Riflescope config question for new Rifle + bino ?

[Rail505]

Buying parts for my first hunting rifle, a remington 700 .308. Realistically, i will not shoot at an animal thats at 400 yards or more. I have stumbled upon a few questions that i cant seem to find the answer to on here or on another forum where snipers hide. Question is in regards to rifle scope reticle and using laser rangefinder.
My understanding of a Mil reticle is you can find what range your target/elk is at if you know the dimensions of it. Everytime i will have my rifle, be it at the range or while hunting, i will have a laser rangefinder on my body, so i wont be using the reticle to guess what range something is at.
Since i will be using a laser rangefinder, can i get away with a simple duplex reticle in the second focal plane? Or is ffp mil reticle that much better while using a lrf? Reason is the only scope i can find that meets all “my requirements” of ffp, mils/mils, illuminated and a low power of 2 for close distance work is the Nightforce NX8 2.5-20x50, but it is a bit too expensive for me. Was hoping for something in the thousand dollar range. So im wondering if i can just use an illuminated, sfp, duplex scope and still be as “effective” as having a mil reticle in ffp with a lrf. Planning on this being my only scope purchase for the next 10 years. Seeing if i can go this route of cheaper rifle scope so i can try and upgrade my BX-4 binos to some SLC’s or EL’s. That reminds me, whats more important to have better glass in, your bino’s or riflescope? Thanks for your time roksliders, i have found this to be one of the best, no-bs-answers-forum that i have ever been on.

 

[Rodéo]

Yes. A sfp duplex will suit your needs well. You'll get plenty of recommendations on particular models below. Pick your favorite.

Also, great bino's are much more important than a great scope. Upgrade the BX-4's and get yourself a solid ~$1000 scope. Go hunting.

 

[Marbles]

To me, a durable scope like an NF is more important than best in class binoculars. A mil reticle will help with fast hold overs, as opposed to having to dial. If you have a duplex reticle than repeatability and durability of the scope becomes even more important. If you can find the animal, but cannot put metal on target, then you are just wildlife watching (which I also enjoy).

FFP eliminates a potential error when using the sub tensions of the reticle as they represent the same unit of angular measure at all magnifications. An SFP scope with a mil reticle would still be more useful than a duplex reticle. Inside 200 yards should be within maximum point blank range, if you think a shot will be further than that, just crank the scope all the way up. This works better on scopes with a more reasonable max power, such as the NXS 2.5-10x42.

I find that at 4x I can shoot with both eyes open. As such, I feel a 3x scope can be used close in with reasonable success if shooting with both eyes open. I would not sweat the difference between 2.5x and 3x for low power and that would open up quite a few more options for you. That said, I have a scope that goes down to 1x because I could be going into thick brush after a bear with it.

For budget scopes, the SWFA SS scopes have a solid reputation for durability and repeatability.

Sounds like you have workable binoculars, personally I would get a good scope and upgrade the binoculars at a different time. Otherwise not only will you be replacing the binoculars, but you will also end up eating the cost on a scope replacement down the road. But, part of that is because I'm pretty happy with my mid level Ziess Conquest binos. If you really hate the BX-4s you might not mind replacing the scope latter.

 

[Rail505]

Lot to unpack here Marbles, thanks for such insight.
Literally blew my mind about the 2x vs 3x. Adding 3x to my search now.
I am ok with the BX-4 bino’s, i have never looked through alpha glass so not really sure of what i am missing, but i have looked through top notch riflescopes and my god, the detail was amazing. For now i think your right, keep the binos since they function flawlessly and are pretty good from what i have seen, and just buy once cry once with the rifle scope and worry down the road about alpha bino’s.
will continue researching before i make a purchase.

