Toughest Elk Arrow?

[wind gypsy]

I try building the best arrow I possibly can...i know the internet experts say if your Accurate it doesn't matter but in my little experience accuracy and hunting don't exactly go hand in hand sometimes....things are moving...wind is blowing...steep angled shots...shit happens...il take every 1% increase i can get regardless "if it matters"

Black eagle revalation with stainless components for me

I’m no engineer but how can an outsert and 0.125” center pin be as strong as a standard insert or HIT with collar? Seems like in the theme of this thread that would be a weaker shaft to broadhead interface than others.

 

[Elkangle]

have you tested the revalation ??

 

[wind gypsy]

have you tested the revalation ??

Nope. Wouldn't make any sense for me to because i'm not a good enough shot to see the difference.

I'm open to the idea that my perception is wrong. It just seems like an outsert that puts the base of a broadhead 1" past the end of the shaft and uses a .125" pin is at a disadvantage compared to a insert system @ .204 or .244" without an addtional 1" of leverage past the shaft. Does the outsert make up for the weak/thin pin?

 

[Stalker69]

My point is that if he's smart enough to design carbon fiber risers for flagship bows at a major bow company, he should be smart enough to know a thing or two about arrow strength and not do something stupid arrow design wise.

Sincerely,
A fellow engineer.

You would think he would be smart enough to shoot a different arrow then. If I broke three I would for sure be shooting something else. But I am no engineer !

 

[brettdunn7]

Just about ready to pull the trigger on some new arrows. What are some of the toughest ones out there? The Victory VAP SS has my attention. Surprisingly not too much out there about it.

I'll probably be going with a 250 spine, iron will head, elk hunting.

Does a collar system like ethics make do a lot to increase strength?

Thanks!

You would be fine with those arrows just good luck finding some unless you have a local shop somewhere that actually has them. And the ethics system would work great. They make great stuff. I actually just got my Victory RIP TKO gamers (elites were back ordered for months now) in today and putting ethics inserts in. Got the 250 as well.


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[treillw]

You would think he would be smart enough to shoot a different arrow then. If I broke three I would for sure be shooting something else. But I am no engineer !

Nobody said he was using the same arrow

Again I know no details.

 

[mcmurder77]

Nobody said he was using the same arrow

Again I know no details.

I sent you a PM

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

 

[Elkangle]

Nope. Wouldn't make any sense for me to because i'm not a good enough shot to see the difference.

I'm open to the idea that my perception is wrong. It just seems like an outsert that puts the base of a broadhead 1" past the end of the shaft and uses a .125" pin is at a disadvantage compared to a insert system @ .204 or .244" without an addtional 1" of leverage past the shaft. Does the outsert make up for the weak/thin pin?

i understand your line of thoughts but in my experience what your talking about isn't necessarily the weak link...it seems like majority of outsert arrows I've busted...which unfortunately is alot...the shaft is the week link behind the outsert

The wall diameter of the revalation is pretty dang thick with a high gpi in such skinny arrow...also the outsert is alot thicker, because its going from standard and tapering to the micro...so the wall diameter of that is thicker

My last arrow was a deep impact which most considered a very strong arrow and the revalation makes it look like a kids toy

Hope this helps

 

[Billy Goat]

i understand your line of thoughts but in my experience what your talking about isn't necessarily the weak link...it seems like majority of outsert arrows I've busted...which unfortunately is alot...the shaft is the week link behind the outsert

The wall diameter of the revalation is pretty dang thick with a high gpi in such skinny arrow...also the outsert is alot thicker, because its going from standard and tapering to the micro...so the wall diameter of that is thicker

My last arrow was a deep impact which most considered a very strong arrow and the revalation makes it look like a kids toy

Hope this helps

It's because of the leverage created by the outsert that it breaks at the back of the pin. So say the weak point on these systems is the back of the insert, that creates a stress riser in the carbon arrow basically. So with a broadhead that is 1.5" from that point because of a half-out versus the 3/4" with a standard insert, the same forces would actually be doubled by the half-outs.

Thing is these sideways forces should only be an issue after the arrow is stopped. Shouldn't effect anything during shooting.

 

[5MilesBack]

Is anyone actually breaking arrows on impact with elk bones? I unintentionally shot a bull right in the shoulder knuckle from 17 yards a few years ago. I was shooting a 500gr .300 spine arrow with a regular HIT insert and no collar or BAR at 75lbs and 32 1/2" draw. The arrow got almost 3" of penetration before falling out about 150 yards later. The BH was dinged up, but the arrow was fine. I'm just wondering what people expect or experience when shooting an elk? Are they breaking a lot of arrows on impact?

