Mid-Layer Shootout Review ***Updated 2/18/23***

[Fins_N_Tines]

I’m curious where the KUIU Strongfleece 260 fits in. It’s a great piece. The hood isn’t the best though. My guess is it will stack up warmth wise but not be as breathable.

 

[j33]

What if you weighed the garment, soaked in water, hung in a room and compared the rate they “dried” vs their original weight?

I’m shocked people don’t compare gear more this way. I’ve done it at home on some fleeces and wool gear, pretty shocking.

-Take dry weight
-Put in water, pull out and let drip for X amount of time. Re-weigh it
-Set to dry, check all garments every X amount of time with moisture meter
-Compare dry times and weight gain

 

[Fins_N_Tines]

Also curious why Sitka didn't include the Polygiene odor control on Ambient like they did on KAH.

 

[Fins_N_Tines]

Also curious why Sitka didn't include the Polygiene odor control on Ambient like they did on KAH.

The more I think about it is probably due to its made of nylon. Poly is what typically gets the funk.

 

[sahunter06]

Mike
I’m a first lite merino fan.
The 240 gram kiln top works well in cooler temps.
Lower elevation September hunts I’ll go with 150g lite top for my mid layer.
Agree with others merino dries much faster than other materials. I’ve tested many.
David

 

[mtwarden]

Mike
I’m a first lite merino fan.
The 240 gram kiln top works well in cooler temps.
Lower elevation September hunts I’ll go with 150g lite top for my mid layer.
Agree with others merino dries much faster than other materials. I’ve tested many.
David

My experience is the opposite. I find synthetic dries significantly quicker.

I still have merino base layers, but they see a lot less use.

 

[Fins_N_Tines]

My experience is the opposite. I find synthetic dries significantly quicker.

I still have merino base layers, but they see a lot less use.

this is the same experience I have had as well. The only reason I still like merino is the funk factor. However, I'm at the point that after 2-3 days my core lt weight hoody will be stinky but I just don't care and keep hunting for 5 - 7 more days.

I think if you can go back to a cabin every night merino is great, but if you are on a backpack hunt and you are only using one piece; synthetic is safer as it drys so fast.

 

[mtnbiker208]

you should throw a old school wool shirt in the test, just to see if modern fabrics work as well as we think.

 

[TrapMessiah33]

Can you toss in an Arcteryx Leaf Naga Hoody in full or pullover ? They have been my go to.

Do you prefer the material of the full zip of the pullover better? I believe they're different correct?

 

[Ten Bears]

Do you prefer the material of the full zip of the pullover better? I believe they're different correct?

I like the full zip better. It’s straight Pontetorto fleece. The pullover has an insulation based chest with fleece sleeves. Still a solid garment, just never found a place for it.

 

[optimusprime]

What if you weighed the garment, soaked in water, hung in a room and compared the rate they “dried” vs their original weight?

I did this EXACT experiment 2 years ago with a Sitka Core lightweight short sleeve and a FL Wick short sleeve. Same size. Weighed them every 10 minutes or so. Results were Sitka completely dried 10 minutes faster. Mind you, these shirts were hung dried in the shade on an 85 degree day with no thermal input from a body which may change the drying attributes.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[three5x5s]

I like the full zip better. It’s straight Pontetorto fleece. The pullover has an insulation based chest with fleece sleeves. Still a solid garment, just never found a place for it.

Agree. I think. The pullover fits tighter also.

 

[Bump79]

@mtwarden Looking more at the Pnuma Alpha Vertix jacket it uses 100 grams of Primaloft Next insulation. A quick google search shows that their Evolve Insulation is part of this line up. By all appearances it looks like it is the Evolve which is the same as the new Sitka Ambient lineup. It does say "windproof" which doesn't exactly lead to a breathable midlayer but might be an excellent piece for a lot of people.

PrimaLoft® NEXT: Where Insulation Meets Fabric - Primaloft

LATHAM, N.Y. (June 5, 2019) – PrimaLoft,Inc., the leader in advanced material technology, today introduced PrimaLoft® NEXT, a brand new, innovative textile platform that combines the thermal advantages of insulation with the versatility of fabric. PrimaLoft NEXT provides unmatched freedom for...

www.primaloft.com

30% off on their website this weekend for those interested.

