Layering Strategies

[GoldenTriangle]

Most of my kit consists of First Lite gear but this question isn't specific to any brand. I've seen multiple threads on here regarding someone's take that merino wool garments are unnecessary for purely stationary hunting, or that multiple layers of wool aren't ideal (i.e. no reason to layer llano, chama, labrador, etc.) for stationary hunting, or that "puffy" garments shouldn't be compressed by layering over them, or that fleece is vastly superior to wool when stationary. Anyone have any thoughts on these concepts?

 

[Felix40]

The heavier wool pieces from fl are almost useless imo. They are heavy and dont keep you very warm especially if the wind is blowing. Id say a fleece with windstopper would be way more useful than something like a labrador. I was pretty interested in buying a labrador until I handled one.

 

[larryschwartz]

Most of my kit consists of First Lite gear but this question isn't specific to any brand. I've seen multiple threads on here regarding someone's take that merino wool garments are unnecessary for purely stationary hunting, or that multiple layers of wool aren't ideal (i.e. no reason to layer llano, chama, labrador, etc.) for stationary hunting, or that "puffy" garments shouldn't be compressed by layering over them, or that fleece is vastly superior to wool when stationary. Anyone have any thoughts on these concepts?

Like many things, those comments are probably based on someones experience in a specific scenario and may not apply to what you are doing. Let me address the puffy and layering comment first. They are correct that if you compress a puffy jacket or pants you are defeating the purpose of wearing it by making it less effective. BUT, if you use your puffy as your next to last layer and cover it with something water and wind proof that is a size larger then you have an excellent system. The larger outer layer won't compress the puffy and it keeps the wind out and the warmth in.

As for the purely stationary hunting scenario and merino wool and layering, it again depends on the scenario you are in. If you are riding to where you will be sitting down to hunt then you can wear a camo snowmobile suit and you will be fine on the trip in and while sitting stationary. If you are walking in you can wear lightweight clothing since you will be exerting yourself and sweating, then change out of your damp clothes and put on that camo snowmobile suit again, and you will be fine. BUT, if you are walking and sitting, or you don't want to use something bulky and heavy one piece insulating garment like my camo snowmobile suit example, then you will need something that will allow you to regulate your body heat so that you don't get your clothing wet which will lead to being cold. Layers are the best strategy for accomplishing that. It is a proven concept that has been used successfully for decades by both civilians and military.

Merino wool is a good insulator, can be worn in a variety of weights (either alone or in layers), and wicks moisture away from your body, and it doesn't stink like synthetics do after a while. You can use other wicking fabrics like UnderArmour, Nike, or something else if that is your preference but they only wick and don't help insulate you.

So, I think that in the posts you are referring to the writer has found something else that works well for him or her, and that is fine, but it may not work well for others and in other situations.

My two cents but they are backed by a lot of experience, comfortable days in the field, and a mild case of hypothermia years ago before I knew better about what to wear and how to use it.

Larry

 

[IaTrent]

I agree with Larry. Light and Mid weight merino for walk in and then heavy insulation (Sanctuary) for the sit.


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[tttoadman]

I agree the merino only makes sense for next to body wear. if you are wearing wool as mid and outer layers, you may as well go get the black and red plaid out of grandpas closet. I have adopted one odd layering. I ditched all the microfleece mid layer shirts and only carry a light windproof jacket. I also have a relatively lightweight puffy that fits nicely under it. I can wear my puffy jacket under the wind shell and then my rain shell. I get 2 layers of protection keeping my down jacket dry. Hunting OR doesn't always happen if you aren't willing to get out and hunt in an all day rain/snow mix.

 

[larryschwartz]

I agree the merino only makes sense for next to body wear. if you are wearing wool as mid and outer layers, you may as well go get the black and red plaid out of grandpas closet. I have adopted one odd layering. I ditched all the microfleece mid layer shirts and only carry a light windproof jacket. I also have a relatively lightweight puffy that fits nicely under it. I can wear my puffy jacket under the wind shell and then my rain shell. I get 2 layers of protection keeping my down jacket dry. Hunting OR doesn't always happen if you aren't willing to get out and hunt in an all day rain/snow mix.

