Widow Makers at Camp

[4rcgoat]

Great subject to bring to peoples attention, i dont pay nearly as much attention as I should, especially setting up at night.

 

[rayporter]

big snow back in the 80's had trees falling all night long. big, live trees that shook the ground for a hundred yards. no sleep that night. i always survey the timber around my camp, now.

 

[Mike Islander]

Snag, widow maker is, as noted, a broken limb or top that is hung up in the tree. They like to fall when you start felling the tree. Given you are normally bent over looking down, your neck is exposed if it dosent kill you it’ll mess you up.
snags can be very dangerous as well particularly in windy areas.

What about a big dead (but otherwise fully intact) tree that leans toward camp? My brother in law says not to worry about them.

 

[Clearedhot1]

Maybe a come-along tethered to a healthy tree?


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[cnelk]

I should have added that I live 16 hours from this area. Summer scouting is probably out this year.

Depending on where it is located, Id offer to go in and clear out some trees for you.

For a reasonable fee of course

 

[MTSasquatch]

Snags and other hazard trees are my first size up for a camp location. Hazard trees aren’t always dead trees either. Root disease, fungus, and parasites could make a green tree that seems healthy just as dangerous as a snag.

For context on how dangerous falling a snag or hazard tree is- most fatalities on wildland fires have nothing to do with fire. They are from falling snags and hazard trees. It takes loads of experience to safely and reliably size up and correctly fall hazard trees.

I too prefer to hike farther to avoid sleeping near hazard trees

 

[dtrkyman]

I spent an hour in AZ. trying to avoid dead trees for a camping spot, I had to go a 1/4 mile from where I wanted to be to avoid em.

 

[Randle]

Where I am from any tree or something overhead that can kill you in your sleep is a widowmaker.
Battery powered chainsaw and extra battery gets my vote

 

[Gila]

I bring about 10 days worth of wood for the stove. I just throw bundles under the UTV on the trailer. I bring a limb saw that keeps me going for the fire ring. I live near where I hunt so I always have stove wood at home. But you could stop by a town before you go up and get some. I pull a chainsaw around on the ranch...ain't gonna take it huntin.

 

[Ironman8]

Did you camp in the area last year or hike in daily? I wasn’t quite sure from your previous post, and I’m sure you know what you’re doing, but camping where the elk are can push them out.

Accessing your spot each day sounds like it would be a drag, but maybe not as much of a drag of blowing the elk out or having a tree come down on you guys.

We camped in the area. I wouldn’t want to make that 1100’ hike everyday (twice) much less needing to do it in the dark. It’s honestly not an option for this area due to the terrain on that climb IMO.

We are on somewhat of a finger ridge/drainage next to a creek and out of the way of travel routes while being fairly concealed. Where camp is, it’s not conducive for elk to travel up or down the creek due to some cliff faces, so we’ve only seen signs up above and across the creek and into the drainages north and south of us.

We did have a bull walk by camp (75ish yards away) on our last day of the first year there, but didn’t seem to bother him much till he heard us talking. I think wind/thermals are in our favor for anything above us being next to the creek.

We just “mapped out” the trees similar to what another guy said and camped there. I’m just not sure there’s enough other options to add a 3rd person in that area without clearing a space.

Maybe a come-along tethered to a healthy tree?


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I thought about this to make sure we fell the tree in the right direction, but my come-along is probably in the 20# range and that’s not including bringing axes or other saws along with it. It may be more trouble than it’s worth.

 

[Ironman8]

Thanks for some of the safety tips on what to look out for by some of y’all. Good stuff to consider.

There may be a small clearing adjacent to our original camp site that had some smaller pine trees (6-8” diameter) leaning toward that clearing. It may be a better idea to move camp and deal with the smaller ones rather than the larger ones around the current camp spot.

Any thoughts on one of those pocket chain saws? I saw some of them had long paracord lines for cutting off high branches. If they are worth a damn, we may be able to use that to cut down a tree with some stand-off distance. I’m sure we’d still need to bring an axe to make some relief cuts, but it would minimize some of the chopping and being close to the tree.

 

[3forks]

Thanks for some of the safety tips on what to look out for by some of y’all. Good stuff to consider.

