Scouting, Dark Timber

[Donjuan]

Help a rookie out here...
Other than someone telling me their honey holes, how valuable do you consider preseason scouting in an elk unit that is mostly timber? Especially if you're hunting the last week of September? How much will patterns change barring snow and cold?
I'm worried if you find elk August 15th, they have a new zip code September 25th.
Does it do more harm than good?
Are you better off to sneak through it bow in hand?

That said, any tips on hunting timber other than play the wind and 2 steps ang glass?

Thanks

 

[IdahoElk]

Once the rut starts Elk can be in a canyon one day and 5 miles away the next, however if they are not bothered they can stay in a drainage for a while.
Getting back to your question, I wouldn't bet the specific Elk you find in August will be there in the end of September but you may find different Elk there.

Anytime I'm hunting thick timber I will try to find fresh sign and locate the travel routes in or out of the timber and wait to ambush them when they come out to feed instead of going in. If Elk are going nuts, bugling and I have a good wind in my face I'll move in on them looking for cows bedded all around as they don't always bed next to each other, Always watch the wind and if it sucks back way off and wait for constant thermals.

 

[Indian Summer]

Ugh! I would never hunt an area that was all timber. If for some reason you have no choice one of the first questions I’d be asking myself is what are the feeding on and where. Once you find the answer to that focus your scouting around that.

Idaho Elk made a really good point and regardless of when or where you’re hunting elk you should keep that in mind. If an area holds elk then it has what they need. Food, water, and security. Elk won’t camp out there forever though. That’s their nature. On average 2-5 days is about it before they mosey on to their next favorite spot. The saying here today gone tomorrow definitely applies.


But the point Forest made is that other elk that are gone tomorrow from wherever they were might be here today in your spot. As with all hunting being in the right place at the right time is the name of the game right? Once you find a spot that has elk, or at least sign, then it’s just a matter of time. Ideally you find 6 or 8 or so little hotspots like that and work your way through them until you come to the one where they’re here today. That beats waiting around in any one spot because elk have a big home range and it can be quite awhile until some roll into an area. Checking multiple holes that you know elk frequent is what I call a milk run. You might only check 2 a day. Or you might make your way to 3 or 4. But it’ll keep your confidence and spirits up always having a plan B and poking around in fresh areas. I hope that helps. Good luck!

 

[cnelk]

Dark timber is my bread and butter.

I never move further than 200-300yds doing cold call setups, moving into the thermals. Staying in each location about 30mins.

I’ve found that elk will show themselves at 3 min intervals. At 3 mins, at 6 mins, at 9 mins…. Etc.

Nuthin better than seeing an elk’s legs coming towards you in the thick stuff.

As far as scouting, well, that takes time. I like to scout heavy timber after archery season (Colorado) and before the 1st Rifle Season.
I’ll make notes for the following season(s)

 

[5MilesBack]

That said, any tips on hunting timber other than play the wind and 2 steps ang glass?

Yes.......learn to call. I'm not much for scouting until I have my bow in my hand. I might scout "areas" in the summer, but I rarely ever scout "elk".

Mostly all I hunt is timber. That's generally where the elk are, especially an hour+ past first light and then throughout the rest of the day until dusk. Silent bulls don't interest me, so slow working the timber doesn't interest me either. I love it when I get that deep, low, very short, growl for a response. Because the next sound out of him is almost always something along the lines of "STAY THE HECK AWAY FROM ME AND MY HAREM" in a very forceful manner. And then it's "game on".

 

[Pony Soldier]

Big cats creep and are stealthy in the woods. Elk figure that out quickly. Elk go through the woods at about a stroll. I have killed a lot of elk strolling through the woods. To the point of strolling into them at very close quarters. Often they never even raise their head from grazing. They aren't whitetails. None of their patterns are similar. In fresh snow I have tracked them from beds to feeding grounds and back to beds. They covered about seven miles in 12 hrs with a verticle range of 1200ft. That's undisturbed. Disturbed, I have followed them for 10-15 miles across multiple drainages.

They may follow a cycle but instead of daily its more like every couple weeks. However August to September is a transition period from the summer range and starting the path to the winter range. The weather has a lot to do with this.

I scout for area presence. Since they have no roots a little pressure and they are gone. I look for activity on the main trails, green grass, wallows and maybe recent rubs. All of this just gives me a place to start.

 

[wytx]

I'm betting you'll find some small openings in that dark timber. Elk like those for feeding.
cnelk has good advice for you too.

 

[Hoyt Ag]

"
They may follow a cycle but instead of daily its more like every couple weeks. However August to September is a transition period from the summer range and starting the path to the winter range. The weather has a lot to do with this.

I scout for area presence. Since they have no roots a little pressure and they are gone. I look for activity on the main trails, green grass, wallows and maybe recent rubs. All of this just gives me a place to start."

So much THIS. Learn to decipher a deer trail from an elk trail. Look for fresh rubs, wallows, etc.

 

[MallardSX2]

I always search out and hunt the thickest darkest steepest nastiest places. Others say they do until they are in it, then they want to leave it because its hard to hunt. lol

 

[Gerbdog]

I'll pitch in here: I hunt pretty much only dark timber these days in CO it seems like. I'll also second Mallards post above: you think you know thick, nasty, and steep but... ive broken more hunting partners on day 1 then i'd like to admit in these locations: There are elk, there are multiple bulls, and with Gods good grace they'll be in there again next year.

When i scout areas like this im looking for elk highways through the thick n nasty: i mean it looks like elk are coming through and crossing off pretty regularly and created a muddy path a meter wide. Naturally there are elk tracks, poo, whatever on this trail and none of those matter so long as i can see its a place elk are moving through.

