be level.

I would insist on r-8 ducting for the same price for starters.

 

[Jlosee]

I am not familiar with Daikin but I also live on the East coast so may be more regional

 

[woods89]

Yep, yep, and yep! The $9,000 drop has become $12,000 LOL!!! The problem with referrals is there’s a lot of accusations of companies buying reviews, etc. Other Contractors said the $13K guy sued Yelp to remove a bad review. A co-worker said his relatives that are distant relations to this company, said the steer clear! Thanks Bill

The repeated price drops is not a good look........

If you have someone who works in the building trades that you know, their recommendations are going to carry more weight than Google reviews in my opinion. I realize that's probably a lot easier in my small town setting than San Diego.

 

[Billinsd]

I am not familiar with Daikin but I also live on the East coast so may be more regional

It's relatively new in US. It's been used in Europe for a while successfully. The company I'm looking at has been installing them for a while.

 

[Jpsmith1]

How does this look? Price is $15,600 after rebates etc.
Thanks Bill


Scope of Work:

• Install TRUE variable speed, TRUE communicating, high efficiency, all electric heat pump system
• Enlarge and relocate ducts in attic to insulated R-6 ducts with air balance dampers as needed
• Replace and relocate thermostat to upstairs (comes with 12 months of free cloud service)
• All supply registers will be upgraded to bar style

System​

Daikin DH7VS-ENERGY STAR CERT Heat Pump 3 Ton​

Condenser

Daikin, 17.5 SEER2 Enhanced Variable Speed Inverter Heat Pump with R-32, 3 Ton, Heat Pump​

As part of the FIT series, the Daikin Fit system is a side discharge, smart HVAC system that won’t compromise on comfort and connects to ducted solutions traditional to the unitary market. - In a market saturated with expensive high-tiered inverters, the system provides a premium mid-efficiency inverter at an affordable rate. - The low profile of the outdoor unit offers solutions when a traditional cube style cannot.
Read More
Includes14 items

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

FVE-R32-36k- 115V 115V Daikin FIT VariableSpeed ECM Multi-Position, Air Handler with Internal EEV Communicating and R-32 Refrigerant​

DFVE-R32 115V 115V Daikin FIT VariableSpeed ECM Multi-Position, Air Handlerwith Internal EEV Communicating andR-32 Refrigerant.
Read More

Air Quality / Quantity: 1

Daikin Merv 15 - Air Filter & Cabinet​

The Daikin. . One. Premium Air Cleaner is an in-line air cleaner that treats home air for certain airborne particulate matter and chemicals found in the home. The high efficiency MERV 15 media filter removes more than 85% of particles down to 0.3 microns in size at rated flow. The Daikin. One. Premium Air Cleaner also includes a room temperature catalyst (RTC) insert that helps remove formaldehyde and ozone from the air stream. Intuitively designed with outer dimensions that match original equipment furnace and air handler cabinets for quick installation. Whole home filtration. Go beyond just merely heating and cooling the air in your home,
Read More

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

Daikin Warranty - 12 Years Parts, 2 Years Labor & 5 Year Unit Replacment Guarantee​

System comes with a manufacturers parts warranty of 12 years and Guthrie and Sons labor warranty for 2 years from the date of completion. *Daikin also carries a 5 year unit replacment guarentee for major component failure. Please refer to the manufacutures warranty for more details as well as limits and restrictions regarding unit replacment under warranty.
Read More

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

Surge Protection For Indoor and Outdoor Unit - A Must With Every Install​

Power surges are the silent killer for home appliances and HVAC equipment. Most homeowners protect their electronics, but leave more valued equipment unsecured. Surges can wipe out equipment and leave you searching for answers. Search no more. The easy-to-install AG3000 surge protector is the perfect add-on for HVAC equipment. AG3000 HVAC Surge Protection. Connects to the HVAC disconnect to protect high-efficiency furnaces, a/c systems, hydronic heating systems, and ductless mini-splits from surges and spikes. Status indicator for diagnostics. Model Overview:. - 120/240 VAC Single Split Phase SPD for use on a variety of HVAC Equipment. - Only
Read More

Services / Quantity: 1

Furnace (or) Air Handler Code Kit​

Includes, plenum, disconnect (or) power cord, fuses, gas flex w/ valve and drip leg (if needed).
Read More

Services / Quantity: 1

A/C (or) Heat Pump Installation Code Kit​

Level ground a sneeded, install new equipment pad, power disconnect, whip, and slow-blow fuses as required by the State and local code.
Read More

HVAC Add-Ons / Quantity: 1

Water Safety Float Switch​

Install Safety Float Switch On Indoor A-Coil As Needed For Drain Protection On A/C Unit. - The most reliable switch on the market. - Magnetic reed switch. - Easy to install, no need to be level.

Daikin is solid equipment. I'm not super sure about surge protectors and electronic air cleaners. They're upsale items that aren't as vital to the operation of the machine as they want you to believe. A solid higher MERV filter, replaced regularly does all you need. Unless you have medical conditions aggravated by those VOCs it's not worth it IMO.

Surge protectors can be hit or miss. I just read where certain ones at the bottom of the quality spectrum have caused multiple fires. These are NOT the one specified in your quote.

After fifth house fire, Cary firefighters warn residents of hazardous surge protectors

Investigators have determined that a house fire in December was linked to a faulty surge protector.

www.wral.com

Inverter heat pumps are super quiet and, installed properly are very reliable.

Pricing is a big variable. I can't really comment on it because the costs of labor are very different in the big city than they are in Podunk where I live.

 

[Reburn]

Daikin is solid equipment. I'm not super sure about surge protectors and electronic air cleaners. They're upsale items that aren't as vital to the operation of the machine as they want you to believe. A solid higher MERV filter, replaced regularly does all you need. Unless you have medical conditions aggravated by those VOCs it's not worth it IMO.

Surge protectors can be hit or miss. I just read where certain ones at the bottom of the quality spectrum have caused multiple fires. These are NOT the one specified in your quote.

After fifth house fire, Cary firefighters warn residents of hazardous surge protectors

Investigators have determined that a house fire in December was linked to a faulty surge protector.

www.wral.com

Inverter heat pumps are super quiet and, installed properly are very reliable.

Pricing is a big variable. I can't really comment on it because the costs of labor are very different in the big city than they are in Podunk where I live.

Worth noting I was an early adopter of the carrier multi speed / green speed systems. Burned up a few compressors before we figured out that ANY surge would / could fry the compressor. I have surge protectors on the disconnects for both inside and out now. I think its pretty important that high quality surge protectors like you reccomended are used.