Negatives to being over spined?

ChadS · Jun 27, 2014

Considering going to a .200 spine gold tip kinetic so I can shoot a heavy front and and not worry about flirting with being under spined with a .300 at an 80lb draw weight. Are there any major downsides to being on the over spined side of things?

The GPI is higher on a .200 too so that helps keep me heavier with my 28.5 in draw length. I want to land pretty close to a 500 grain total weight arrow

Tilzbow · Jun 27, 2014

I shoot that shaft at 70# and 30" with a 150 grain non-vented VPA and get excellent flight. I only see advantages to stiff arrows with drop away rests. Less flex and faster recovery out of the bow so the paradox ends much sooner and the arrow doesn't flex as much on impact so I've got to believe that helps with penetration although I have no evidence to support it since most of us get pass throughs with compounds and after that it doesn't matter. That said my arrows out penetrate all others I've seen in 3d targets by several inches.

I also shoot a .250 spine Black Eagle shaft with a 125 gr head and it's currently my setup of choice.

justinspicher · Jun 27, 2014

I am shooting a recurve with 75lb limbs, but at my draw length it's closer to 70lbs. I am shooting. 340's with 125gr up front, but I think I'll either need to go up on the tip weight or go to a .300 spine. My arrows squirm pretty good when I am shooting at 20yds.

PA 5-0 · Jun 27, 2014

I have always shot over spined arrows. Kinetic energy = better penetration. Thin, light arrows are for targets. 500 grains is a good target for arrow weight.

5MilesBack · Jun 28, 2014

ChadS said:
Considering going to a .200 spine gold tip kinetic so I can shoot a heavy front

I want to land pretty close to a 500 grain total weight arrow

You're going to have trouble keeping them around 500gr if you want to shoot a heavy front. My 200's are 533gr with only 125's at 30".

ChadS · Jun 28, 2014

The shortest shaft weight I can go with is 26.5 carbon to carbon that's 307.4
I will add a 50 grain Stainless steel Aeroinsert AA from Firenok 50.0
Broadhead 125.0
Vanes 18.0
Nock 11.6

TOTAL ARROW WEIGHT 512 Grains

I could also drop down to a 100 grain head and add a 4" wrap and lengthen the arrow to add weight if desired. Again I could probably get away with a .300 with that short of a shaft, but what the heck, why not

Some of you may recall that I was complaining about the 50 grain brass HIT inserts blowing up the fronts of my .300 Kinetics last year. Well upon further review, I remember when I set the inserts a guy at the archery shop handed me a fast set instant glue. I believe that was the FATAL MISTAKE. The stuff was too brittle for that much impact force. I spoke with Dorge (Sp?) from Firenok on the phone yesterday about setting his inserts in my arrows, and he told me to go to any local HD/Lowes/Hardware store and pick up a two part bonding epoxy that requires a minimum of 24 hours set time. He told me most of the archery insert glues out there have either been sitting on the shelf for too long or dry too fast, including the HIT two part (too brittle). The guy was really helpful and was willing to help me with all of my questions, seems like a stand up dude. He claimed that if I set them right and took the time and care to do it right, he said they will be almost indestructable. Now I'm just relaying what I've been told and some issues with what I have experienced. I plan to set the firenok SS inserts in the Kinetic .200's when they arrive here and then I will start putting them to the test.

Rick Leathley · Jun 28, 2014

I shoot Victory VAP's .250 spine. With 92g outserts and 100g tips with 18% FOC arrow weight is 493g

Coyote Commander · Jun 28, 2014

Chad,

Try the AAE max impact glue. The black stuff. I've had zero issues with it. Supposedly it's a more elastic bond and handles impact better.

Coyote Commander · Jun 28, 2014

As for spine, in in the same boat right now.

My ideal spine for my setup is looking like it's gonna be around .285. On target says I can make a .300 spine work with some changes, but I'll still be slightly underspined. Looks like I'll be moving up to the .2s and be slightly overspined (not a bad thing at all.....other than having to buy and build new arrows).

