"Lightweight" backpack hunting is an exercise in frustration. Total weight?

[paulforward]

"We pack our insecurities"......dang that is a good saying....

I've hunted with guys that pack way too much chit.

exactly. I know Roman Dial pretty well and if he said it, it fits his style. Just about every hunter in Alaska could shed a lot of weight by getting rid of the firearm while bowhunting or doing other stuff in the wilderness. guns for bear protection while backpack hunting is the definition of "packing our insecurities". and I'm guilty of it as well...

 

[AK Troutbum]

exactly. I know Roman Dial pretty well and if he said it, it fits his style. Just about every hunter in Alaska could shed a lot of weight by getting rid of the firearm while bowhunting or doing other stuff in the wilderness. guns for bear protection while backpack hunting is the definition of "packing our insecurities". and I'm guilty of it as well...

“Just about every hunter in AK could shed a lot of wt. by getting rid of the firearm while bow hunting or doing other stuff in the wilderness. Guns for bear protection while BP hunting is the definition of packing our insecurities”.


I absolutely agree with this, but on the other hand, I have used my handgun on one occasion, on a brown bear, while BP hunting. I have been bluff charged before and while I can’t say for sure that that bear wasn’t bluffing, I can say for sure that he’ll never do it again. So, as much as packing a firearm up here in the wilderness is an insecurity, it’s an insecurity I’m willing to LIVE with.


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[fngTony]

We can’t pack meat in a thruhiker pack weighing under two pounds. There’s some degree of minimal optics. We need a weapon and kill kit. The above could account for 5-20 pounds alone. I think the key is to balance the ul hiker weights with the necessities and needs of hunting. It’s tricky though if you hunt multiple environments with unique requirements. Justification & affordability of buying multiple shelters, clothing, optics, etc is not something many can do. Ultimately we buy the heavier, more bombproof stuff that in theory is less likely to fail. Which brings us back to packing insecurities.

 

[rino]

buy a good digital scale, cut, hack and scrutinize everything you take. Almost EVERTHING from food bags, straps, metal components (think dremel away parts of tripod quick release plates), cut tags, desew brand badges, ditch the 5oz Nalgene for a gatoraide bottle....not to mention the big 3 weights. Do without....then go cut and hack more.

 

[mtwarden]

^ to add to the above from fng, we are also typically "camping" in less than ideal weather as well- heavier sleep systems, more clothing, more bombproof shelters, etc than your average "summer" backpacker

we'll never see the base weights typical of lightweight backpackers, there is usually some room for improvement, but only to a point

 

[Ndbowhunter]

I thInk sub 3 pound rifles (unloaded) are totally doable. Guys are building 45oz ar15.. rmr style optics would allow 48oz. 6x45 16" with a quality 85gr should push 2750+fps.. Ackley it and another 125fs should. Ta33 on a slr mount would only add 8.5oz

Same with packs. A simple roll top, bag and simple pack frame and suspension should be ez to make in the sub 40oz mark

Cuben shelters can be had all up in the sub 12oz category. Ti stakes, Cuben ground sheet.

1oz knifes cut very well.

18oz binoculars in the 8x30 configuration are really good. Same as the swaro 10x40 habicht at 24oz

 

[AK Troutbum]

I thInk sub 3 pound rifles (unloaded) are totally doable. Guys are building 45oz ar15.. rmr style optics would allow 48oz. 6x45 16" with a quality 85gr should push 2750+fps.. Ackley it and another 125fs should. Ta33 on a slr mount would only add 8.5oz

Same with packs. A simple roll top, bag and simple pack frame and suspension should be ez to make in the sub 40oz mark

Cuben shelters can be had all up in the sub 12oz category. Ti stakes, Cuben ground sheet.

1oz knifes cut very well.

18oz binoculars in the 8x30 configuration are really good. Same as the swaro 10x40 habicht at 24oz

I can’t speak to those light wt. firearms as I know nothing about them, and really don’t have any interest in owning one. The UL wt. pack on the other hand, I think would be very difficult to get down to sub 40 oz. while maintaining something that is capable of carrying everything that a person would need for a remote 7-10 day hunt, and also have a frame capable of carrying loads well north of 100 lbs. I put together a pack for my son, for his 10 day sheep hunt last year, using a Stone Glacier Krux frame and a DCF roll top dry bag that had a capacity of approx. 5000 ci (still not big enough in my opinion for a solo 7-10 day hunt), and it still weighed over 1/2 lb. more than your sub 40 oz. pack.
Also, I don’t know what shelter you’re considering that only weighs 12 oz. all in, but I don’t think anybody that values their own life would use that shelter, for an extended period of time, at elevation, on a remote sheep/goat hunt in AK. I have what I consider an extremely light wt. shelter that I can/will use for the occasional bivouac that weighs 15.2 oz. all in, but I would never consider it for my sole means of shelter on a extended, remote hunt. Just my 2 cents.


