Who to go with for Grizzly & Dall combo?

[mtnclimber]

Ive hunted all over alaska for sheep and in my experience the biggest rams I've seen and or killed were in areas that guides had a sole use of. If i was a non res id defintely lean toward a guide with a sole use area. Thats just me though

 

[4everOntheMtn]

It took me a bit to research how Alaska basically has a two tier system of managing their lands for commercial use. The more I dug into this prior to booking a hunt the less and less I as a non resident wanted any part of state land hunting especially in units 20 and 19 which is the vast majority of guides selling sheep hunts in Alaska. About 10 months ago at the Wild Sheep Show in Reno my mind was almost made up of booking with a fellow Colorado company operating in Alaska. This was until how much questionable and vague info about their company they tried to sell me on, assistant guides not legally able to contract hunts running this company, an unfavorable recommendation from local State Wildlife Troopers, and an overall "used car salesman" feel from the guys supposedly running it . All of this on state land.
With a Federal Concession it cut down on a lot of that type of behavior in my personal research and it mirrored a very successful business/conservation model the Canadians were doing in the NWT and the Yukon for Dall sheep hunting. And when I talked with a few residents on where they personally sheep hunt at and Alaska resident registered guides I decided to wait for the booking. IMO that shows quality as well when these Federal Concession sheep area guides are 2-4 years out to book a hunt. It was also weird to me that I could not legally hunt by myself as a non resident , which I am more than capable of doing but a non resident of Alaska could take my money and guide me??? Just does not seem right. Anyway I was lucky enough to get a cancellation hunt and will be there in 2020. This may be my only opportunity to get to hunt sheep and I was willing to pay an extra $3K for a more remote and less crowded area with the hope of a better managed sheep harvest quota with this outfitter.
In my research I did find some guys on state land that I would consider hunting with but they mostly were in draw areas, a couple were in OTC areas though.
One tool I would for sure use as a non resident researching guided hunts in Alaska is the Big Game Commercial Services Board website. It can tell you who is the actual contracting guide, their license status, animals they are legally able to guide for and areas they are legally allowed to operate in commercially. I would also contact the Alaska State Wildlife Troopers for any violations that a potential outfitter you plan to use has on their record.
Also stay away from companies that basically "rent" another registered guides outfitters license. It appears to happen a lot in Alaska. Here are my top picks I researched. All do combo sheep and grizzly

Alaska Outfitters Unlimited (Aaron Bloomquist)
Aniakchak Guide Service (Joey Klutsch Jr)
Ultima Thule Outfitters (Paul Claues)
Arctic Alaska Adventures (Thor Stacey)
Deltana Outfitters (Bob Summers)
Arctic Alaska Guide Service (Dave Morris)
Jonah's Alaskan Outfitters (Jonah Stewart)
Black River Hunting Camps (Jake Jefferson)
Ultimate Alaskan Adventures (Steve Johnson)

Draw Hunts (need to have your contract signed and draw hunts submitted by 15 Dec)
Alaska Trophy Adventures (Dan Montgomery)
Freelance Outdoor Adventures (Lance Kronberger)
Alaska Hunting Adventures (Matt Snyder)


And the one thing all of these outfitters have in common is they are from Alaska. I just could not justify paying an outfitter for a hunt who was not an Alaskan resident being a non resident of Alaska myself.

 

[TalusHunterCA]

Wow. All Rokdlide members, thank you. You have provided me with valuable feedback and insights, great perspectives and the opportunity to narrow down what I am looking for. Thank you.

 

[Tanner]

A number of those outfitters you listed are not from Alaska, but I would still say it’s a pretty succinct list of quality outfitters...

 

[4everOntheMtn]

A number of those outfitters you listed are not from Alaska, but I would still say it’s a pretty succinct list of quality outfitters...

Which ones are not from Alaska or I should re-phrase that.....which ones are not Alaska Residents? I honestly don't care that they are not originally from Alaska just that they are Alaska Residents now and have been for some time.
I personally met and talked to over half of them at the DSC or WSF Reno earlier this year. The ones I didn't meet, all but two, I talked to on the phone. The Alaska Resident question is one that I insisted on before I would consider booking after I thought about a couple outfits from Colorado and Kentucky. The two I didn't talk with I did lots of research on and their guide license are showing as Alaska Residents. They are also all Alaska Professional Hunters Association members showing addresses in Alaska.
I ended up booking with Alaska Outfitters Unlimited. Aaron's operation came highly recommended from a few people from this site who have PM'd me on previous years hunts including 2019. I am super excited and cant wait for Aug 2020 to get here. I have a grizzly permit as well.

 

[cbeard64]

I’ve read too many horror stories about hunts in AKs non-exclusive areas to ever consider hunting one.

Tanner, you may be the “bees knees” and guide to 39+ inchers every time. Color me skeptical but I don’t know you so I couldn’t say.

Anywho, if someone offers me a meal and says “Half of the steaks on this table have poison in them but none on this table do” - I know which table I’m choosing. That’s the way I look at non-exclusive areas vs. exclusive AK areas, the Yukon, and NWT.

You can dis that by implying it’s a “wimp” thing to do, I don’t care. But it does give me a window into your attitude/who you are.

As for booking a hunt specifically as a combo, IMO the Cons outweighs the Pros in most cases unless you have at least 14 days to hunt.

