Knight Muzzleloaders

[idahohikker]

I’ve been researching muzzleloaders and have been impressed that Knight makes an MOA guarantee for their muzzleloaders. A few questions:

-Is the Knight MOA realistic under Idaho rules—no scope, no sabots, western ignition selected for muzzie?
-Would I need to put a peep sight on for better accuracy?
-Can you do that with a Knight muzzleloader?

Ultimately, I want to have a reliable muzzleloader that I can shoot 150 yards. 200 is great if that’s doable with an Idaho rules muzzie. Knight seems to be worth the additional cost over the CVA and other similar muzzleloaders but if you disagree I’d be interested in hearing why.

Thanks so much.

 

[Michiganmuzzy]

You can not go wrong with a Knight. I have Knights and CVAs. If you go with a good peep like a Williams FP or a Lyman 57 and practice a lot, 150 is do-able. Probably 200 as well. Unless your eyesight is getting bad. I know shooters who use peeps at much longer ranges but they are almost fanatics and shoot so much... practice, practice, practice. Don't use cheap bullets, conicals shoot better when you size them right and start stretching the range.

 

[Salmon River Solutions]

following

 

[Michiganmuzzy]

CVA also has an accuracy guarantee. Break action CVAs are so much easier to clean. Knights, imo, are a bit more accurate. The CVA is easier to stop primer blowby leaks. Both offer a western legal ignition system. CVA has lifetime warranty. Knight may too.
CVA Accura has Bergara barrels and nitriding. Knight has Green Mntn barrels and nitriding.Both good choices

 

[menhaden_man]

I have a CVA Northwest Compliant (WA/OR/ID): exposed musket cap percussion breech and no scope. And, in Idaho, my understanding is no sabots and loose powder. If anyone can show a 100 yard target with a MOA group with that setup, dinner is on me the next time we're in the same town (and I travel throughout the west).

On the plus side, it's just over 6 lbs and stainless. And the guy above is right that the threaded breech plug and break action is the cat's meow when it comes to cleaning. But, it is a $200 gun, so unless you're whacking late-season mulie does at 50 yards like me, I'd encourage looking at what the extra money gets you. I've only shot three animals with my smoke pole, so take that for what it's worth.

An embarrassing but important confession that I'll share involves five misfires in pouring rain on a cow elk hunt. All five were chip shots at 30-75 yards over a three-hour chitshow. My hunting partner and I have quite a few animals over about 80 years of combined hunting, but this was a bona fide amateur hour that we get teased about to this day (and the rest of you can save the comments - we know what we did wrong!). Only reason I'm sharing this is that you'll definitely want to consider weather, cleaning, and moisture when shopping. I don't have good advice on that other than it's made me a fool several times over after many successful hunts.

So far as peep sights, I just picked up a sweet one from EA Brown that'll go on my CVA. It's a sweet rig, and I plan on getting it dialed in this Jan/Feb and will report back. Good luck shopping - let us know where you landed and why.

TC Encore Pro Hunter Muzzleloading

Thompson Center Encore Pro Hunter Muzzleloading Products and Accessories

www.eabco.com

CVA Wolf™ V2 Northwest Legal Rifle - .50 Caliber - PR2117SNW

Northwest Legal CVA® Wolf™ V2 Rifle - 209 Magnum PR2117SNW - .50 Caliber Break-Action Muzzleloader #11 Percussion, Black w Stainless. Best Prices, Fast Shipping, Expert Advice!

www.muzzle-loaders.com

 

[idahohikker]

Thanks @menhaden_man for the insight. Yeah the muzzie will only be for controlled hunts so if I have an experience like that I’d be pissed.

I still have nightmares from missing a bull on a lay-up type shot because my budget scope got bumped. I had a dead rest at close range and was way off. A couple years later I slam my scope in a fall and check the zero on my new quality set-up. Perfectly on which was sweet but no bulls around that year. Haha

 

[Michiganmuzzy]

I have a CVA Northwest Compliant (WA/OR/ID): exposed musket cap percussion breech and no scope. And, in Idaho, my understanding is no sabots and loose powder. If anyone can show a 100 yard target with a MOA group with that setup, dinner is on me the next time we're in the same town (and I travel throughout the west).

