Yet Another "which 50-65mm scope" Thread

[CoffeeGoat]

The long quarantine has been making me research things ad-naseum and one of the items on my list to purchase this year is a spotting scope. Unfortunately, as you folks know there are enough options to make you cross-eyed, so I'd like any insight you folks can provide. Here's the use case: I have a nice set of Steiner 10x42 bino's that this scope will compliment and I base camp hunt wide open western CO for deer/pronghorn and backpack hunt the mountains for Elk. This spotting scope will need to do double duty for backpacking and truck spotting. My all in budget will be around $1k, it's a little flexible but I'll need to pick up a tripod/head as well so that'll need to be included in the overall price.

I built up a big spreadsheet of the options (I'm open to ones I missed), mostly limited to ED glass 50-65 mm scopes, it's all pretty straight forward except the "common" column, I used that to indicate how easy it was to find, it's entirely subjective. Price is for a new/used depending on availability based on what I could find pretty easily (not screaming deals). Some of these are really well reviewed in the birding world ( for example the nikon ED60) but have been discontinued in the US or replaced, others are new as of this year (Athlon Cronus UHD I believe). Because of my budget I can't get into alpha glass, but I'm hoping to get close. I know a "do everything scope" will be a compromise.

Name	Eyepiece	Objective	Weight	Zoom	Common	Total Price
Pentax PF-65ED AII	Pentax 70530	65	46.17	20x60	3	700
Nikon ED50	Nikon MC II	50	21.9	13x40	2	600
Nikon ED60	Nikon MC II	60	43	20x60	2	600
Opticron MM4 50	Opticron SDL v2	50	31.3	12x36	3	800
Opticron MM4 60	Opticron SDL v2	60	35.2	15x45	3	900
Vortex Razor 50 mm	NA	50	25	11x33	1	500
Vortex Razor HD 65 mm	NA	60	56.8	22x48	1	800
Athlon Cronus UHD	NA	50	26.5	12x36	1	700
Athlon Cronus Tactical UHD	NA	60	46.6	7x42	2	950
Athlon Ares UHD	NA	65	50	15x45	1	600
Athlon Ares HD	NA	65	43.4	15x45	1	550
Hawke Endurance ED 50	NA	50	24.7	12x36	3	360
Hawke Endurance ED 60	NA	60	31.6	15x45	3	500
Hawke Endurance ED 68	NA	68	52	20x60	3	575
Maven S2	NA	56	34.4	12x27	2	950
Leupold GR Compact	NA	50	21.5	15-30	1	400
Leupold SX-4 Pro Guide	NA	65	62	15-45	1	800
Kowa 663	TE-9Z	66	44.8	20-60	2	800
Kowa 601	TE-9Z	60	34	20-60	2	650

Thus far I've been ranking things by the following:

• Objective Size (need the bright image for dawn/dusk to find the critters)
• Weight (need to be able to get to the critters)
• Glass/Mag (need to be able to find the critters)
• Price (need to be able to pay for the thing)

Currently the front runners (in no particular order) are the Hawke ED60, Nikon ED 50/60, and Pentax. I'd love to get into a Kowa but the 601 doesn't have ED glass, I like the Maven but it's quite expensive, the Vortex and Leupold scopes don't seem to offer anything compelling (either too heavy or not as nice as the Nikon ED50) and I know very little about the Athlons.

What do you guys think, am I overthinking it here? It's pretty tough to find a place to try out all of these scopes to make a good decision.

Finally, I'm out of work so while I would appreciate screaming deal offers, I can't make a purchase until I get a new contract sorted out. You're welcome to PM me if there is something you're not in a hurry to sell off.

Cheers and Thanks in advance

 

[gr8fuldoug]

We have a special deal on the #56194 Endurance ED 15-45x60 Angled Spotting Scope - Call for special price
Ultra compact and lightweight construction
Extra-low Dispersion glass for optimum clarity
Dielectric Coatings designed to increase light reflectivity
Fully Multi-Coated optics to produce sharp images
Close focus – see detail from 8.2ft/2.5m
BAK-4 Porro prisms for intense colour and contrast
Dual focus knob to achieve ultra fine focusing
Stay-on soft scope cover for maximum protection
Twist-up eye cup and pull out sunshade
Digi-scope compatible for use with your camera
Nitrogen purged – water and fog proof
Hawke lifetime warranty

 

[eric1115]

I have a couple of thoughts, you might add the Kowa 661 (if you want angled, 662 if straight). It's the scope that came before the 663/664. $5-600ish for a good clean one.

Another thing to consider would be a fixed eyepiece. Something like a 30x often times will give just as much field of view as a variable power at 20x, and be brighter/sharper than a lot of variables on the mid-range scopes you are looking at. Swaro, Kowa top end, etc I have enough clarity that the variable power is a clear winner for versatility but a lot of people don't realize how nice a fixed power is to look through. For spotting game I think it's a great way to go. if you need the magnification for field judging that might be a different story.

A decent tripod makes a huge difference also. It doesn't matter how clear the glass is if you can't get it steady. Don't put a $950 spotter on a $50 tripod unless it is truly a stop gap until you can get a good one next year. I know budget is tight, but you should also consider finding a way to put your binoculars on that tripod as well. I've used homebrew setups and the field optics research bino mount, getting a pair of 10-power binos steady makes an enormous difference in their usability.

 

[CoffeeGoat]

We have a special deal on the #56194 Endurance ED 15-45x60 Angled Spotting Scope - Call for special price

Doug - by the spec's it looks like a great option, that's why it's on my short list. Can you speak to the optics in comparison with the Nikon/Pentax/Kowa? I don't have a place local to check it out. I heard about that option from here on Rokslide, someone picked one up from you and was really impressed. I'll be giving you a call if that's the one I go with - if my PPP application goes through it'll be sooner than later.

