The greatest threat to elk hunting is:

[Zappaman]

There are areas with lots of great habitat where elk are below objective. Wolves!

I can't speak to today, but my 25 yr. BLM biologists (and board member for the RMEF in Southern NM) gave a talk about 8 year back when everyone in NM was blaming the wolves. The study in NM (that year) showed BEARS were WAY worse on elk calves back then. But I'm sure wolves do their part... I'm for shooting them both

 

[Huntnnw]

In the Blues Mountain, the big problem isn’t elk eating all the plants, it’s cougars/bears/wolves eating all the elk. Your answer is a popular tack of the anti -hunters, and correct in the past, but not now in WA.

It’s an effective tack, because there is much truth in it. Habitat and forage loss is the greatest historical threat to elk populations.

However, in democratic WA state and the Blues Mountains in particular, overpredation is the primary current problem. Calf recruitment rates in the Blues are in the TEENS.

The last collared calf study in the Blues saw 77/125 calves eaten by lions and bears, in the first 150 days of life.

We need to band together. Habitat loss is still huge, but the rising imminent threat is the anti-hunting establishment and their pet carnivores.

Don’t think they can breach the politics in your state? I hope you’re right…

the current study is 125 collared and 9 alive right now! sad days in the blues right now to see the downfall of a once great elk herd

 

[Indian Summer]

I can't speak to today, but my 25 yr. BLM biologists (and board member for the RMEF in Southern NM) gave a talk about 8 year back when everyone in NM was blaming the wolves. The study in NM (that year) showed BEARS were WAY worse on elk calves back then. But I'm sure wolves do their part... I'm for shooting them both

Maybe way down in New Mexico. Not from Wyoming north and pretty soon Colorado. Those states always had bears and lions and lots of elk. Now there are bears lions and wolves and not so many elk. Look at Yellowstone… had bears. Had tons of elk. Has prime habitat. Added wolves and elk went from 12,000 to 2,000.

 

[bayoublaster7527]

Wow there are plenty of choices to pick from:
- Loss of habitat/fragmentation of migration corridors
- Unregulated introduction/expansion of predators
- Poor elk management practices/increased hunting pressure
- Growing anti-hunter sentiment in western states

Plenty of reasons and areas to get involved…..

 

[AaronMColeman]

The whole American West is in an epic drought. I haven't heard much about it in regard to elk habitat, but it has to have an effect on wildlife as a whole. Something I'd like to look into.

I'm no expert (and I'm pretty sure most of us in here are just spitballing), but from what I can see, Yellowstone is down to 1970s levels for elk which is not great. As a resident of the greater Yellowstone region, and someone who hunts the area I know I see more wolves and more wolf sign every year. It has been hot and dry the last couple of winters and I have seen multiple wolves and sign everywhere the last couple of years.

I don't know exactly but Yellowstone seems to be a good test example for other places to look at.

 

[Newtosavage]

I lean left, bear arms, hunt, husband shoots competitively. All it takes to avoid this is showing up at meetings and voicing. Fortunately our local commission is good - all ranchers or hunters; but the state is leaning toward banning various predator hunts, yet funding others. Seems to be no rhyme nor reason and decisions not based on wildlife science. Your local Fish and Game Depts are where your biologists and rangeland conservationists are housed - they’re the experts and typically advise the local boards and state commissions, but too often the science of game management for the good of all falls on deaf ears.

Finally a common sense answer. Too many sportsmen and women like to sit around and b*tch instead of showing up with informed opinions. So they get what they get.

If the anti-hunters are winning, it's only because they are out-working the hunters.

 

[Pony Soldier]

Last year I contacted the biologists in my area. The one I talked to in the district I live in said she hadn't been in the field in five years. The one in the adjacent area said she had 5 districts to travel in but had never been in the district. She just managed it with the adjacent district that has very little to do with the elk population of this district. Both said they didn't have anyone working on predators.

Our deer are nearly extinct. The elk population is half of what it has been for 30 years but is now listed as over objective.

I urged them to build a speaking relationship with the ranchers to understand calving success or a hunter network to be their eyes and ears. No desire or interest.

Maybe the answer is no biologists if they aren't in the field. I feel one of our problems is Mt. FWP.

 

[Elk97]

Incompetent politicians with their political agendas that favor a voting base that far too often doesn’t understand the ecology of the mountains. Hunters are and always have been the greatest conservationists because we have a deep love of the wild and the animals that live there. But we are always painted as the “bad guys”. One day I fear our way of life will be gone…

Our grandfathers way of life is already gone. Incremental restrictions and rules take a toll over a couple of decades. My grandkids will never have the freedoms and opportunities that I grew up with (and they are in MT, thank the gods).

 

[Zappaman]

Last year I contacted the biologists in my area. The one I talked to in the district I live in said she hadn't been in the field in five years. The one in the adjacent area said she had 5 districts to travel in but had never been in the district. She just managed it with the adjacent district that has very little to do with the elk population of this district. Both said they didn't have anyone working on predators.

Our deer are nearly extinct. The elk population is half of what it has been for 30 years but is now listed as over objective.

I urged them to build a speaking relationship with the ranchers to understand calving success or a hunter network to be their eyes and ears. No desire or interest.

