What to do...change it or keep it? (Leica 65mm or Kowa 553)

[6.5x284]

Rokslide,

I am unsure of what to do with my spotting scope. I currently run an angled Leica APO Televiv 65mm which I love. It's light, and has a fantastic image and great eye box and FOV. I can easily spot goats, elk, and bear at 5+ miles which is impressive considering the air is usually partly saturated with some impurity, usually wildfire smoke/haze. The 25-50x is perfect for me, as again usually there is quite a bit of impurities and it starts getting unusable.

This is where my dilemma comes into play. I use my spotter about 50% while in my pack whether day hunting or backpacking in. The other 50% of the time is from my truck whether driving to a viewpoint during scouting season or rifle season, or grabbing it and a gun and taking a quick 5 min walk type of deal to a glassing knob.

I run 10x50 Viper HD's or Swarovski SLC 15x56 bino's depending on the hunt. Archery is usually just the 10's and only a spotter if I know my hunt that day will take me to an area where I can glass for a future days hunt. Rifle is usually just 15's and a tripod if I'm not walking old roads/clearcuts or doing a two vehicle hunt down a ridge in which case I take my 10's. I bring the tripod regardless during rifle season as a shooting rest so no weight difference there. As far as spotter goes, during rifle I bring it again, when I know there is a view point where I can glass a basin for the next days hunt. Rarely can I spot something that I can get to that same day with a spotter, potentially if I located it at first light I could be in position for last light.

With all that being said, do I change to the Kowa for 22.6 oz savings in weight? Is the reduced eye box worth the weight savings? It would allow me to run my 10's and the Kowa for not much more weight than just the Leica by itself. But, I can really spot animals with 15x SLCs.

I'm torn. Anyone thinking similar? Anyone want to tell me I'm smoking crack?

*edit: I'm not a trophy hunter, but do look for a mature local representative of that species. But I'm not counting inches in a scope. I'm making sure it's worth going after is all. Often that is doable in 15's and even 10's.

Feisol 3342 Tripod: 40 oz
Outdoorsman Pan Head: 10.5 oz
---------------------
Kowa: 28.5 oz
Leica: 38.8 (body) + 12.3 (eyepiece) = 51.1oz
Swaro 15's: 42oz
Vortex 10's: 28.4 oz

 

[gr8fuldoug]

I agree the Leica is an outstanding optic, however, the little Kowa at 28.5 ounces and only 10.6" long is just insane. Optically amazing and the same weight as a standard 10x42 binocular. It's a spotter everyone would always bring along.

 

[6.5x284]

How easy is it to get behind at various power levels? Is I finicky? Especially at upper levels.


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[gr8fuldoug]

The Kowa is a bit more finicky than bigger scopes but once you use it a bit you'll have no issue

 

[jmden]

Have both, maybe, depending on kind of hunt? I have the Kowa 664 and 554 and will be taking one or the other, depending on the type of hunt--basically, am I trying to go superlight or not?

I've run a Kowa 664 (44 oz. total) for several years and found it outstanding, but found the 20-60x eyepiece a little wanting in two ways. One, it's a narrow FOV, and two, I really like 15x as the low end. However I sure like having 60x and have used it many times and that scope lets you use 60x with little to no issues I've heard about with other scopes.

I picked up the Kowa 554 from Doug@CameraLand several months ago and it is amazing for the small package. That's what a pure fluorite objective lens can help do. However, it still does not quite hang with the 664 and it becomes more noticeable as it gets darker--if both scopes are at the same magnification when comparing. However, as it gets darker and you dial both scopes to their lowest magnification, all of a sudden the Kowa 554 is has a larger exit pupil and a lighter picture to my eye. But 15x vs. 20x. But I like general spotting with a 15x better.

Point being that there's advantages/disadvantages to each. Might just have to pick what's most important for a given trip and keep both?

I have looked through those Leicas and thought them impressive. In fact very similar to the Kowa 664 but probably more forgiving, which is super nice. FYI, I run two of the Sirui T-025x with C-10 ball head tripods. They are less than two pounds and are there better tripods? Yeah, but for the weight and size and 13lb rated capacity... The 664 is OK with it but the 554 feels quite a bit more solid on it.

