Wolves.... 2.4 miles from my house in E. WA.

[Ryan Avery]

Wolfs are fine if you can control them like in ALASKA and they don't get a big head start. But it's not so AWESOME when they go unchecked here in Idaho for 10 plus years, Killing off in some places 85 percent of a once thriving Elk heard. Washington State where Mike lives is just one big tree hugging state that will let those cute little wolf's knock there deer and elk herds down to historic lows then somehow blame bad winters and hunters. So yes it matters.

 

[magpie]

Some very interesting opinions.

I lived in Wyoming for 23 years and listening to the anti wolf rhetoric became amusing. "ALL THE ELK ARE GONE" Well I sure hope everyone still believes that. Yup the wolves have killed all the elk, so many in fact that in the Jackson hole area just south of Yellowstone they are still THOUSANDS of elk OVER objective. So maybe you guys crying about all the loss of game should go hunt around South of Yellowstone where there is plenty of wolves AND elk.

I'll let you guys keep blaming wolves thats fine. But its public land and the vast majority of people want wolves and grizzly bears. I'm a hunter and you can count me in that group that sees the benefit of having wolves and grizzly bears around. And I find the hunters I really enjoy spending time with outdoors, are much of the same blood!

Like stated earlier I'm more concerned with the loss of habitat, dieases spread from domestic livestock to wild game, oil field development on winter ranges, the ranchers that over graze public land in the areas that wildlife winter, and so much more. To me those are the real wolves out there.

Carry on....

 

[tater]

Mike,
You sure that some of our Canadian wolves haven't migrated down the Columbia Valley system on their own, rather than expansion of the 'bio-imports'?
My understanding is Eastern WA is getting moose, and where the moose go, the wolves follow.

I live 2 1/2 hours straight N of Spokane on the BC side, and we have had an increase in moose populations and subsequently wolves have arrived as well all along the Kootenay/Columbia/Purcells in the last ten years. I can't see wolves looking at the border markers and reasoning "Well Vern, no passport better stay here...".

 

[magpie]

And seriously for the record, if any of you guys need help planning an elk hunt hit me up. I have some really good areas where you will see a lot of elk. But be careful, the big bad wolf and grizzly bear roam the same land.

 

[magpie]

Mike,
You sure that some of our Canadian wolves haven't migrated down the Columbia Valley system on their own, rather than expansion of the 'bio-imports'?
My understanding is Eastern WA is getting moose, and where the moose go, the wolves follow.

I live 2 1/2 hours straight N of Spokane on the BC side, and we have had an increase in moose populations and subsequently wolves have arrived as well all along the Kootenay/Columbia/Purcells in the last ten years. I can't see wolves looking at the border markers and reasoning "Well Vern, no passport better stay here...".

Those are not native moose! WE must kill them all!!!!!

 

[Ryan Avery]

So you don't believe that wolf's have any effect on the elk herds......They cut the migration hunt in Montana(North Yellowstone) out because there weren't enough elk. So maybe they only kill the Montana/Idaho Elk.

 

[Slim Jim]

Keep arguing boys I'm bored need some excitement

 

[Ryan Avery]

Tater, how long is your wolf season?

 

[Ryan Avery]

I bet you can trap them up their too. It's all about keeping them in check, just like we are!

 

[magpie]

So you don't believe that wolf's have any effect on the elk herds......They cut the migration hunt in Montana(North Yellowstone) out because there weren't enough elk. So maybe they only kill the Montana/Idaho Elk.

Where did I ever say that wolves have no effect on the elk herds?

Could you show me where the 85% reduction in elk in the area in ID is based soley on wolves? Maybe there were TOO many elk before?

I'm sure wolves had an effect on the migration hunt in Montana. But theres still plenty of elk hunting to do there. So theres one less late season hunt where fat guys shoot big elk from trucks? Waaaaahhhhh. Cry me a river.

I believe a true hunter and conservationist would respect all wildlife and not just the ones they deem "worthy". Of course thats just an opinion...

 

[tater]

We actually were given a Southern season for the first time this year (previously only Northern regions and specific Kootenay zones where there was Mountain Caribou predation had them).

Off the top of my head our wolf season is 9 months long (june/july/august closed), with a 3 wolf limit, no separate tags required (part of general licence), but they must be compulsory inspected. I know that since they opened it up in my region that there has been a consistent harvest of wolves, based on conversations with our local CO.

There are Northern regions where it is the same 9 month season, but no bag limit per hunter.

This is a tough one for me, as i've lived and hunted around wolves my whole life. I've had wolves within ten yards of me. Still have all my fingers and toes.
I appreciate their place in a managed ecosystem, but i also get a little tired of the hysteria that follows them.

 

[magpie]

This is a tough one for me, as i've lived and hunted around wolves my whole life. I've had wolves within ten yards of me. Still have all my fingers and toes.
I appreciate their place in a managed ecosystem, but i also get a little tired of the hysteria that follows them.

Couldn't agree more tater. Thank you.

 

[Ryan Avery]

"A managed ecosystem". That is the root of the problem. They had no plan outside of getting them reintroduced. I think if there would of been a better management plan and the feds would of stayed the hell out of state business. There wouldn't of been near the hysteria. Washington State is a different story.