Alpha Vertex Jacket

The Alpha Vertex was designed from the ground up with the bowhunter in mind. It is insulated but lightweight, packable, and weather-resistant. Use it as an outer layer for early to mid-season. Alpha is also an ideal mid-layer when the temperature really drops because it offers core warmth...

pnumaoutdoors.com

 

[mtwarden]

When Polartec Alpha first came out (to the civilian world) a lot of manufacturers were using the wrong fabrics inner and outer. I think they were using "traditional" fabrics they had been using, but it was clearly defeating the advantage of Alpha as an active layer. It seems they've learned from their errors and most are now using a breathable outer fabric and many have ditched the inner fabric altogether.

Evolve sure looks like Alpha Direct, will be curious when I get my hands on one

 

[mtwarden]

Evolve sure looks like Alpha Direct, will be curious when I get my hands on one

A Sitka Ambient Hoody will officially be part of the shootout after receiving one today. Fit is perfect in size Large for my 5'11" 180-ish frame.

Looking side by side at Alpha and Evolve, I'm having a very hard time distinguishing between the two. I'll look closer with a magnifying glass at some point, but suffice it to say the two insulations are very similar.

 

[somethinglemony]

Another vote for the Arc’teryx Proton FL if possible. The new revised version of the Proton FL is probably the closest thing on the market to the Sitka MDWi. It’s received great reviews already. Pretty crazy that there aren’t more options like these two on the market

The Marmot Alpha 60 is another jacket in that category. Seems to be well received and it’s older so it can usually be found for a pretty good price. I just picked one up for $100.

 

[Trumpkin The Dwarf]

Wow... there's a lot of tech mentioned in this thread that sounds like a foreign language to me. When did I fall so far behind on layering systems?

@mtwarden what is the intended purpose of the mid layer in this testing?

I usually use a Peloton 200 hoody over a base layer, backed up by a puffy and a hard shell rain jacket. Am I understanding that some of these mid layers are more lofted, similar to a synthetic puffy? Always looking to up my game, but I am not sure I understand the difference between a thin fleece and an active insulation piece.

 

[Bump79]

Wow... there's a lot of tech mentioned in this thread that sounds like a foreign language to me. When did I fall so far behind on layering systems?

@mtwarden what is the intended purpose of the mid layer in this testing?

I usually use a Peloton 200 hoody over a base layer, backed up by a puffy and a hard shell rain jacket. Am I understanding that some of these mid layers are more lofted, similar to a synthetic puffy? Always looking to up my game, but I am not sure I understand the difference between a thin fleece and an active insulation piece.

He's got a few articles on Rokslide writing up the benefits.

 

[mtwarden]

Wow... there's a lot of tech mentioned in this thread that sounds like a foreign language to me. When did I fall so far behind on layering systems?

@mtwarden what is the intended purpose of the mid layer in this testing?

I usually use a Peloton 200 hoody over a base layer, backed up by a puffy and a hard shell rain jacket. Am I understanding that some of these mid layers are more lofted, similar to a synthetic puffy? Always looking to up my game, but I am not sure I understand the difference between a thin fleece and an active insulation piece.

Sorry for the late response, for some reason not getting all of my notifications

Anywho- thin (to midnight) fleece serves the same role as the new active insulations out there- to provide warmth on the move, while breathing decently and drying quickly if they do get wet

Hopefully this shootout will shed some light on what garment is more efficient

I can tell you that without any testing fleece has a couple of things where they already win out- cost and durability; if your hunting area contains a lot of thick brush, thick timber, etc you can be less cautious with a fleece mid-layer than with these newer active insulations. Not saying they aren't durable, but aren't going to be as durable as a fleece garment.

BTW we've (central Montana) been in the low to upper 90's for the past six weeks straight- 45+ years of living here and have never seen it this warm, for so long. Here's hoping September treats us better than July and August.

 

[Trumpkin The Dwarf]

Sorry for the late response, for some reason not getting all of my notifications

Anywho- thin (to midnight) fleece serves the same role as the new active insulations out there- to provide warmth on the move, while breathing decently and drying quickly if they do get wet

Hopefully this shootout will shed some light on what garment is more efficient

I can tell you that without any testing fleece has a couple of things where they already win out- cost and durability; if your hunting area contains a lot of thick brush, thick timber, etc you can be less cautious with a fleece mid-layer than with these newer active insulations. Not saying they aren't durable, but aren't going to be as durable as a fleece garment.

BTW we've (central Montana) been in the low to upper 90's for the past six weeks straight- 45+ years of living here and have never seen it this warm, for so long. Here's hoping September treats us better than July and August.

That's a rough stretch of heat in MT. Sorry to hear that. Would it help if I told you we finally snapped our two month streak of 99-105 degree heat here in TX?