Taking a rest to stabilize shots - why isn't this a thing in archery?

540-Virginian

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 6, 2020
Messages
208
Location
Shenandoah Valley
to all who quoted my posts - they were interesting points and adding insights I didn't have (ie, thanks and I'm also open to other perspectives). That, and sorry I made this about x-bows... that was me.. my b
 

Reburn

Site Contributor
Joined
Feb 10, 2019
Messages
1,103
Location
Central Texas
Because it's the internet and everyone has the attention span of a gnat.



Why did the memes threads turn to politics? Supposed to be a place to go laugh, not get pissed.

Because people like @MattB and others just cant seem to not argue politics and ruin a funny fun thread with political BS.
 
Last edited:

Billinsd

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 25, 2015
Messages
1,817
How did this become a crossbow thread when the OP has absolutely nothing to do with crossbows?
Because someone incorrectly said putting a bow on a rest makes a crossbow, which is RIDICULOUS assertion. Mechanically holding the string at full draw is what a crossbow is.
 

Billy Goat

Senior Member
Joined
May 6, 2018
Messages
3,689
Location
Shenandoah Valley
Yea well I did. Get off a long day at work, tired, stressed, like many others. Go to the meme thread and the politics has spilled over there too. Its highly irritating.


Yeah, just don't visit the memes stuff anymore.


I sometimes think people don't deal with enough thru the day. I got enough stress, I come here to get away from that. The political stuff is too serious.

Atleast I haven't seen the religious debates yet.
 

307

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2014
Messages
1,279
Location
Cheyenne
The biggest issue with Xbow hunters is the weapon always winds up as a legal method of take during regular archery season. Then you have people (kids, women, seniors, lazy archers who don't practice and can't hit shit) who start harvesting and driving up success rates in areas where they have been even for years/decades. You would be amazed how inefficient they are past 50 yards. The KE falls off of a cliff. I know several make drop charts for their sights and it is hilarious beyond 50.

Once you start increasing success rates DNR (in area of lower recruitment or animals that do not recruit as fast as white tails) has to start limiting tags or opportunity. So you have all of the standard vertical bow people who practice to be proficient so they have more opportunity to hunt instead of rifle/alternative seasons, who now are SOL because crossbow companies decided to lobby and sue to have Xbows become a legal method of take so they can make more sales revenue.

If it was possible they remained a legal weapon only during alt/rifle that's one conversation. It is another if someone was forced to take a standardized test or exam in order to use one during archery. However, the manufacturers have discovered the neat trick of ''archery seasons without Xbows is discrimination to anyone who can't draw one, aim properly or is too young/old/weak/etc.,.'' where they can effectively litigate them into legality. So it becomes easier to just ban them.
Success rates with xbow is not much better than with vertical bows. Your hypothesis about agencies having to limit tags or opportunities due to higher success rates is simply wrong.
 

Page Master

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 23, 2020
Messages
233
Success rates with xbow is not much better than with vertical bows. Your hypothesis about agencies having to limit tags or opportunities due to higher success rates is simply wrong.
It isn't the difference in Xbow vs vertical bows. It's not all the guys trading in their Hoyts for ravens. It is all of the ADDITIONAL hunters who would not otherwise be hunting in archery season, now out also adding success rates to the pile.
 

Billy Goat

Senior Member
Joined
May 6, 2018
Messages
3,689
Location
Shenandoah Valley
It isn't the difference in Xbow vs vertical bows. It's not all the guys trading in their Hoyts for ravens. It is all of the ADDITIONAL hunters who would not otherwise be hunting in archery season, now out also adding success rates to the pile.

That only applies in unlimited tag scenarios.

Happens in the east, but the goal there is higher harvest anyways.
 

Page Master

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 23, 2020
Messages
233
That only applies in unlimited tag scenarios.

Happens in the east, but the goal there is higher harvest anyways.
So you're saying, by allowing Xbows into archery season, won't increase the number of people applying for archery tags in limited units and increased competition/harvest.

I understand why they legalized them all across the Midwest/east. I can buy like 6 tags in Kentucky for $200.
 

Billy Goat

Senior Member
Joined
May 6, 2018
Messages
3,689
Location
Shenandoah Valley
So you're saying, by allowing Xbows into archery season, won't increase the number of people applying for archery tags in limited units and increased competition/harvest.

I understand why they legalized them all across the Midwest/east. I can buy like 6 tags in Kentucky for $200.


I have no idea what it will do to the number of people applying. I would assume it will increase it. That has nothing to do with success rate. If 100 tags are issued and 14 filled, it doesn't matter if 500 or 1000 people applied. Success rate is still 14%.
 

Page Master

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 23, 2020
Messages
233
I have no idea what it will do to the number of people applying. I would assume it will increase it. That has nothing to do with success rate. If 100 tags are issued and 14 filled, it doesn't matter if 500 or 1000 people applied. Success rate is still 14%.
I see what you're saying. That makes perfect sense.

But I think it would increase the number applying for said tags, if they were able to use Xbows, which would decrease your success in a draw.
 

Billy Goat

Senior Member
Joined
May 6, 2018
Messages
3,689
Location
Shenandoah Valley
I see what you're saying. That makes perfect sense.

But I think it would increase the number applying for said tags, if they were able to use Xbows, which would decrease your success in a draw.


I'm not saying you aren't correct, but that would be draw odds, not success rate.

On an individual basis it would effect your success rate at drawing a tag, but that's not success rate.