A decent tripod makes a huge difference also. It doesn't matter how clear the glass is if you can't get it steady. Don't put a $950 spotter on a $50 tripod unless it is truly a stop gap until you can get a good one next year. I know budget is tight, but you should also consider finding a way to put your binoculars on that tripod as well. I've used homebrew setups and the field optics research bino mount, getting a pair of 10-power binos steady makes an enormous difference in their usability.

Absolutely, that's why the Maven is pretty much off the list, I'm budgeting ~250 or so for a good tripod, but given the buy once - cry once approach if the right scope is closer to $1k then I'll need to find a few more pennies. What I don't want to do is convince myself that I actually need a scope that's 1.5k and then add another 300 on top of that...

 

[gr8fuldoug]

IMO, the Hawke Endurance ED is on par with the Athlon Ares ED. We did extensive comparisons when we started running low on the Athlon Ares ED so we would have something great to offer in a packable quality scope and we are thrilled to have this Hawke on such a sharp deal. Weighing in at only 2 pounds, sharp and bright it's a great option

 

[eric1115]

Not to hijack, but it's on topic here - Doug, how do the hawke and athlon compare to the Kowa tsn-601/602? I know the Kowa is a good step up in price, just wondering if the extra money buys much more performance? Everyone says the Area 65 punches way above it's weight class, but we don't hear much about the entry level Kowa scopes.

 

[gr8fuldoug]

The 3 of them are extremely close to the point that I would go for the Hawke before the 60mm Kowa and save the more than 50%

 

[alexanderg23]

PM sent

 

[CoffeeGoat]

The 3 of them are extremely close to the point that I would go for the Hawke before the 60mm Kowa and save the more than 50%

That Hawke is crazy light so if the glass is really that good it's a fantastic deal. I was also curious about the 601, but it doesn't have ED glass so I wasn't necessarily expecting it to be on the same level.

 

[idahohikker]

Athlon Ares 65 for sure if you want to stay under $500. Read my review and all the others on this site. If you’re cool with about double that, go for the Kowa.

 

[CoffeeGoat]

Athlon Ares 65 for sure if you want to stay under $500. Read my review and all the others on this site. If you’re cool with about double that, go for the Kowa.

Yep - I did read it which is why it was on the list. You had the HD not the UHD correct? I'd be curious to see someone compare them side by side, the UHD is almost half a pound heavier, I wonder if it's worth it.

 

[idahohikker]

Yep - I did read it which is why it was on the list. You had the HD not the UHD correct? I'd be curious to see someone compare them side by side, the UHD is almost half a pound heavier, I wonder if it's worth it.

Same glass. There’s a thread on the comparison.

 

[CoffeeGoat]

Found the comparison: https://www.rokslide.com/forums/threads/new-athlon-ares-models.151774/#post-1434531

 

[HuntNTag]

I’d echo the Athlon Ares 65mm. Impressed with it for the price. It’s solid and great for the truck or backcountry.

Nice size, weight and nice/bright.

Plus the warranty is great.

 

[MWK3800]

Another feature to consider is a rotating collar. Spotting from a truck window mount with an angled spotter and no rotating collar is awkward. Unfortunately, most of the angled 50-60s lack this except the Opticrons. 65s seem to include this feature.

Great thread topic! I'm not the only one obsessing over spreadsheets.

 

[CoffeeGoat]

Another feature to consider is a rotating collar. Spotting from a truck window mount with an angled spotter and no rotating collar is awkward. Unfortunately, most of the angled 50-60s lack this except the Opticrons. 65s seem to include this feature.

Great thread topic! I'm not the only one obsessing over spreadsheets.

I've seen people mention the rotating collar before as a must have, has that been your experience? It seems hit or miss, the hawke doesn't have it, the nikon does, the athlon scopes mostly have it

 

[SanJuanCutthroat]

Where are you finding a Kowa 663 for $800?

 

[CoffeeGoat]

Where are you finding a Kowa 663 for $800?

It's not super common, but I've seen them come up used on ebay and adorama for around that price.

 

[MWK3800]

I've seen people mention the rotating collar before as a must have, has that been your experience? It seems hit or miss, the hawke doesn't have it, the nikon does, the athlon scopes mostly have it

I have an 88mm angled scope which is obviously a bit bigger to deal with in a vehicle. It's not comfortable to use from my truck window but it can be done due to excellent eye relief of the scope or when if looking up a hill. With some rotation of the collar, I really like the angled scope for comfortably covering a wide area from the driver's seat.

From my Camry driver's seat where I use it most often to watch birds this time of year, it's just not usable without rotating the scope as there isn't enough head room in the car to get high enough to get my eye up and angled to the eyepiece.

I check the lakes and marshes almost daily from my vehicles and usually I'm too lazy to get the tripod out in the wind, rain, or cold. I also don't hunt out west...yet. For the way I use my scopes today in the Midwest, my next 50-65mm scope will either be a straight configuration or angled with a rotating collar to faciliate vehicle use. Sorry if I've sent you down another research rabbit hole!

 

[CoffeeGoat]

I check the lakes and marshes almost daily from my vehicles and usually I'm too lazy to get the tripod out in the wind, rain, or cold. I also don't hunt out west...yet. For the way I use my scopes today in the Midwest, my next 50-65mm scope will either be a straight configuration or angled with a rotating collar to faciliate vehicle use. Sorry if I've sent you down another research rabbit hole!

Actually this is really helpful, it may not change my scope choice, that Hawke is nearly pound less than the Ares that has a rotating collar. However, my dad is also looking for a large objective scope primarily to be used via the car window mount and he's been primarily been looking at straights, you make a good point that the ergonomics of a rotating collar my actually be better from a drivers seat. Hmm, things to think about...