On the plus side, it's just over 6 lbs and stainless. And the guy above is right that the threaded breech plug and break action is the cat's meow when it comes to cleaning. But, it is a $200 gun, so unless you're whacking late-season mulie does at 50 yards like me, I'd encourage looking at what the extra money gets you. I've only shot three animals with my smoke pole, so take that for what it's worth.

An embarrassing but important confession that I'll share involves five misfires in pouring rain on a cow elk hunt. All five were chip shots at 30-75 yards over a three-hour chitshow. My hunting partner and I have quite a few animals over about 80 years of combined hunting, but this was a bona fide amateur hour that we get teased about to this day (and the rest of you can save the comments - we know what we did wrong!). Only reason I'm sharing this is that you'll definitely want to consider weather, cleaning, and moisture when shopping. I don't have good advice on that other than it's made me a fool several times over after many successful hunts.

So far as peep sights, I just picked up a sweet one from EA Brown that'll go on my CVA. It's a sweet rig, and I plan on getting it dialed in this Jan/Feb and will report back. Good luck shopping - let us know where you landed and why.

TC Encore Pro Hunter Muzzleloading

Thompson Center Encore Pro Hunter Muzzleloading Products and Accessories

www.eabco.com

CVA Wolf™ V2 Northwest Legal Rifle - .50 Caliber - PR2117SNW

Northwest Legal CVA® Wolf™ V2 Rifle - 209 Magnum PR2117SNW - .50 Caliber Break-Action Muzzleloader #11 Percussion, Black w Stainless. Best Prices, Fast Shipping, Expert Advice!

www.muzzle-loaders.com

I think the keys to using a peep sight are decent eyes and a good front sight. I like a tiny fiber optic. Those guys that shoot long range with them use these globe sights with different inserts. Some even have windage adjustments and levels on the front sight as well as the rear sight. Search Lyman 17a front sight and Lee Shaver front globe and inserts. I put a Williams FP (Fool Proof) on a ML and can barely make out the front sight til i changed it to a fiber optic. But I will never shoot past 100 here in Michigan. If so I can use optics. But shooting with those peeps is another level that you can add to your ML.
Also, a balloon or rubber glove finger put over the muzzle can keep some of the "fail to fires" from happening. Will they let you put anything over the breech, out west, to keep it dry?

 

[Michiganmuzzy]

I have a CVA Northwest Compliant (WA/OR/ID): exposed musket cap percussion breech and no scope. And, in Idaho, my understanding is no sabots and loose powder. If anyone can show a 100 yard target with a MOA group with that setup, dinner is on me the next time we're in the same town (and I travel throughout the west).

I would love it if you would buy me dinner. LOL. But there is a guy on here that lives in Idaho that shoots long range with peeps and such. Look for IdahoLewis posts. He has probably forgot more about MLs than i will ever learn, (and i think im older than him).

 

[missjordan]

-Is the Knight MOA realistic under Idaho rules—no scope, no sabots, western ignition selected for muzzie?
-Would I need to put a peep sight on for better accuracy?
-Can you do that with a Knight muzzleloader?

Ultimately, I want to have a reliable muzzleloader that I can shoot 150 yards. 200 is great if that’s doable with an Idaho rules muzzie. Knight seems to be worth the additional cost over the CVA and other similar muzzleloaders but if you disagree I’d be interested in hearing why.

Thanks so much.

1. Yes, i purchased the ultra lite for a Idaho hunt last year with the western style ignition. Was ready to go out of the box then i started putting some work into it
2. Yes, see Sabbotloader and IdahoLewis posts on here. Both guys are extremely helpful and know there stuff. I went with Sabbotloaders recommendations for a peep combo and love it! And IdahoLewis helped me with the “how do you shoot this thing” questions. I’m sure they will chime into your thread shortly
3. The knight is very versatile, i wanted to buy one muzzleloader and have it for life and spent the money on a good one.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[danarnold]

When cutting thru the skin, once you can get your knife underneath the skin and make your cuts outward to the hair side, you'll get a lot less hair on your meat.

When using the gutless method, what's the best way to get to the heart and the inside tenderloins? Break a rib to access those areas?