There may be a small clearing adjacent to our original camp site that had some smaller pine trees (6-8” diameter) leaning toward that clearing. It may be a better idea to move camp and deal with the smaller ones rather than the larger ones around the current camp spot.

Any thoughts on one of those pocket chain saws? I saw some of them had long paracord lines for cutting off high branches. If they are worth a damn, we may be able to use that to cut down a tree with some stand-off distance. I’m sure we’d still need to bring an axe to make some relief cuts, but it would minimize some of the chopping and being close to the tree.

From what you described, it does sound like you’ve got a pretty good spot.

If it were me, I’d put the effort in to making the camp large enough to safely accomodate you guys. I’d bring in a battery powered saw (and plenty of batteries/bar oil/sharpener) to get the job done, and would figure the effort/cost is worth it because a spot like that is hard to find. You’d probably have to put in more effort and spend more money in finding another like it if you don’t use it.

And, if it were me - I’d make the new guy carry the shit you need to clear the camp seeing as you guys are generously bringing him along. Whether he wants to bring some beers in to quench his thirst after all that work would be up to him though.

 

[schwaf]

This is the best handsaw I've ever used. Fixed, curved blade silky saws will cut through large diameter trees in minutes. It's what professional arborists prefer, and short of a chainsaw, the best you'll find.

https://www.amazon.com/270-33-PROFESSIONAL-Curved-Scabbard-thickness/dp/B0014C4QMG

 

[schwaf]

I also recommend a 3oz can of wd40 to lubricate the blade. I'm assuming these are pine trees. Gunking up the blade with sap will make your life miserable. A little extra weight for both these items, but you'll soon forget the weight when you put them to work.

 

[Ironman8]

From what you described, it does sound like you’ve got a pretty good spot.

If it were me, I’d put the effort in to making the camp large enough to safely accomodate you guys. I’d bring in a battery powered saw (and plenty of batteries/bar oil/sharpener) to get the job done, and would figure the effort/cost is worth it because a spot like that is hard to find. You’d probably have to put in more effort and spend more money in finding another like it if you don’t use it.

And, if it were me - I’d make the new guy carry the shit you need to clear the camp seeing as you guys are generously bringing him along. Whether he wants to bring some beers in to quench his thirst after all that work would be up to him though.

No doubt! Haha.

And I agree that the effort is worth it for this area. Just want to make sure we’re being safe and efficient.

 

[Ironman8]

I also recommend a 3oz can of wd40 to lubricate the blade. I'm assuming these are pine trees. Gunking up the blade with sap will make your life miserable. A little extra weight for both these items, but you'll soon forget the weight when you put them to work.

Good tip thanks! That definitely would have been overlooked.

 

[Ironman8]

This is the best handsaw I've ever used. Fixed, curved blade silky saws will cut through large diameter trees in minutes. It's what professional arborists prefer, and short of a chainsaw, the best you'll find.

https://www.amazon.com/270-33-PROFESSIONAL-Curved-Scabbard-thickness/dp/B0014C4QMG

Thanks, I was looking at this one as well since it had a longer blade.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B084..._0?ie=UTF8&psc=1&pd_rd_i=B084GSY5KYp13NParams

 

[schwaf]

Thanks, I was looking at this one as well since it had a longer blade.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B084..._0?ie=UTF8&psc=1&pd_rd_i=B084GSY5KYp13NParams

Trust me, nothing compares to a silky saw. I have the 270mm, but the 330 will handle just about anything you throw at it.

 

[Customweld]

As a former sawyer, I can say there are many hazards to think about and addressing "hazard" trees. Different species of trees have different characteristics when it comes to falling on their own. Dead, standing lodgepole are pretty stable trees in terms of not breaking mid tree. Most tend to fall by the stump and root system rotting out. Live lodgepoles are limber and many will break under a snow load with any type of wind.
The problem with a hand saw or even an axe, is the back cut. Once you have your face (undercut) cut out, you want a fast saw on the back cut. When you are down to that last little bit of holding wood, that's the danger zone.

 

[Ironman8]

Trust me, nothing compares to a silky saw. I have the 270mm, but the 330 will handle just about anything you throw at it.

Ok Silky it is. Do you happen to know much about this other model Silky? It’s a little longer blade and reviews are really good. Or are you recommending the fixed handle for durability reasons?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B001...crb_top?ie=UTF8#cm_cr_carousel_images_section