Vertical split rings

[westsloper]

I've seen the threads on snipershide about vertically split rings. Main argument seems to be that they pinch some scopes, messing with the internals and causing all sorts of disfunction. I have several sets of Warnes sitting around, however, and I was wondering how they work with heavier duty scopes like SWFAs. Are those scopes robust enough to handle the vertical split rings?

 

[hereinaz]

It’s also because the bottom clamping force is divided between clamping on the rail and clamping the scope. That just sets you up for higher probability of failure.

 

[Titanium700]

Since putting a set on my Rem700 I will say.

I absolutely hate them.
I’m taking them back off and selling them.
What a pain in the butt.

 

[TaperPin]

The scope can’t tell the difference between horizontal and vertical split - any damage that happened is definitely from someone putting waaaaaay too much torque on them.

There are three types of vertical split rings, two are ok and one should be avoided.

Of course this kind is ok because the ring screws are separate from the ones that tighten to the base.



The kind below should be avoided at all cost because the lower screws are being asked to do two things at the same time - they clamp the mount to the base and are tightening around the scope at the same time. Too much torque on top and it loosens the clamping force on the base. The torque is also limited to he maximum the scope tube can handle. There are multiple makers of these, but if the lower screws also clamp to the base stay away from them.


The following mount is ok, because the screws for the scope tube are separate from the screw tightening on the base. I chose this picture because it also shows how the vertical split is designed to be snugged up tight on the bottom first with no gap remaining, then the top is tightened to clamp the scope. Only then do you tighten it on the base, and the screw (or lever) for the base is separate from the rings. Talley split rings built like this have been widely used on custom guns for almost half a century and have a very good reputation. When someone has an issue with them the first question I’ll ask is what order did they tighten the screws - usually they fail to tighten the lower scope screws first.

If someone were to tighten the upper and lower scope screws equally, leaving a gap at the lower split, when the base clamp screw is tightened it would put too much stress on the scope and that’s where guys are getting dents. It’s not the scope mount’s fault these guys didn’t read the directions or understand how they are intended to work. They are less idiot proof.

 

[westsloper]

Interesting, thanks.

 

[timbernomad]

An interesting case is the Warne Tikka dovetail mounts. They call for 25 inch lbs torque on the dovetail. I'm assuming they have to in because that same torque is being applied to the scope, right? Sportsmatch rings call for 38 inch lbs if I'm not mistaken, and Burris Tikka dovetail rings call for 60. I'm not sure how the Warnes are supposed to get away with so much less torque, unless the Sportsmatch (and especially the Burris) are just massively over torqued.

I'm not too worried about Warnes hurting my 10x42 mil quad. But I would be worried about the scope or the rings slipping and losing zero.

 

[SDHNTR]

It’s also because the bottom clamping force is divided between clamping on the rail and clamping the scope. That just sets you up for higher probability of failure.

Unless we’re talking about Talley Screw Lock (or lever lock) detachable rings. Separate bottom screws for the tube and the base.

 

[SDHNTR]

An interesting case is the Warne Tikka dovetail mounts. They call for 25 inch lbs torque on the dovetail. I'm assuming they have to in because that same torque is being applied to the scope, right? Sportsmatch rings call for 38 inch lbs if I'm not mistaken, and Burris Tikka dovetail rings call for 60. I'm not sure how the Warnes are supposed to get away with so much less torque, unless the Sportsmatch (and especially the Burris) are just massively over torqued.

I'm not too worried about Warnes hurting my 10x42 mil quad. But I would be worried about the scope or the rings slipping and losing zero.

Different torque specs for different sized screws are not comparable. 25 in lbs doesn’t necessarily mean less clamping force than 38 or 60 in lbs, it all depends on the hardware used.

 

[Balderdash]

Before I knew any better, I ran Warne verticals on a lot of rigs, including on a lot of Tikkas direct to the integral rail. Never noticed a tracking error on those rigs, but had it reported by enough sources and people I trust that I discontinued using them at least 8-10 years ago. The unequal clamping tension is logical. Lot of good ring options nowadays.

Still have a lot of set it and forget rigs so equipped. No plans to change anything on them.

 

[timbernomad]

Different torque specs for different sized screws are not comparable. 25 in lbs doesn’t necessarily mean less clamping force than 38 or 60 in lbs, it all depends on the hardware used.

Thanks for the info. I'm not an engineer and I appreciate the insight.

 

[douglasfir]

just another data point… famous/infamous big stick over on 24hourcampfire uses warne vertical split rings and recommends them

 

[TimberHunter]

Additional small data point, I had the warne split tikka dovetail rings for 3 seasons. The rifles went on many fairly tough hunts and took 5 mule deer and an elk. Avg shot around 450 yards. Rifle was never dropped or fell onto

I changed rings because I went to a 30mm SWFA and a pic rail but if I go back to the dovetail I’d consider the Sportsmatch or Unknown Munition rings. Not because warne had any issues, just something different


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