 

[SaltySailor]

I'll remind you that a few resident good ol' boys with a supercub or two can make your private wilderness adventure feel real crowded, real quick. Guide exclusive does not mean 'no other people'.

 

[Yellowknife]

Not only cub owning residents (although there are plenty of those). Just because it's a guide "exclusive", doesn't mean it's a transporter exclusive. Particularly in the Brooks Range, you can get a lot of resident parties stacked in a small area via transporter.

Heck, at least one of the guides listed above has a concession you can walk in to from the road.

 

[Arctic_Beaver]

Not only cub owning residents (although there are plenty of those). Just because it's a guide "exclusive", doesn't mean it's a transporter exclusive. Particularly in the Brooks Range, you can get a lot of resident parties stacked in a small area via transporter.

Heck, at least one of the guides listed above has a concession you can walk in to from the road.

I feel like people only think Cubs can access airstrips in sheep country. Let’s not forget about 180s too, they need some love as well!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Yellowknife]

Fair enough!

To get back around to the main topic + the side topic of concessions....

One should keep in mind that the last few years there have been roughly 4,900 resident sheep hunters and only 520 - 550 non-resident. When it comes to local area pressure, it's the residents that will have the larger effect in most units. THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS. Notably, some local Guide Use Areas in 20A and 19C that get slammed by the larger operations, but the both the Wrangells and the Brooks get crowded at times also.

A quick word on Guide Use Areas (GUA). The way the state works, even if you don't have a concession, you have register for a GUA. A GUA is a geographic area, typically smaller than a hunting unit. There is no limit on the number of guides in a GUA, but guide can only register for a limited number of GUA's and can only book hunts for his registered areas.

https://www.commerce.alaska.gov/web...CommercialServicesBoard/GuideUseAreaMaps.aspx

You can easily find out which GUA's your prospective guide is register for by either asking him, or checking on the state license search. The license search will show exactly where each guide is registered to conduct hunts.

The snip below is from an ADF&G publication in 2017. http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/static/hunting/dallsheephunting/pdfs/dalls_sheep_news_winter_2017.pdf

Credit to Mr. Want on this one. I'm going to assume he doesn't mind if I borrow it.



This map shows the number of clients that were run in each GUA in 2014. As you can see, most areas even in the non-concession areas of the Alaska Range, Talkeetna's etc, have very reasonable guide pressure. Clients in each GUA were usually <5, which is hardly a big deal. There are exceptions (shown in red). GUA 20-04 is in the central Alaska Range (Wood River, Yanert) and is notorious for having a large number of operations. 19-2 is in the Western AK Range and is the area around Shanksters old show (Dillanger River).

In the Brooks Range, it's 25-02 just east of the Dalton that see's the most heat. That drainage is popular with both guides and residents. That is a concession area, but clearly sees more clients than the majority of non-concession areas.

Make of this information what you will.

 

[DoubleBroomedMountainRifles]

The 4000+ number resident hunters is a little misleading don't you think? With the free permit any resident gets who wants one the actual number is less than half that who actually hunt.

In 2018 5200+ residents/non residents had permits but only 1900+ resident/non residents actually hunted in the field for sheep. Id venture to say that the 500+ non residents who had permits, everyone hunted. That leaves about 1400 residents.

 

[Yellowknife]

The 4000+ number resident hunters is a little misleading don't you think? With the free permit any resident gets who wants one the actual number is less than half that who actually hunt.

In 2018 5200+ residents/non residents had permits but only 1900+ resident/non residents actually hunted in the field for sheep. Id venture to say that the 500+ non residents who had permits, everyone hunted. That leaves about 1400 residents.

You know what..... You are correct. I grabbed the wrong number (but I think so did you).

Double checking from the ADFG 2018 statistics, this is what I see:

Of the people that actually went hunting, there was a total of 1,857 RESIDENT hunters and 354 NON-RESIDENT hunters. A ratio of a little better than 5:1. A total of 2,200 or so including all general season and draw tags. That seems to have held relatively steady the past few years.

One can reasonably argue that a guided client has a larger impact on the mountain due to his support team and the much higher harvest rates.... but getting into Res vs NR is outside the scope here.

Surprisingly, the ADF&G website reports that 99 NR hunters did non hunt. Considering the cost of the tag, that's impressive.

 

[Dexter Grayson]

Great info Yellowknife, thanks for the post!

 

[Tanner]

Yep that’s true, you don’t know me... be skeptical all you want, it makes no difference to me.

I’ve read too many horror stories about hunts in AKs non-exclusive areas to ever consider hunting one.

Tanner, you may be the “bees knees” and guide to 39+ inchers every time. Color me skeptical but I don’t know you so I couldn’t say.

Anywho, if someone offers me a meal and says “Half of the steaks on this table have poison in them but none on this table do” - I know which table I’m choosing. That’s the way I look at non-exclusive areas vs. exclusive AK areas, the Yukon, and NWT.

You can dis that by implying it’s a “wimp” thing to do, I don’t care. But it does give me a window into your attitude/who you are.

As for booking a hunt specifically as a combo, IMO the Cons outweighs the Pros in most cases unless you have at least 14 days to hunt.

 

[alexanderg23]

This is good stuff. Thanks for the insight!