Measuring BH209 Volume Powder Measure vs. Grain Weight

[Berger024]

I've read a couple of threads regarding this issue. I was/am using my original Traditions Brass Powder Measurer, a TC U-View Clear plastic Volume Powder Measurer and just bought a Frankford Arsenal Digital Scale. Measuring out 100grains of BH209 on the digital scale it's putting me close to 120-130 grains of volume on the Traditions Brass Powder Measurer. Are these inconsistencies due to the size and hollow cylindrical powder shape of the BH209? I've been loading BH209 by volume and after weighing I must have been shooting an undercharged load around 70-80 grains the past 7 years. Once I measured with the digital scale, the three shots I took had a noticeably larger kick like shooting a 3" shotgun sabot load.
Has anyone else seen a large difference between volume marking BH209 powder tubes, Volume Powder Measures between different companies and then going to a scale? Once I get home tonight I'm going to compare the Traditions Brass and the TC Clear plastic volume measurers. The difference between volume and weight of BH209 was pretty significant. Everything I've read online points to 100-105gr of BH209 for my setup.

I'm shooting a .50 cal Knight Ultralite with Barnes Spit-Fire Expander MZ 285grainers.

 

[MuleyFever]

Just to be clear you know that that 100gn by volume will not weight 100gn on a scale right?

A max load of BH209 on a scale is 84gn and by volume is 120gn unless you have a gun specifically rated for more like a smokeless set up or a CVA Paramount.

You do have to be careful though as volume to weight can be off from the .7 factor used above. I shot 120gn by volume and was getting really bad blowback and black primers. I weighed it and it was something like 96gn on a scale. It was way to high of a load so now I weigh mine out.

 

[Berger024]

I knew volume measure and weight were not the same. I was unaware of the large difference and unaware of the difference between manufacturers' volume measurers. The BH209 tubes were measuring 130-140 while the brass was measuring around 125 for volume.

 

[Billy Goat]

Generally when speaking of blackhorn, it's refered to as either by weight or by volume.


I have been scaling powder for a long time, I haven't trusted any measure on a tube, except for the measurement I got working up a load with that tube. So an adjustable brass tube, once I found the load the gun liked, I used that tube.



I wouldn't count on the marks on any quickload to be accurate.


Big difference with BH in volume versus weight. I shoot a 75 grain by weight charge, that's what my gun ended up liking.

 

[sabotloader]

Just remember that the weight of BH209 can and does change from lot to lot. Volume remains the same. It is not a great change but it does change,

 

[Berger024]

Thanks for the information gentleman. The last 10 years I never gave it much thought, I just used whatever tube I grabbed and relied on the markings to indicate correct volume. I need to go back to the drawing board on this one and figure the exact load out.

 

[Newtosavage]

I started measuring mine out by weight, and then keeping tubes of each charge that way. I don't even pay attention to the volume markings on those tubes anymore.

 

[tim tarras]

I am so gad I saw this post before I went out to the range for my first session with my new muzzleloader. Being a muzzy virgin, this thread got my attention. Last night I I filled 4 of my blackhorn tubes to 100gr by volume and then weighted them out. Below are the results.
79.8
77.8
82.5
80.4

Then I weighted out 70 grains and poured into the tubes and it filled it to the 90g by volume mark.

 

[tracker12]

This is a big reason why groups spread out. We often blame the bullet or gun

 

[mfllood3800]

I measured my BH 209 using the TC clear tubes at 110 volume when compressed with light tapping several times. . I then weighed this same amount on my RCBS scale. 90g of weight. I have since weighed all my charges, verifying they are still around the volume line of 110. Just in case the powder changes from lot to lot. I have shot as high as 120 g of volume before so I know the barrel can handle that and more.

 

[Berger024]

What kind of weight/volume difference are talking about from lot to lot? It would be interesting to know maybe just between 3 or 4 lots what the deviation is.

 

[General RE LEE]

Good thread because I am a centerfire reloader and for the first time decided to weigh the 100 grains of BH209 I have been measuring out of my clear TC volume measurer. Per Western Powders, 100 grains by volume of BH209 is 70 grains weighed on a scale. My TC powder measure at 100 grains by volume was 72-73 grains on my electronic scale. I had to adjust my volume measure to 95 grains to get it to measure out 69-70 grains. I ordered several plastic vials on Amazon and I am going to weigh out my charges on a scale from now on for even more consistency.

 

[WyOwen]

I weigh it, only way to be consistent

 

[sabotloader]

Good thread because I am a centerfire reloader and for the first time decided to weigh the 100 grains of BH209 I have been measuring out of my clear TC volume measurer. Per Western Powders, 100 grains by volume of BH209 is 70 grains weighed on a scale. My TC powder measure at 100 grains by volume was 72-73 grains on my electronic scale. I had to adjust my volume measure to 95 grains to get it to measure out 69-70 grains. I ordered several plastic vials on Amazon and I am going to weigh out my charges on a scale from now on for even more consistency.

Just remember the volume to weight can change with each different lot number of the powder. Today with Hodgdon producing the powder that could change or remain the same. Since the Hodgdon power seems to have smaller kernel's weight may be somewhat different also.

Might work your way through this discussion

https://www.modernmuzzleloader.com/threads/blackhorn-209-another-post.41039/

 

[born2kill]

Have always weighed 70g on scale for 100g load. I weigh and place in unmarked speed load tubes. Thats been out of a 5lb jug I bought years ago. Never have used the volume measurements.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[TheWhitetailNut]

All of you STOP before you blow your faces off!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Weight and volume are not the same thing. Propellants do not have the same weight by volume. Compound, shape, and size of granule determine their volume.

 

[txhunter581]

But at least in the past, BH 209 was a consistent extruded granule and weight vs volume didn’t change that much. But since Hodgdon took it over, it seems to vary significantly from lot to lot. I have never weighed it before, but will going forward when I buy a new lot number.

That said, once I figure out what the new lot weighs, I will adjust my volume measurer and just use volume. For the ranges I shoot (150 yards) I won’t need to weigh every charge. In other words, for a particular batch/lot, volume will be just fine for me. But I will have to adjust the volume up or down with each new batch