 

[Billy Goat]

Is anyone actually breaking arrows on impact with elk bones? I unintentionally shot a bull right in the shoulder knuckle from 17 yards a few years ago. I was shooting a 500gr .300 spine arrow with a regular HIT insert and no collar or BAR at 75lbs and 32 1/2" draw. The arrow got almost 3" of penetration before falling out about 150 yards later. The BH was dinged up, but the arrow was fine. I'm just wondering what people expect or experience when shooting an elk? Are they breaking a lot of arrows on impact?

That's exactly what I had asked earlier. I'm sure lots of arrows end up broken, few if any are actually from the impact of the shot.

 

[RaggedHunter]

Is anyone actually breaking arrows on impact with elk bones? I unintentionally shot a bull right in the shoulder knuckle from 17 yards a few years ago. I was shooting a 500gr .300 spine arrow with a regular HIT insert and no collar or BAR at 75lbs and 32 1/2" draw. The arrow got almost 3" of penetration before falling out about 150 yards later. The BH was dinged up, but the arrow was fine. I'm just wondering what people expect or experience when shooting an elk? Are they breaking a lot of arrows on impact?

To answer your question on if anyone has had arrows break on impact.

Of the 2 arrows I had break directly behind the half out on my pierce platinums. The first arrow I do not believe broke on impact, it's hard to say exactly when it broke but I do not believe it was on impact, as the arrow got "okay" (not great penetration, mechanical broadhead). I recovered the back of the arrow while tracking, and found the broadhead and broken piece inside the bulls chest cavity upon recovery. Broadhead was not lodged in offside ribs or anything when I recovered it, but it could have backed out at some point. This break was understandable in my mind.

The 2nd arrow did in fact break at the same point on impact. This bull was alert when I shot, and was ducking when the arrow hit. Arrow hit high ribs (upper third) and snapped off directly behind the half out. Arrow was laying on the ground next to where the bull was standing, and the bull took off with my broadhead and about 2" of arrow in him. I believe that the downward movement of the elk had a significant role in causing this particular arrow to break.

Regardless, I did not think that this break was acceptable with regards to arrow durability. After seeing 2 of these arrows break in the same exact place, it was obvious to me that this setup had a weak point directly behind the half out. I did not have high confidence in the arrows structural integrity, It was at this point that I opted to change up my arrow setup to something more durable. Had it been just the first scenario, I probably would not had seen a reason to change setups.

 

[treillw]

I don't care what happens to the arrow after it has done it's job. If an animal whacks it off a tree, or whatever, and it breaks, so be it. A $30 arrow is a small price to pay for an elk.

I just don't want them to break before they do what they are supposed to do, or they are useless.

 

[MichHunter]

Grizzlysicks!

 

[Wallcrawler]

I’ve had 2 break on elk. One on the offside shoulder and another on a frontal shot. What I wouldn’t want is one to break on impact.

This is exactly what I've experienced, if it didn't pass through that front leg in the impact side just snaps it off.

 

[5MilesBack]

This year I shot my moose in his left side with a GT Kinetic XT 200 with HIT insert and a QAD Exodus BH. 520gr arrow at 280fps, so I expected a pass through since I've seen others post that they got full pass throughs with a 400ish arrow at 265. But after shooting my bull I couldn't find the arrow anywhere. No signs that the arrow stayed inside of him but no arrow. Then I shot a second arrow (same arrow but with a GR Fatal Steel BH) in his right side. Fletchings and about 4" of arrow sticking out the side. So he goes down and ends up on his right side. Entrance hole from the QAD looks good.

So I start skinning him down his left side and suddenly under the hide there's this arrow sticking out from behind his last rib and high near his backstrap. The BH was busted off with the insert still inside the arrow, so I still didn't know which arrow it was. Broke down his entire left side and then pulled that arrow out. The entire arrow came out but was broken in two places. Then we rolled him over. When we rolled him over, there was my QAD Exodus arrow laying on the ground fully intact, but missing a vane and the nock was broken off flush with the arrow. That arrow must have been almost all the way through and just dangling out his right side when he fell on it. I'm really surprised that that arrow stayed in one piece with the entire weight of a moose on it, as these Kinetic XT 200's haven't shown themselves to be very durable from my experience.

The only thing I can gather from the other arrow is that the BH stuck into bone and then broke off when he moved and somehow that arrow ended up pointing towards his back end and sticking out behind his ribs. That makes sense as well because I did find a bunch of blood shot on his left shoulder which is where the BH would have impacted on his offside. These arrows do crazy things once inside of an animal and they start moving.