1. Yes, i purchased the ultra lite for a Idaho hunt last year with the western style ignition. Was ready to go out of the box then i started putting some work into it
2. Yes, see Sabbotloader and IdahoLewis posts on here. Both guys are extremely helpful and know there stuff. I went with Sabbotloaders recommendations for a peep combo and love it! And IdahoLewis helped me with the “how do you shoot this thing” questions. I’m sure they will chime into your thread shortly
3. The knight is very versatile, i wanted to buy one muzzleloader and have it for life and spent the money on a good one.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

X2

 

[menhaden_man]

1. Yes, i purchased the ultra lite for a Idaho hunt last year with the western style ignition. Was ready to go out of the box then i started putting some work into it
2. Yes, see Sabbotloader and IdahoLewis posts on here. Both guys are extremely helpful and know there stuff. I went with Sabbotloaders recommendations for a peep combo and love it! And IdahoLewis helped me with the “how do you shoot this thing” questions. I’m sure they will chime into your thread shortly
3. The knight is very versatile, i wanted to buy one muzzleloader and have it for life and spent the money on a good one.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Now these guys are in an entirely different class than I am, but I’m game on buying one myself. Also still game for buying dinner once someone shows honest paper of a 1 MOA without a scope (lead, loose powder). I’m in Kellogg for a few days as of now.

And @idahohikker , it was totally operator error on my part (despite my best efforts with electric tape). A story that I can’t put in writing. It’s a solid gun but I agree a controlled hunt is different. And as you know:

 

[menhaden_man]

1. Yes, i purchased the ultra lite for a Idaho hunt last year with the western style ignition. Was ready to go out of the box then i started putting some work into it
2. Yes, see Sabbotloader and IdahoLewis posts on here. Both guys are extremely helpful and know there stuff. I went with Sabbotloaders recommendations for a peep combo and love it! And IdahoLewis helped me with the “how do you shoot this thing” questions. I’m sure they will chime into your thread shortly
3. The knight is very versatile, i wanted to buy one muzzleloader and have it for life and spent the money on a good one.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Btw, what’s this setup cost?

 

[missjordan]

Now these guys are in an entirely different class than I am, but I’m game on buying one myself. Also still game for buying dinner once someone shows honest paper of a 1 MOA without a scope (lead, loose powder). I’m in Kellogg for a few days as of now.

I know for sure with a scope on with the primitive loads the muzzleloader would be within the MOA guarantee. Open sights is definitely a different story and you better have damn good eye sight because those targets are super small when 100-200 yards out. At my best i could group 2 inches at best but paper plate group at these distances makes up for the human error you won’t get around.

Btw, what’s this setup cost?

[/QUOTE]

The gun was $800 on sale at Sportmans warehouse and probably spent another $300 to $400 on different sight combinations and supplies. I started out with a New England NECG peep, hated it and when the Williams FP came in stock ordered that and cut part of the stock away on my Ultra Lite since they don’t fit that model. (Still was worth it) then I also ordered the 209 ignition system for shitsngiggles so I could hunt with it in my native state of Montana with a scope. Hoping to figure new loads out this winter




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[Tall_Timber.Productions]

Knight Bighorn has been extremely reliable and accurate for me!

 

[Idahoguy]

I have a knight bighorn that uses #11 caps for idaho legal gun. I have never been able to get it to shoot accurately at all. What is your secret?

 

[Wrench]

Is the dinner deal still on the table? My wolf will shoot the no excuses bullets quite well.

 

[menhaden_man]

Is the dinner deal still on the table? My wolf will shoot the no excuses bullets quite well.

Let’s see the paper! 100 yds sub MOA with Idaho complaint smoke pole!!!

 

[Wrench]

I'll do it. It's tough with the crap sights they come with, but if I gauge the reveal on the sight correctly and do my part, it'll be right in the hunt. I use 80gr 777ffg a felt wad and 495gr no excuses bullet (.503").

I did counter bore the breech plug a bit because the musket cap wasn't the most reliable. It's been solid since.

 

[menhaden_man]

I'll do it. It's tough with the crap sights they come with, but if I gauge the reveal on the sight correctly and do my part, it'll be right in the hunt. I use 80gr 777ffg a felt wad and 495gr no excuses bullet (.503").

I did counter bore the breech plug a bit because the musket cap wasn't the most reliable. It's been solid since.

Awesome - I'm taking notes because I'll be dialing in my cheap CVA NW Compliant smoke pole with the new EA Brown peep sites. I've used Barnes and Hornady sabots with decent success but those are no go in ID.

Any reason for the 495 gr bullet? I see they've got five offerings.

 

[BRTreedogs]

Finally got a Legend FP in my ultralite.
Haven't shot it yet but so pumped.