 

[LaHunter]

In my opinion, for hunting a SFP scope works fine. I always have a lazer range finder with me too. The FFP scopes advantage is that the subtensions are always usable at any power setting, whether it is moa or mils. This is really useful in the PRS type competitions. The downside is that at the lowest power setting you may not be able to pick up the reticle very easily unless you have an illuminated reticle.
You can find SFP scopes with moa or mil reticles that are also very useful, you just have to know what the measurement is at a given scope power setting. For $1000, you can find a NF SHV scope in the 4-14 power range or maybe the NF SHV 5-20 power range.
Also, with rifle scopes, reliability, tracking, return to zero, durability are more important than dazzling glass. You can get good glass with the reliability that you can trust for $1000.
As far as scope vs binos, which needs to have the better glass? Consider this, you will use your binos 100X more than your rifle scope while hunting out west. I don't know anything about the binos that you have, if they suit your eyes well, then you should be good.
Camerland is a sponsor here and they have great RS pricing and great CS. Give them a call once you figure narrow down the models you are considering.

 

[Rail505]

The FFP scopes advantage is that the subtensions are always usable at any power setting, whether it is moa or mils. This is really useful in the PRS type competitions.

Since i have never been hunting, is this useful in a hunting situation, will you always have time to dial in elevation? What if you need a second shot immediately to put down the animal that went from 200 to 250 yards, would a duplex still be as efficient as a mil reticle in this case? Because holding over would be faster than dialing in this case right?

For $1000, you can find a NF SHV scope in the 4-14 power range or maybe the NF SHV 5-20 power range.

Not too familiar with all nightforce model ranges, is this lower priced shv class still pretty good?

Also, with rifle scopes, reliability, tracking, return to zero, durability are more important than dazzling glass. You can get good glass with the reliability that you can trust for $1000.
As far as scope vs binos, which needs to have the better glass? Consider this, you will use your binos 100X more than your rifle scope while hunting out west. I don't know anything about the binos that you have, if they suit your eyes well, then you should be good.
Camerland is a sponsor here and they have great RS pricing and great CS. Give them a call once you figure narrow down the models you are considering.

Well for me the BX-4’s seem fine because i have never looked through alpha glass, so i dont really know what im missing. Its just when looking through them at 1 or 2AM atop of a hill out in the middle of the desert, 10 min from the nearest house, its hard to see anything at all (i know thats not really their purpose or wrong judge them by that) Also just what i read from people that own Swaro’s I guess thats why im thinking i need new glass, but during daytime use i see everything i need to and dont notice blurriness or something not being sharp enough to discern what it is.

 

[Marbles]

From what I have been told, SHV's are very good scopes. They have capped elevation and windage turrets. Personally I prefer this as it prevents accidental turning of the turrets. It slows down dialing though and some people don't like it. As the turrets are capped, they lack a zero stop.

The SHV's also only come in MOA. There is nothing wrong with MOA. However, I see switching units of measure as increased opportunity for human error, so it is better to have all MOA or all MIL scopes for consistency. I keep thinking about violating this principal and picking up an SHV as I need a scope for my wife's/kids' rifle and I like the price and the capped turrets.

Any NF scope will probably have decent resale value. I thought about trying Tract, but would be hard to recover much if I decided I want something else. When I have more money and time I will play with such things.

By the way, I am largely passing on information from my own research rather than from direct experience. So it may only be worth what you pay for it.

 

[MuleyFever]

From what I have been told, SHV's are very good scopes. They have capped elevation and windage turrets. Personally I prefer this as it prevents accidental turning of the turrets. It slows down dialing though and some people don't like it. As the turrets are capped, they lack a zero stop.

The SHV's also only come in MOA. There is nothing wrong with MOA. However, I see switching units of measure as increased opportunity for human error, so it is better to have all MOA or all MIL scopes for consistency. I keep thinking about violating this principal and picking up an SHV as I need a scope for my wife's/kids' rifle and I like the price and the capped turrets.

Any NF scope will probably have decent resale value. I thought about trying Tract, but would be hard to recover much if I decided I want something else. When I have more money and time I will play with such things.

By the way, I am largely passing on information from my own research rather than from direct experience. So it may only be worth what you pay for it.

Not all the SHV scopes have capped turrets.

To the OP, a MIL or MOA reticle operate in the same way. The marks just represent different measurements.