I look for wallows: If theyre used? Fantastic, if theyre not this year? Well at least they were at some point.

I look for rubs from multiple years: I wanna see ancient rubs, 3 year old rubs, 1 year old rubs, rubs from this year, all of it. This tells me they are here pretty regularly during the rut, and, as mentioned above, if Gods smiling down on me, they'll be in there again this year.

Listen: while your way off the road: bugles dont travel far in that thick stuff, but you can hear em still.

Dont move fast, your basically surrounded by bedding area, its ALL potential bedding area. I find elk beds just allll over.... which is what it is... they bed in thick timber.

Respect that knowledge: its a bedding area, if you royally ef this over they arent going to feel secure in this area and will beat feet out of the unit for a long time. soooooo:

Pay attention to the wind, dont make a move on where you think there are elk if the wind is swirling.

Seems like "Dark timber" has a lot of definitions these days, and where i find the most success is kind of a changing habitat with beetle kill and deadfall. Here's the thing: it WAS deep timber... now its just habitat. It has enough sun that there is food underneath the canopy, there is water in abundance, its nice and cool, and there is cover. They dont need to move a lot in these habitats to find what they need in my experience and i end up hunting the same bulls day after day... and yup, they dont always move very far either. I have a spot that i walk up to in the morning and almost every single time am greeted by a bugle just from breaking twigs moving through the steep n nasty. I've never seen that bull. Ever. Multiple years in a row. Just too thick and he wont come down to calling for me.

I'll add an edit tip here too: I like to give a few quiet cow calls if i feel like im making a lot of noise while im moving: sometimes you just cant be quiet in these thick areas and i'd rather pretend im a 2-legged, bad at moving in the woods cow elk then the truth: im a 2-legged, bad at moving in the woods human.

 

[AaronMColeman]

A lot of good tips above. I'll just add, elk are far less sensitive to sound than anything else in my experience. Walking through the woods usually doesn't spook them near as much as when they see you, and smell they're gone to another state.

Beginning and end of day I find that saddle or transition they are likely to use in moving between day time feeding and night thick stuff for bedding. I'll sit on that and see if any pass through or bugle, then hopefully chase them all day. Mid-day I stroll through the woods on game trails always looking for sign, not moving super slow but not so fast that I can't glass a lot. Binos always in my hands scanning into the thick stuff. That's my strategy.

Nothing in the woods just walks from A to B. So I like to stroll and stop, glass, stroll and stop, glass all day.

 

[Deerhunter6250]

I scout to get to know the area and find a potential camping spot and drinking water locations. Knowing the area gives me confidence. The better I know an area generally the better success I have.

 

[LostArra]

Is water for elk scarce? If so, look for a seep or spring in the timber. I've got a wet spring honey hole that is tough to hunt due to wind/thermals but I've seen elk there dozens of times. I thought a treestand would be the answer. No. Better to move around in changing wind

 

[cnelk]

^^^^ Yep - You don’t have to go very far from a road/trail to find a good spot.

This little seep is 1/4mi from where I park. Surrounded by deadfall from hell.

 

[Donjuan]

All excellent posts!

This is why I joined the site. Thanks

 

[5MilesBack]

This is one of my favorite places to hunt. There's a seep and a wallow real close, but this is what it looks like 360 degrees around that wallow. In places like this, you don't have to make a sound. But I can't sit, so I like to speed things up by attracting the bulls. Otherwise it would make an outstanding sitting spot. I love this type of terrain. And yes, I've packed a few bulls out of this stuff. It helps when you have a 38" inseam.

 

[nphunter]

Part of scouting is knowing what to look for, IMO a lot of people find summer range or winter range sign and put too much into that area and waste time come season. Even heavily used wallows during the summer may not even be touched come Sept.

Just because you find last years rubs doesn’t mean it’s a rutting area, bulls rub before they leave summer range and again during the winter/spring as well, if you ever go to a feed site you will find rubs everywhere around it. Hanging in either of those areas is a waste of time during Sept. in most areas.

Bulls typically summer in steep country where they aren’t bothered much, sometimes that can be next to a road or 2/3 into the bottom of a giant canyon. During the rut they will go where the cows are. The only time I believe summer range scouting pays off is if your planning on hunting opening weekend. After about the first weekend of Sept. most bulls are long gone from summer ranges, the majority leaving the last week of August. There are always exceptions but typically this is the case, if your going to scout scout for areas that hold lots of cows, the areas that are not easily accessible and hold cows seem to be the most productive for us. Some areas are also covered in roads and still hold cows due to great habitat and the bulls will be there as well but they become very difficult to kill due to all the pressure from other hunters.

All of these bulls are in the same 1 mile area all summer along with a dozen other bulls. They all disappear late august and about 1/3 show back up in late Oct. and winter there. I’ve picked up sheds off of a couple about 2 miles or less down drainage. The very top bull was killed two years ago about 7 miles away and a set of sheds off of the biggest one was picked up over 10 miles away. Those cams are all less than 100 yards from a drivable road.

Even though that spot has a pile of bulls when scouting it’s not a spot I spend much time at all in archery season.

 

[cnelk]

300yds from my camper.
OTC Public Land.

Obviously we didn’t sit there that day.

 

[5MilesBack]

I should start leaving my game cams around camp on during the night. Just about every year I have bulls coming through in the middle of the night screaming their heads off, and folding my mirrors back on my truck.

 

[trophyhill]

The value for me scouting early is just getting out there and enjoying the mountain. We will find out soon if we draw NM. Or not. That determines where and when i scout. If CO i need to wait another month until they unlock some gates. Oh wait, that unit is a draw unit now.......and hopefully i draw my first choice