Utah license fee increase

[Baddog]

just another fee...

 

[BuzzH]

Utah has the legal right to raise their NR fees to anything they want...and I'll pay it, greedily, if they give me the tags I want.

 

[realunlucky]

Utah has the legal right to raise their NR fees to anything they want...and I'll pay it, greedily, if they give me the tags I want.

Utah will sell you any tag you want if your willing to be the highest bidder.

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[BuzzH]

Utah will sell you any tag you want if your willing to be the highest bidder.

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Touche'...

 

[Travis Hobbs]

They really should remove (2) year application loophole. Pretty reasonable tag increases imo. Utah bends over backwards imo for non-residents compared to most states out west.

 

[KineKilla]

I'm a native to Utah and don't feel that tag prices are way out of line. I just paid $413 for a resident Mtn. Goat tag a couple of days ago and I'd pay it again without blinking.

It's just money and I don't mind paying for the adventure I get in return.

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[BFR]

Since I only have to buy a “license” every other year the increase there is minimal, and as I only put in for antlerless elk that increase is still minimal so I don’t have a problem with it. With the reduction of tags where I go I may not draw anyway but that’s how it goes. At what point do I say enough? When I get too old or my budget says so, until then, it’s a fun hunt and in the last 35+ yrs I’ve yet to eat a tag.

 

[stonewall]

I've always wanted to try the OTC any bull elk hunt there, but for that price and expectations of a subpar experience anyway...maybe not

 

[KineKilla]

I do not see the cost of the tags as the biggest issue but rather, the increasingly low tag numbers and at times the quality of animals in the field. In the unit I typically hunt Elk I have not been able to draw even an antlerless tag in over 3 years. The drastic cut in tag numbers caused an immediate backlog of hunters and now we are stuck in the dreaded reality of point creep.

 

[idahohikker]

I want to see the kind of outrage here that existed on the thread regarding Idaho fee increases, including whining and moaning about pricing the average guy (who lives 2000 miles away and spends a ton on travel costs) out of hunting.

 

[Chucklehead]

I want to see the kind of outrage here that existed on the thread regarding Idaho fee increases, including whining and moaning about pricing the average guy (who lives 2000 miles away and spends a ton on travel costs) out of hunting.

The only thing getting more tiresome than NR complaining about tag price increases is residents complaining about NR....

 

[cmahoney]

I want to see the kind of outrage here that existed on the thread regarding Idaho fee increases, including whining and moaning about pricing the average guy (who lives 2000 miles away and spends a ton on travel costs) out of hunting.

I don't think Utah gets the traffic from those places that Idaho and Colorado do.

 

[idahohikker]

The only thing getting more tiresome than NR complaining about tag price increases is residents complaining about NR....

Very different between residents and nonresidents. Our system in hunting in the US is geared towards the residents of a state. A state could charge $10,000 for nonresidents to hunt elk and it would be 100% legal. So yes as a resident of one state and nonresident of another state it doesn’t make any sense for me to complain about price increases in the states in which I’m a nonresident. Nonresidents will learn at some point to be grateful just to get a tag.

 

[mfllood3800]

I want to see the kind of outrage here that existed on the thread regarding Idaho fee increases, including whining and moaning about pricing the average guy (who lives 2000 miles away and spends a ton on travel costs) out of hunting.

I am in Utah, and hunt Idaho as well as Az. I was glad Id raised their prices. All I saw in the camp sites as I drove thru was NR plates. It was crazy. Obviously I am also glad Ut has followed suit. Way too many tags period, in my areas where OTC archery spike elk is unlimited, where I draw a general archery deer tag every other year, when it used to be every year with left overs. For me it's a dream come true.

 

[KineKilla]

I've been waiting for UT to start requiring full payment of tag fees up front with reimbursement after the draws for unsuccessful applicants. I for one feel it would help lower the number of applicants overall.

 

[MuleyFever]

I've been waiting for UT to start requiring full payment of tag fees up front with reimbursement after the draws for unsuccessful applicants. I for one feel it would help lower the number of applicants overall.

Won’t happen, it costs too much.

 

[Chucklehead]

I am in Utah, and hunt Idaho as well as Az. I was glad Id raised their prices. All I saw in the camp sites as I drove thru was NR plates. It was crazy. Obviously I am also glad Ut has followed suit. Way too many tags period, in my areas where OTC archery spike elk is unlimited, where I draw a general archery deer tag every other year, when it used to be every year with left overs. For me it's a dream come true.

Slight increases in prices isn't going to make very much difference in the amount of people you see or the amount of people in the draw. This year and maybe next year you should see a difference because of Covid19. When the economy turns back around you will see the NR numbers climb to pre-Covid19 levels and eventually exceed them.

 

[Chucklehead]

Very different between residents and nonresidents. Our system in hunting in the US is geared towards the residents of a state. A state could charge $10,000 for nonresidents to hunt elk and it would be 100% legal. So yes as a resident of one state and nonresident of another state it doesn’t make any sense for me to complain about price increases in the states in which I’m a nonresident. Nonresidents will learn at some point to be grateful just to get a tag.

So it's OK when you "whine and moan" (as you put it) about NRs because you are a resident.

 

[idahohikker]

So it's OK when you "whine and moan" (as you put it) about NRs because you are a resident.

Yes! Because nonresidents have zero to stand on. I would love if WY, UT, etc. didn’t raise prices but to complain at all is pretty silly when those states could just institute a rule making it 100x more or provide way less tags and that’s fully their prerogative. The train is definitely on the tracks to regular price increases at least while there is heavy demand for deer and elk tags in the west.

 

[Anello]

I'm happy to take this conversation up on a side bar, but ,no, states cannot just charge 100X or 10K arbitrarily. There is case law on this that I am sure noone on this forum wants to read, but it is pretty clear. Any fees charged must be rationally related to a legitimate state interest. Excluding non-residents is not a legit interest. Preservation of state wildlife absolutely IS a state interest. But, in this case, Utah cites a desire to NOT draw funds from the state to fund the agency/wildlife. That position essentially admits that the state residents are not paying into the wildlife management in their taxes (no standing) and admits that the increases on non-residents are designed to prevent the state residents from having to pay into the system by punishing non-residents. That is not a legitimate interest. Maybe I am reading that wrong. Happy to consider another opinion.

Also, those same non-residents presumably pay Federal taxes, which to some extent fund the federal lands in the states. There may be other Federal funding ties, as well. So, non-residents can make an argument that they already pay for elements of the resource in the state. Not a terribly strong position, but it is rational. Point being that the legal elements of fees, as described here, are subject to a rational basis test if challenged on Constitutional grounds. Based on this short and incomplete analysis (not a legal opinion), it fails.

Also, we really need to stop taking the position, as a community, that fee increases are the way to manage wildlife. This knee jerk, "raise fees on non-residents," reaction should only occur when there is an absolute need for it. IF there is, no problem. I am sure that we are all willing to pay our way. If you don't like nonresidents, that is fine. Just lower tag allocations. That way you won't see non-residents in the woods. However, using punitive fees to do so is not supported by logic, or the Constitution. Lets all try to support each other moving forward, and not try to blindly impose punishments that are not related to a legit interest. I love hunting in the United States, both in my home state and elsewhere, and I have no interest in excluding anyone from enjoying the outdoors here or elsewhere.