Maybe the answer is no biologists if they aren't in the field. I feel one of our problems is Mt. FWP.

I completely agree with the above... My biologist buddy (and 30 year hunting buddy) is a retired wilderness biologist from the BLM (I worked for him in college back from 1987 - 1990) and he said the same thing-- the 'FNGs" NOW working the districts aren't in the field like they used to be. That right there is a big problem to me as one cannot manage what they are not experiencing.

 

[TheTone]

Politicians that think they should manage wildlife and the people lining their pockets that think they should get preferential treatment/more opportunity

 

[TheTone]

the current study is 125 collared and 9 alive right now! sad days in the blues right now to see the downfall of a once great elk herd

Not to mention bulls that are hunted from august-March by the local tribes. They’re hammering the big bulls

 

[Pony Soldier]

I hunt, on the average, 5-6 weeks a year in very remote areas. I live on a ranch where cows calve out every spring. The last 300 bull I killed or saw was in 1983. Now you tell me how well is the resource being managed. Average age of bulls in the field? 2-3 years.

I propose that the next elk season we initiate is paint ball gun season. That way we can all see how many time each elk is being shot. Kind of like the Indian game of counting coup.

 

[Jkean949]

I hunt, on the average, 5-6 weeks a year in very remote areas. I live on a ranch where cows calve out every spring. The last 300 bull I killed or saw was in 1983. Now you tell me how well is the resource being managed. Average age of bulls in the field? 2-3 years.

I propose that the next elk season we initiate is paint ball gun season. That way we can all see how many time each elk is being shot. Kind of like the Indian game of counting coup.

Would a one year moratorium be enough?

Is the management unit you are in down in general? The unit I hunt is reportedly well over objective.

 

[Pony Soldier]

According to FWP district 318 is over objective. District 350 just had a shoulder season (2017). The biologist said they killed 40, the game warden told a friend 1,600 and they would recover in a couple years.

For deer, which was a trophy area in 1963, the only option I see is close the season for 10 years, look at it and then possibly keep it closed for another 10.

For elk- shorten the bow season to 3 weeks and make everyone pick their weapon. Reduce the open road density during all sesons and keep most closed on the winter range. Reduce the cats to a breeding minimum until the deer recover and get the wolves under control while critters are numerous enough to maintain a genetic breeding diversity.

And finally get Mt FWP to manage OUR game instead of license sales. Clean house with early retirements and start over.

 

[mcamakua]

Kids that have no 1st hand experience hunting!

Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk

 

[wind gypsy]

According to FWP district 318 is over objective. District 350 just had a shoulder season (2017). The biologist said they killed 40, the game warden told a friend 1,600 and they would recover in a couple years.

For deer, which was a trophy area in 1963, the only option I see is close the season for 10 years, look at it and then possibly keep it closed for another 10.

For elk- shorten the bow season to 3 weeks and make everyone pick their weapon. Reduce the open road density during all sesons and keep most closed on the winter range. Reduce the cats to a breeding minimum until the deer recover and get the wolves under control while critters are numerous enough to maintain a genetic breeding diversity.

And finally get Mt FWP to manage OUR game instead of license sales. Clean house with early retirements and start over.

The wildlife professionals at FWP can’t do a whole lot when the Director of FWP seems set on ignoring them or worse. Should probably set your sights on the Director or the legislature that has made a mockery of the agency.

Where are you in MT that you haven’t seen a 300” bull since the 80s?

 

[Pony Soldier]

Started northwest of Missoula. Last 35 years north of Butte.

 

[QuackAttack]

I can't speak to today, but my 25 yr. BLM biologists (and board member for the RMEF in Southern NM) gave a talk about 8 year back when everyone in NM was blaming the wolves. The study in NM (that year) showed BEARS were WAY worse on elk calves back then. But I'm sure wolves do their part... I'm for shooting them both

From the biologists that I know, mountain lions are the worst about killing deer, elk, and sheep…followed by bears, then wolves.

The thing is, wolves multiply so fast and cover so much ground, they can force migratory behaviour and cause things like stillborn calves. So, wolves are a big problem.

Overall, the US has a serious predator problem.

 

[Pony Soldier]

The current FWP director hasn't been there long enough to create the damage I have seen. It's been a long time coming. The year all the mulies died they still were giving out lots of doe tags. It took 3-4 years to figure out something happened.

In 2018 I went for a muley tag in 380 south. I found the last of them in a pile of skeletons at the bottom of a draw. It appeared to be a winter kill problem. At least 15 mature deer skeletons in a pile with no dismemberment would appear to me that the clustered after a storm and died. I got the number of the biologist to share my observation. The response was yah things happen. No change occurred. I rode through the next year - no deer and no tracks in a 15 mile sweep with fresh snow.

Things need to change. Selling tags when the object is gone is a money issue not a management issue.

 

[Huntnnw]

Not to mention bulls that are hunted from august-March by the local tribes. They’re hammering the big bulls

yup! pretty sickening to witness. Just saw 2 360 bulls killed recently and I am almost positive they were shot on 4-0 land wdfw bought. Guy was a felon just released from prison and shot it with his bow... right and somehow another bull just as big laying next to it in background