 

[magpie]

Hello? The managment plans were up to the states. What held it up were lawsuits and Wyoming's BS management plan.....

 

[magpie]

We better keep those "feds" out of state business. But while were at it we want to hunt federal land and get federal $$$$ for the state. Those damn feds!

'MERICA!

 

[Rent Outdoor Gear]

Take note also that the elk, deer and moose have not seen this type of predator in 100 years... Add to that, the native Rocky Mountain wolf was nowhere near the size of the Canadian imports. The rocky mountain wolf that was still around in isolated parts of the Rockies is now gone forever - that's some outstanding conservation work there.

Your "vast majority" of people that want wolves and grizzlies DONT !&%#ING LIVE HERE - they're tree-hugging, city dwellers in CA and on the East Coast. I don't mind grizzlies and wolves - in their place... I've hunted both - but we have a much larger resource to manage in our big game animals. A LOT of people out here depend on the deer/elk to make a living as guides along with countless businesses in small communities that cater to seasonal hunters.

I think snow leopards are cool too. Alaska used to have sabertooth tigers... it wasn't that long ago. I think we should introduce snow leopards to the Brooks Range, Chugach, and anywhere else dall sheep live in Alaska. I think that might raise a few eyebrows in AK?? That's basically how we feel about wolves here. Idaho, MT, WY didn't get a vote on whether we wanted the wolf back - it was a nice present from the feds.

Magpie - I don't know how long you've had your head in the sand or maybe you get your news from MSNBC and PETA, but the facts are in and there have been drastic elk population declines right in line with what has been quoted above. Do a little homework before you start calling people out on their facts. Look up Lolo elk herd wolf predation and Yellowstone elk predation and you can find the data documenting near 90% population reductions due to wolves.
[h=1]Big Game Population Statistics[/h][h=2]Lolo Elk Herd, Idaho[/h]Before Wolf Introduction: 20,000
After Wolf Introduction: 1,700
[h=2]Yellowstone Elk Herd[/h]Before Wolf Introduction: 20,000
After Wolf Introduction: 6,500
[h=2]Jackson, WY Shiras Moose[/h]Before Wolf Introduction: 1,200
After Wolf Introduction: 120
[h=2]Gallitan Valley Elk Herd[/h]Before Wolf Introduction: 1,500
After Wolf Introduction: 200

I suspect you're part of a small minority in AK that are wolf fans as well.

I did my part this year...

 

[tater]

I still get really confused sometimes by how things are divided in the U.S. around wildlife/land use/land management when it comes to your state/fed/local thing.

From an outsider's perspective it seems that it is the wildlife (predator and prey species both) that appear to be ignored in favour of broader political posturing and power. Not that our system up here is perfect by any stretch, but unless it is migratory game birds, each province is left to do what needs to be done to effectively take care of it's resources.
Now having said that,waterways especially when they interface fresh/saltwater is a gong show.

I can see where from a state perspective having game management decisions made by a political body far removed both geographically as well as in terms of consistent planning would be kind of like having an unwelcome relative living in your house.

We sometimes have that here provincially when there is 'harmonization' of seasons (same duration/bag limits) across huge areas with vastly different game densities.

 

[Ryan Avery]

It's hard to manage anything when your hands are tied by your big brother!

 

[tater]

What i can see from this series of posts is that there is some serious frustration over the justified feeling of being controlled by the Federal government, but i think when the 'kill them all' begins it creates a polarized dynamic.

Yes, the native apex predators were removed, and 100 years later another introduced, but i honestly believe that they just gave you these wolves 30 years before they would have arrived.
If you look at the history of North American game movements (whether caused by man's interference or not), we have seen grizzly and elk become mountain animals (rather than the plains animal they were), moose move into agricultural lands, whitetail become the ungulate rats of the continent etc.
The problem we as hunters face is justifying eradication versus control to the general populace. We've only had elk in my area for the last 30 years. They are considered "invasive" by the local old time ranchers!

The anti's are a fringe and not an issue. When non-hunters feel that opportunities to view wildlife is infringed on so that hunters have more access to game, or that predators are extirpated for the same reason, we create a place of having public sentiment move from acceptance of hunting to anti-hunting.

I spend a lot of time around outdoors people who are not hunters, but they are also not anti hunters. They are backcountry skiers, hikers, fishermen etc. They talk about the wilderness experience, and how exposure to predators in the wild is part of the joy. If they were to hear that apex predators need to be completely removed simply so hunters had more access to game, i know how quickly it would mobilize them to become anti-hunters.

I'm pretty sure that this is the balance that will have to be found for Washington State. Hopefully the game managers there will look to BC for some support in a management plan.

 

[ohhiitznik]

I watched as they reintroduced wolves into the U.P of Michigan. They have devastated the deer herds in the upper peninsula, not to mention all of the hunters that used to head up north for the big swamp bruisers that lived there. Now you can sit 3-4 days and not see a deer. Pretty shameful. There never was much deer up there in the first place and they reintroduced them and its had ill effects. Most people living there would love to see the wolves gone so that more downstate hunters head north and spend their money like the good ol' days. Oh well, thats what you get for letting people vote on something that they know nothing about and have no experience with.

I wish all you wolf hunters in the west the best. If I lived in the west, I would be damned sure to fill my wolf tags yearly. I would probably hunt them harder than I would hunt elk.