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[mtwarden]

as one of the pioneers of the ultralight movement, Andrew Skurka has a good article on what he refers to as "stupid light", pretty good read

https://andrewskurka.com/2012/stupid-light-not-always-right-or-better/

 

[fngTony]

I was doing the pack math also. My frame a sg evo is 39oz without a bag or pockets, two kuiu pockets at 1oz each, load cell bag 4.3 and I’ll add another 2oz for the upgraded auto lock buckles and webbing keepers. Still crazy light and could trim some by not using pockets and going with a cuben roll top but still under capacity. Another option is to piggyback my ultra 1800 at 11oz. But at that point for a total of 10oz s2s makes a 65liter dry bag

Seek outside might be a lighter option. They have a video where Kevin is showing how you can remove cross stays and webbing but I think that’s intended for when you’re not hunting.

 

[Ndbowhunter]

Yama gear .8 dyneema 9x9 cat cut tarp is 9 something ounces.. 10 zpacks carbon stakes are 2 oz.. ground sheet would be about 1.5oz

as for the pack. Stay tuned, I gotta throw some more animals through it to say if it's actually 100lb capable but so far so good.

 

[AK Troutbum]

Yama gear .8 dyneema 9x9 cat cut tarp is 9 something ounces.. 10 zpacks carbon stakes are 2 oz.. ground sheet would be about 1.5oz

as for the pack. Stay tuned, I gotta throw some more animals through it to say if it's actually 100lb capable but so far so good.

Sounds good, I have a 10 day goat hunt planed for Oct. on Kodiak this year, would you like to join me with that set up?


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[Ndbowhunter]

Would love to.. you hunting the south end?

Haven't been to alitak in 15 years. To be fair this go round I'd like to see new country.. seen a fair bit of the Emerald Isle over the years. Be fun to do some more surf exploration this go round and see my buddy and his wife and girls in kodiak city. Pasagshak usually has a lump to surf.

How's the snowpack on the island this year?

 

[chippewawarrior]

Sounds good, I have a 10 day goat hunt planed for Oct. on Kodiak this year, would you like to join me with that set up?


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I’ll borrow his setup if I’m invited Ha!

 

[Ndbowhunter]

What?! now you boys are passing my gear around like a cheap hooker at a patriots party. That's messed up.

Ironically enough my very first backcountry, backpack hunt was into the backend of Ugashik in October on a mission to get a billy. We got absolutely hammered by weather. Was about a 980 low, with a 1032 arctic high. Good introduction to williwaws. Then the goat jumped and slid down and got pretty broke up. We had tied the big boat up in Larsen bay and had to sit on the beach for 2 days before we could even skiff back. Kodiak is fun like that.

 

[Ndbowhunter]

All bs aside, Greigg Caiggu in NZ is a great resource for this type of discussion.

Cherry picking hunts that inherently can't be done lightweight reeks of red herring..

If the disposition taken is a negative one, it's not difficult to find data sets that support your outlook.

Trying to find a legal ram in the Delongs probably isn't a place to go lightweight... but a high country mule deer first week in September in Colorado's Sangre de Cristo's where the goal is to get some meat for the freezer and just be out there enjoying it. I'd not be scared to leave a lot of crap at home.

 

[mtwarden]

^ I agree with that assessment; a person needs to know how/when to pack lighter and conversely heavier- you can get into a bit of a jam on the first one when you're wrong, the other one you're simply carrying too much weight- which sucks, but doesn't suck as bad as getting in a jam

 

[tamoko]

I used a different rucksack. Dana Design, Mystery Ranch, Kifaru. End with Mystery Ranch XXX trance 69lt. for 4lb. with great MR frame. Or CRUX AK47 47lt. for 1195 g. exceptionally tough kevlar, light, waterproof, alpine rucksack from the UK, worth to check other CRUX backpacks. This rucksack well knows by hi altitude alpine community.
Dependent on care weight and your fitness, CRUX does not have the same comfort like MR, but more light and very tough. This is enough comfort for hi altitude alpine in harsh condition.

 

[whiskeysierra762]

I started out as an ultralight backpacker, but my hunting pack gets heavier every year. Im now to the point that Im willing to carry a pretty heavy load to be comfortable while backpack hunting solo in the mountains. Nothing is worse for me than being wet and cold and not being able to dry gear out while in the backcountry.
My base gear weight has about tripled in the past few years, and every season I say Im going to lighten it up next time but I never do. In fact after this season I decided Im going to try a Kifaru Slick bag instead of my EE 20deg quilt, adding another few pounds to my base gear weight. Kifaru has been the reason for most of my weight gain. I use a Kifaru Reckoning pack, Sawtooth shelter with titanium stove, and now Slick Bag with a Klymit 30" wide 3" thick sleeping pad and sea to summit inflatable pillow.
The only way I have been able to save weight has been upgrading all my clothing to First Lite, which has not saved much.

 

[Bigwindymt]

Tons of good advice in this thread...
The only good things I would add would be asking what are you willing to give up and still be able to achieve your objectives?

Going ultralight was antithetical to all my gearhead impulses. What are you willing to leave at home? How much risk or suffering are you willing to endure as you reach the limits of your gear? If you want to drag along a bunch of stuff, it all adds up, even if it is all "ultralight" gear.

 

[DoubleDown]

as one of the pioneers of the ultralight movement, Andrew Skurka has a good article on what he refers to as "stupid light", pretty good read

https://andrewskurka.com/2012/stupid-light-not-always-right-or-better/

Actually first recorded pioneer of ultralight camping/hunting was George W Sears “Nessmuk”