 

[cravingame]

If you decide you will be okay will 4x as your low point...I love my NF SHV F1 with FFP and Illumination.

Nightforce Optics SHV 4-14X50 F1 FFP - Mil-R Illuminated​

Call Doug...tell him you are a rokslider, and he will do you right. Consider the NF Rings also...they are built like a tank!

Once you go FFP you will never look back!

 

[TxxAgg]

For 400 yds and in, I would keep magnification at 10 or lower. I wouldn't mess with dialing either. I would sight in at 200 yds and learn the hold overs. (a BDC reticle would be easy)

 

[Sobrbiker]

Ranging with reticle is a last resort, especially in a hunting scenario.
However, for me a graduated FFP reticle is a MUST.
I hold for wind and am also able to hold for elevation if necessary (know your rifle/load). I am way more comfortable and successful holding wind and leads with a graduated reticle on the fly than holding “about that much” on an animal.

 

[LaHunter]

Since i have never been hunting, is this useful in a hunting situation, will you always have time to dial in elevation? What if you need a second shot immediately to put down the animal that went from 200 to 250 yards, would a duplex still be as efficient as a mil reticle in this case? Because holding over would be faster than dialing in this case right?

Not too familiar with all nightforce model ranges, is this lower priced shv class still pretty good?

Well for me the BX-4’s seem fine because i have never looked through alpha glass, so i dont really know what im missing. Its just when looking through them at 1 or 2AM atop of a hill out in the middle of the desert, 10 min from the nearest house, its hard to see anything at all (i know thats not really their purpose or wrong judge them by that) Also just what i read from people that own Swaro’s I guess thats why im thinking i need new glass, but during daytime use i see everything i need to and dont notice blurriness or something not being sharp enough to discern what it is.

I recommend going to the NF website and see if they have some pictures of their reticles. A moa or mil reticle has advantages over a plain duplex reticle. You have hold over or wind hold references with the moa or mil reticles and you don’t with a plain duplex. The NF SHV line of scopes are solid. They have good (not great) glass, but they are reliable. The don’t have all the features of the NXS scopes, and their price reflects that.

 

[Rail505]

So i decided i will hold off on alpha binos, get a few years use out of my bx-4’s, they are fine for now.
Cant decide between the NX8 2.5-20x50 or the Eotech Vudu 2.5-10x44.
Both are ffp mil/mil, so that covers holdovers and quick follow up shots.
Just not sure which magnification range i need. Like i said max shot i think i would ever take is 400 yds. But wouldnt mind dabbling around 700 or 800 yards at the range just for fun or practice for the max 400 yrd shot.
Not sure which brand is more durable/reliable and will last me for the next 10-15 years hopefully. Going off your experience which would be “best” as a do-it-all-scope?

 

[Rail505]

And yes, i plan on calling Doug if i go the Nightforce route, have read great things about them on here.

 

[LaHunter]

I don’t ever recall reading anything about Eotech on hunting rifles (I know nothing about any scopes of theirs) so NF 100% would be my recommendation.

 

[Rail505]

Based on my experience hunting and shooting long distance (read none) would the Nightforce NX8 2.5-20x50 be beyond my abilities and skills? I could buy an ar15, a lower priced scoped (granted, not all the features im looking for) and a red dot for the ar, for the price of this scope.

 

[LaHunter]

Based on my experience hunting and shooting long distance (read none) would the Nightforce NX8 2.5-20x50 be beyond my abilities and skills? I could buy an ar15, a lower priced scoped (granted, not all the features im looking for) and a red dot for the ar, for the price of this scope.

You may not be able to maximize the quality & features of the NX8 scope until you improve your shooting skills, but assuming it is within your budget, I doubt you would regret buying it. Optics are something that you typically get what you pay for. Also, with a scope like the NX8 you can be confident that the optics part of your 'shooting iron' won' t be the limiting factor in you skill development. I'm assuming you have read the reviews on NF scopes on this forum along with other interweb reviews, they have a strong reputation of reliability. Other brands not so much. Scope failures usually happen at the worst possible time, so keep that in mind in your decision.