I think out west they are heavy enough and bulky enough that they aren't that attractive to hunters covering a large amount of ground. Also in an area where you only get a single tag and need to choose your weapon I don't see x-bows being a great attraction over muzzleloaders or rifles, not once someone has handled them, maybe a few people would do it.

Like said, been legal in Wyoming for a while, don't think it's had any profound affect on seasons there.
 

nphunter

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2016
Messages
832
Location
Oregon
I have a buddy who has a device that hooks to his elbow on his bow arm and rests on his hip. I tried it one time just to see if it made a difference and totally missed the target at 40 yards. I can shoot very well at 100 with just my bow with a regular weight stabilizer.

The biggest thing with making a successful shot in archery is consistency. If you were going to shoot with something like a tripod or other steadying device on you or the bow then you would have to sight in and shoot with the tripod all the time. The bow's reaction when resting on a solid object is going to be different than the reaction will be holding the bow in your hand.

IMO the best thing to steady a shot if a person wanted to try it would be something like a trekking pole with a saddle that you could rest your forearm on while shooting, this would allow you to steady your bow arm but otherwise keep consistent form and reaction from the bow.

I agree with not wanting to see these or anything else making bows more efficient, my personal opinion with all of the OTC disappearing is that states should leave some OTC options but only allow traditional gear instead of going 100% draw. It is getting very easy to kill deer and elk with today's archery gear which is why we are losing so much opportunity across the west.
 

Billy Goat

Senior Member
Joined
May 6, 2018
Messages
3,689
Location
Shenandoah Valley
I agree with not wanting to see these or anything else making bows more efficient, my personal opinion with all of the OTC disappearing is that states should leave some OTC options but only allow traditional gear instead of going 100% draw. It is getting very easy to kill deer and elk with today's archery gear which is why we are losing so much opportunity across the west.


I think the biggest thing has been rangefinders.


How many archers could consistently make a kill shot at 50+ yards without a rangefinder? I'm decent judging yardage, but it's a different game as you get out past 45 yards for me, both in my judging, and the effect on trajectory.


I don't know what the answer is going to be moving forward on tags.
 

nphunter

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2016
Messages
832
Location
Oregon
I think the biggest thing has been rangefinders.


How many archers could consistently make a kill shot at 50+ yards without a rangefinder? I'm decent judging yardage, but it's a different game as you get out past 45 yards for me, both in my judging, and the effect on trajectory.


I don't know what the answer is going to be moving forward on tags.

I agree with range finders for both archery and rifle hunting. I'm actually moving backwards personally, I just bought a new recurve and I killed my first buck with a muzzleloader last fall. Hope to be able to participate in some good hunts a little longer going more primitive.
 

87TT

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
2,057
Location
Idaho
I shoot my bow just like my rifle, offhand like a man ;) I shoot 100 yards everyday with the bow. But only for practice.
 

5MilesBack

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
Messages
11,527
Location
Colorado Springs
How many archers could consistently make a kill shot at 50+ yards without a rangefinder? I'm decent judging yardage, but it's a different game as you get out past 45 yards for me, both in my judging, and the effect on trajectory.
In the mountains it's tough sometimes. I practice all the time while hunting with guessing and then ranging. Sometimes I'm spot on, and other times I'm 15-20 yards off on those over 50. So ya......that makes it tough. I rarely have time to range elk, but that's because I'm always running in on them. But I'm 50% on shots over 50 without ranging. I estimated 60 on one while I was nocking my arrow and drawing back, and actual was 59. Then I estimated 55 on another and actual was 54. Both of those hit paydirt.

But then on two other bulls I estimated 50 both times, and actual was just over 60. Both arrows had one vane with a blood streak on the outer edge of it after grazing their chests. The size of the bulls makes a difference when estimating. Both of those were big bulls and looked closer than they were. Inside 50 I've been good, although I overshot a cow 11 years ago on a steep downhill shot. I walked it off several times and calculated in my head, but I still couldn't believe it. But ya......if I can range a bull.......he's dead.
 

Billy Goat

Senior Member
Joined
May 6, 2018
Messages
3,689
Location
Shenandoah Valley
In the mountains it's tough sometimes. I practice all the time while hunting with guessing and then ranging. Sometimes I'm spot on, and other times I'm 15-20 yards off on those over 50. So ya......that makes it tough. I rarely have time to range elk, but that's because I'm always running in on them. But I'm 50% on shots over 50 without ranging. I estimated 60 on one while I was nocking my arrow and drawing back, and actual was 59. Then I estimated 55 on another and actual was 54. Both of those hit paydirt.

But then on two other bulls I estimated 50 both times, and actual was just over 60. Both arrows had one vane with a blood streak on the outer edge of it after grazing their chests. The size of the bulls makes a difference when estimating. Both of those were big bulls and looked closer than they were. Inside 50 I've been good, although I overshot a cow 11 years ago on a steep downhill shot. I walked it off several times and calculated in my head, but I still couldn't believe it. But ya......if I can range a bull.......he's dead.


I have kinda gotten to where I won't take a shot past 55 or so without knowing the yardage. I don't care to chase a wounded bull around. I can normally get a range pretty quickly, but if inside of 50 I'm not bothered with it.

It will probably come up to bite me at some point. I have killed them when they were 10 yards further than I thought, tho i only hit probably the last 3/4" you can kill them with. Guess I only used half that spitfire.
 
Top