As an aside, I recently had an opportunity to compare a friend's Swaro ATX 65mm (25-50x) to the Kowa 664 and 554. All were set up side by side, looking at the same thing and all on 30x ish. The 664 had the better picture, IMO, and then right at sunset something changed. I kept going back and forth, but the Swaro got the nod at that point and was lighter and clearer. Interesting. Then 1/2 hour after sunset, I put all three to their lowest magnification just out of curiosity. The 554 had the best visibility at that point, I thought with the 15x, vs. the 20x of the Kowa 664 and the 25x of the Swaro. Lots of variables, but interesting observations.

Hard to beat that Leica...

 

[Ryan Avery]

The more I use the 553 the less I like it. It is finicky and you definitely lose out on low light performance. I used in on a few bear hunt this spring on overcast days you lose the use of the spotter very quickly over the 65 ATX. I know its not apple to apples but damn I had 30+ minutes of shooting light left and that spotter was done.

 

[6.5x284]

The more I use the 553 the less I like it. It is finicky and you definitely lose out on low light performance. I used in on a few bear hunt this spring on overcast days you lose the use of the spotter very quickly over the 65 ATX. I know its not apple to apples but damn I had 30+ minutes of shooting light left and that spotter was done.

Interesting. What kind of ranges were you trying to glass up those last 30 minutes and at what power?


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[Beendare]

jmdens #5 post is a gem- fantastic comparison.

Posts like that^ are why I spend time on Rokslide...much better than, "I like my Vipers"

OP, this is a very expensive quandary you are in. You have an excellent spotter....sure the other one is lighter but you will be sacrificing a little performance too.

At the risk of sounding like an old Fuddy Duddy, I say put the $$$$ into a good Mutual fund and in 20 years you will have a good chunk of change.

..

 

[North61]

There is no replacement for displacement. 65MM is going to have some advantages over 55MM when the quality is even. The Kowa looks very good but I have the 65MM Leica and it really is outstanding. Saves a lot of miles! If I wanted to use 15x56 Binos/s I'd likely pick up a doubler and boost the Bino's to 30X and leave the spotter at home.

As an aspiring sheep hunter here in the Yukon I have spent a lot of money reducing the weight of my gear. 5.5 pound rifle, 3.5 pound pack, 2 pound sleeping bag, 3 pound 3 man tent,1 pound stove system with fuel, and so on. So far I am accepting the weight of the Leica as it is so damn good. I might change my mind when the kids leave home and I need to carry it all by myself but not yet. It will be the last heavy item to be replaced.

 

[6.5x284]

There is no replacement for displacement. 65MM is going to have some advantages over 55MM when the quality is even. The Kowa looks very good but I have the 65MM Leica and it really is outstanding. Saves a lot of miles! If I wanted to use 15x56 Binos/s I'd likely pick up a doubler and boost the Bino's to 30X and leave the spotter at home.

As an aspiring sheep hunter here in the Yukon I have spent a lot of money reducing the weight of my gear. 5.5 pound rifle, 3.5 pound pack, 2 pound sleeping bag, 3 pound 3 man tent,1 pound stove system with fuel, and so on. So far I am accepting the weight of the Leica as it is so damn good. I might change my mind when the kids leave home and I need to carry it all by myself but not yet. It will be the last heavy item to be replaced.

Never thought about doublers on the binos. I’ll look into that. That may be the ticket. I’m assuming you lose some things visually, especially at low light, but I bet even just one to confirm something or getter better eyes on would be good enough with a 15x56 SLC for the main job of gaining a little more detail of the antlers or determine if it’s a rock vs animal, etc...

I’ll definitely be researching this. Thanks!


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[tdhanses]

I’ve never used doublers but I’ve yet to read anything good about using them.

 

[gr8fuldoug]

I’ve never used doublers but I’ve yet to read anything good about using them.

They reduced light transmission drastically as well as cut optical quality

 

[North61]

I just don't see the point of taking 15X Binoculars and a spotter. I'd do almost anything to avoid the duplication.

I have a vortex doubler and yes it isn't a perfect solution, however it does weigh less than 2 oz. That is the big selling point.