ChadS · Jun 28, 2014

Yeah Shane helped me bare shaft and tune my bow and we did it with a 27" 330 Injextion w/100 grain head, cause I have a dozen of those and was real close to running that arrow. But thinking got the best of me again and I just want something a little beefier.

I'm curious to see how much it will take to get bare shaft kinetic flying good since we had it set with the injexion.

Bughalli · Jun 28, 2014

As far as I know there's no downside to being over spined. You might add a little weight, but one level up in spine won't have that much of a difference in point of impact. You'll hardly notice it once you adjust your pins. As others have said, some prefer it even if not needed. But under spined and you risk having arrow flight issues. I.e. erratic, wider than normal groups. Fine tuning a bow is challenging enough to add that factor in.

ontarget7 · Jun 29, 2014

ChadS said:
Yeah Shane helped me bare shaft and tune my bow and we did it with a 27" 330 Injextion w/100 grain head, cause I have a dozen of those and was real close to running that arrow. But thinking got the best of me again and I just want something a little beefier.

I'm curious to see how much it will take to get bare shaft kinetic flying good since we had it set with the injexion.

Stop thinking this close to season, it will get the best of you

5MilesBack · Jun 29, 2014

Coyote Commander said:
My ideal spine for my setup is looking like it's gonna be around .285. On target says I can make a .300 spine work with some changes, but I'll still be slightly underspined. Looks like I'll be moving up to the .2s and be slightly overspined (not a bad thing at all.....other than having to buy and build new arrows).

Easton is making their Axis in a .260 spine now, and Black Eagle make their Rampages in a .250 spine. Either should work well for you.

I probably should be using my 200's at 32 1/2" draw, but I can bare shaft tune to 30 yards with my 300's just as well so I keep using those.

ChadS · Jun 29, 2014

ontarget7 said:
Stop thinking this close to season, it will get the best of you

That's a fact!

OR Archer · Jun 30, 2014

At your specs you will be just fine. You're really not going to run into to many issues running a heavy spine out of most higher weight bows. Where I see problems arise is with low draw weight and short draw length bows.

J-Daddy · Jul 2, 2014

IMHO over spined doesn't mean a whole lot on a compound bow with a fall away rest and using a mechanical release....All the people freaking out over being over spined really stems from guys who shoot stick bows off the shelf with fingers because you need a certain amount of flex for a stick bow to shoot right.
I've tuned many 60lbs bows to shoot a .300 spine, which on charts is WAY stiff for that draw weight. Weak spine is ALWAYS a bad thing, stiff spine is a bit overblown IMHO.

Brandon Pattison · Jul 2, 2014

Since you are all in this thread I might as well ask. I have a 29.5" 72# spyder turbo. I want to run 150 grain heads. I have 27.5" ctc Axis 300s. These seem to be on the edge of being too weak. I currently run 100 grain heads out of this setup. Will I need a stiffer arrow for 150 up front? I have new dozen set of GT 200s but might sell to get Axis 260s or more 300s, if they will work. I will only run HIT inserts if that matters.

ChadS · Feb 28, 2015

After this past season I am ready to weigh back in on the aeroinsert-aa stainless steel 50 grain insert/outserts. In short, dont waste your money. I bent and broke them with ease. They perform well on all the deer I shot with them, but I never hit anything hard in the animal. However I did wreck them in dirt and targets. I believe part of the issue is the speed and weight im shooting is asking too much of the arrow components and glue. The other is that the SS is really weak at the neck of the insert/outsert. If they are going to break and bend, you may as well spend half the money and run brass HITs.

trkyslr · Mar 1, 2015

Chads, Ray with vpa and gt have came out with new and improved insert/outserts that shouldnt bend like that.

ChadS · Mar 1, 2015

I am only finding 6 series stuff, you have a link?

Negatives to being over spined?

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