My approach is similar. I add or remove, and mix and match the following layers as needed based on activity and weather:

~ Merino wool next to my skin because I prefer it to synthetics.
~ A light or medium weight shirt that can protect the merino NTS layer and keep off the wind/light rain.
~ A light or medium weight insulating layer; fleece shirt/jacket, wool shirt or jacket.
~ A puffy insulating layer.
~ The wind/rain/snow protective outer layer.

Larry

 

[5MilesBack]

I owned the Chama and Labrador sweater and sold them both. First off, when I put one on over another merino piece they tend to stick together and I couldn't stand that constrictive feeling. Secondly, they didn't seem to add any warmth at all for stationary activities. So these days I use lightweight merino base top and bottom and then adjust with different weight fleece layers as needed. I've been a fleece guy for a long time now, and now I know why........it just works. For stationary stuff I need a good down puffy because if I'm not moving, I'm probably cold.......unless it's 80+ outside.

 

[larryschwartz]

I owned the Chama and Labrador sweater and sold them both. First off, when I put one on over another merino piece they tend to stick together and I couldn't stand that constrictive feeling. Secondly, they didn't seem to add any warmth at all for stationary activities. So these days I use lightweight merino base top and bottom and then adjust with different weight fleece layers as needed. I've been a fleece guy for a long time now, and now I know why........it just works. For stationary stuff I need a good down puffy because if I'm not moving, I'm probably cold.......unless it's 80+ outside.

That is exactly what I was talking about in my post above. The purpose of your outer layer is to protect what is under it from brush and to keep the wind and rain off. The middle layer(s), whatever you choose to use, are there to keep you warm. The NTS layer is to keep your skin dry, keeping it warm is just a side benefit if you are using merino wool.

Larry

 

[fngTony]

For me I want my system to cover a 60 degree span. I'd rather layer two light base layer shirts than one heavy. Minimizes how often layers are changed. Versatility, a half length zipper on my midlayer allows me to wear it more often than not.
At some point insulating your legs and hands will be better than wishing you had a warmer puffy.
You have to consider the time of year, environment, activity level for your needs.

I don't like merino on merino because I also found it clings and I get more warmth, abrasion resistance from poly.
Yes, merino can go for many days with out stink.

 

[tttoadman]

FNG brings up a great point. My beanie and my gloves are always in my pocket or on my head and hands. Your head is still the best radiator you have, and I think your hands can be a close second. I manage my comfort by swapping my gloves and hat on and off throughout the day.

 

[TXCO]

I agree with everything written supporting merino layered with fleece. Fleece is just as quiet as merino when stalking but is generally tougher with rocks and branches.

I have 2 different rain jackets, a bigger one for sitting and layering a puffy underneath (early season or dry deer and elk) and a slightly smaller one that a little tougher if i plan to wear it all day or all trip with an extra fleece or sythentic insulation layer. I dont want to be taking my rain jacket on and off every time i stop hiking to put on a puffy. Then everything gets wet. I know some people that carry an even larger puffy to go over their rain jacket when they stop, i havent tried it but its an interesting way to stay dry. Seems heavy over time.


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[bean outdoors]

Most of my kit consists of First Lite gear but this question isn't specific to any brand. I've seen multiple threads on here regarding someone's take that merino wool garments are unnecessary for purely stationary hunting, or that multiple layers of wool aren't ideal (i.e. no reason to layer llano, chama, labrador, etc.) for stationary hunting, or that "puffy" garments shouldn't be compressed by layering over them, or that fleece is vastly superior to wool when stationary. Anyone have any thoughts on these concepts?

for first lite the llano and chama are great for early season and for layering with other garments. When it chills other pieces can used in conjunction with these. the puffys are great for insulating and sealing in warmth as it get cold

if you need layering help or if you need help with pricing just let us know