Seek Outside vs Kifaru shelters

[dotman]

I'd be curious whether Live2hunts experience was with the current SO fabric, I don't know how many they have gone through since they started but I'd guess 4 or 5 different ones at least.

Misting is most often condensation being knocked off, that's where using two tents at the same time is about the only way to compare conclusively, lots of variables at play on any day of the week. I've done a ghetto rip test on both fabrics and couldn't tell a difference, but its been a long time since I had access to lab equipment.

Tons of variables including how it's pitched. I've yet to have my Kifaru or SO or even the SL5 I had rain down condensation but I also alway pitch with plenty of ventilation.

 

[AK Troutbum]

Or you could just avoid all the drama all together, and start packing a cuben fiber shelter inside a Stone Glacier pack, that's what I do.


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[reaper]

I am kinda new to the back country game is it acceptable to haul my cimaron in my Kifaru pack?

Lolll nice one !!!!

But when we think about all of this...dont we just want something over our heads in the backcountry to have a good night sleep?...when i look my little one enjoying time with his Daddy in a Seekoutside or a Kifaru shelter...she's always have de same happy face.

Envoyé de mon E6560C en utilisant Tapatalk

 

[Hall256]

So this conversation carried over to my work...which is just awesome/comical! The conversation was like a live action recant of this whole post. My friend (he has the Kifaru 6 man) thinks I am an idiot for opting to get the SO 4 man....i argued cost, dimensions, and functionality...he argued Kifaru. We both just laughed, as we always joke that we are putting Patrick Smith's kids through college, so I think they have gotten enough of my money...SO seems like a great company and I am looking forward to getting a tent with them. Now...SO and BHA would offer the 4 man as a BHA option for life members I would be set.

 

[Hall256]

Lolll nice one !!!!

But when we think about all of this...dont we just want something over our heads in the backcountry to have a good night sleep?...when i look my little one enjoying time with his Daddy in a Seekoutside or a Kifaru shelter...she's always have de same happy face.
/QUOTE]
Reaper...didnt you have a Lite Outdoors stove, or am i thinking of another person? Oh, and you make a great point.

 

[Beendare]

I have test equipment to measure many fabric charateristics; my test results for the RBTR fabric you mentioned is posted here:
The Optimal non-Cuben Tent Fly Material - Backpacking Light I have never tested a sample from either of the two vendors in this discussion.

According to ISO 811, materials with a hydrostatic head of more than 1,500mm can be designated, in general, as rainproof. Even when fabric specs are provided, they are for the new condition only. All fabric coatings progressively exfoliate from wet flexing; this deteriation curve can be lab measured using a Cubix-type Wet-Flex tester in less than 24 hours or after many weeks of field use.

5,400 wet flex cycles (simulates ~2 weeks of wind and rain) is all that is needed to differentiate most silnylon. Very high quality coatings take about 16,000 wet flex cycles (simulates ~1.5 months of wind and rain) to differentiate. My tests showing some high quality fabric degradation curves are here: Fall 2016 Fabric Samples Compared - Backpacking Light

That was what I was looking for....thx Richard!

My informal toying with these fabrics gave me a gut feeling....but its nice to see it scientifically tested.

Arons vid was informative too.....and emphasized how important the proper seam construction is with these materials.

 

[COlineman78]

I talked with Aron about this a little tonight and he reiterated that the material they use IS NOT the same as SO uses and that their material costs significantly more (3-4x), so he would love to switch to it if it would meet his desires. He told me the name of the material, but I don't remember it; it is not Cordura. He also said that he is consistently looking for and testing materials for one that will meet the performance requirements he wants and hopefully cut down on cost but has yet to find something that does so. He said the main difference is that at the microscopic level the fibers in the material are significantly longer which results in higher strength and stretch. He also confirmed that their material probably has 15% more stretch that what SO uses, which matches some of the experiences pointed out earlier.

As an engineer I do like technical specs, but they can only tell you so much. You could have someone make something with the best material in the world, but if they do the wrong stitch pattern or even something as simple as aligning the material in the wrong manner you can end up with a terrible end product. The best way to know if a product is up to muster is real world experiences of the entire assembled system.