Packs: How Comfortable is Comfortable?

[RockChucker30]

Ebby, how did the brown bear hunt go?

 

[Ebby]

Nathan, it went great. I put a hunt report in the "Bear" forum and also on 24hr. PM me your email address. I've got quite a bit of pics to send you.

Lee

 

[RockChucker30]

Done, can't wait to read about it.

 

[Rick Leathley]

I never regretted buying a stone glacier. It's a comforting feeling have a well built pack. I have no worries about it letting me down when I get an animal on the ground.

 

[DaveC]

A number of makers have proven that point-soreness is unacceptable in a pack. If you can carry the weight, and have done a bit of training, general fatigue should be the only limiting factor.

FWIW, the Paradox works at least as well as my legs, so I'm happy.

 

[Aron Snyder]

Pack comfort is very subjective (one mans shit is another mans gold...sort of), but one of the higher end packs will definitely be your "gold"!

I know Kifaru (I work for them), will let you test a pack out for 30 days (other companies do the same) and you can send it back if not happy. You will need to pay shipping, but $16 in shipping isn't bad if you're looking for the perfect fit.

I've used just about everything, and for me I NEED a pack to meet a few different qualifications (frame height, belt and bag configuration, ability to haul heavy loads and others) before I'll even try it out. So you can probably narrow your search down pretty quickly by making a list of what you need in a pack. I can help you with this list if you want, as I've already burned a bunch of money trying all of them.

Some people will claim that "you MUST have this type of belt for it not to fail", but that's for THEIR body type. So again, it will really depend on your body type and style of hunting more than what some dude is telling you in a hunting forum.

Feel free to call me and I can walk you through as much as possible to narrow down the search. Aron 720-937-1418

Right now, if you saw the other thread I just posted, I'm working on getting a pack system together. My problem is that almost every time I spend money on new hunting gear all I do is learn why I should have gone with something else. That is my current dilemma with a new pack system; that's a good chunk of change that could go towards a new bow or rifle if I really don't need it.
My past experience mostly involved my Eberlestock X2A1. I loved this pack; it's bombproof and hauls anything you can thing of for its size. However, loads over ~50 lbs seem to go straight to my shoulders. I now have a Kuiu Ultra 6000, and as I expected from lots of research it works but isn't comfortable. At first it gave me lumbar PAIN, but I've got it adjusted and figured out to where it doesn't now. I actually ended up taking two of the included accessory straps and running them around the part of the waistbelt where the frame connects in up to the first attachment points for the bag on the frame to reduce the lumbar pressure that made this thing impossible to use. This is a problem I've heard of from several people. However, problem not solved. While hauling out my deer (meat in main bag) + camp and yesterday when I loaded it up to test it (50lb chicken feed in load sling, camping gear (tent etc) + spotter and tripod in bag) the pack is able to put the load on the waist belt and off my shoulders but it's far from comfortable. There is still noticeable discomfort right at the small of my back, though it's far from what it was when I first started using this pack. My question is, how comfortable can a load like this actually be? Will spending the 350-650 on an Exo/SG/Kifaru/MR setup be that different from what I'm experiencing now? Do those pack systems actually bear that weight in a manner that can be called comfortable?

 

[Salmo-Priest]

Paradox...Why haven't I seen those before? May order one very very soon RockChucker30 that's exactly what the problem is. The Ultra is better than my X2 but I know from how guys talk about their Kifaru/SG/Exo/MR etc packs it should be better. I definitely had to cinch it up a bunch of times and ended up with hot spots over both hip bones and at the small of my back. My legs were tired but I can deal with that; I wanted that freaking thing off my back by the end! Any others that have experience with the Paradox packs? I'm going to take a serious look at them.

Take a look in the pack classifieds. Not many selling their Stone Glaciers. Could be a hint...

 

[PathFinder]

Ebby thanks for the offer man, I may have to take you up on that! Aron, thanks for the offer, I'll give you a call tomorrow afternoon when I get off work. I'm bouncing back and forth right now but I think I definitely have a criteria set now for exactly what I want it to do.
Here's what I've come up with:
1. I shed hunt more than everything else combined. It needs to be capable of both overnighting and carrying ~6 elk horns, and going into an ultralight single day mode and carry a bunch of bone.
2. Overall weight well under 6lbs. Heavier packs can tend to me more comfortable, but I think there are plenty of lightweight offerings that can do the same.
3. Haul up to 100-120 lbs with comfort.
4. Enough volume for 4-5 day or perhaps longer trips.
5. Compress down for a practical daypack.
6. Sufficient organization for regular hunting gear.
7. Adjustability; I'm only 5'6" 145, so I don't exactly fall into the middle of the spectrum.
8. Load shelf. Somewhere, some way to put the meat closer to my back and out of the main bag.
Anything anyone would add to that list?

 

[realunlucky]

2 and 3 combined is what drives the price up

 

[Salmo-Priest]

8. Load shelf. Somewhere, some way to put the meat closer to my back and out of the main bag.
Anything anyone would add to that list?

http://stoneglacier.com/terminus.html

Be sure to click on
Expanded
Loaded
Compressed
Loadshelf
With Approach


It really is the perfect design...

 

[Ebby]

Stone Glacier and Paradox will both do everything on your list. Kifaru will meet everything but might come in a little over weight depending on how you configure it. Plenty of good options out there. SG and Pardox and Kifaru probably the cream of the crop. Each of those packs will handle the weight and hold shed antlers.

 

[Ironman8]

Take a look at the EXO.

IMO, it's the perfect blend between the Kifaru and Stone Glacier in terms of features. It has organization (where the SG is designed to be minimalist) and it uses the load shelf (where Kifaru is really meant to be hauled inside the pack...except for the Nomad - which I think is another great hybrid pack).

Either way you go with the top packs (Kifaru, SG, EXO, Paradox), you will be good to go on quality and ability to haul loads. The comfort will come from what pack fits you best.

 

[alukban]

I'd say that the Paradox pack excels at the "going into an ultralight single day mode". That was one of my criteria as well.

It is so light and flexible that it doesn't feel stupid/overkill to use with light loads. Honestly, I sometimes just strap a Kifaru Koala or Scout with side pockets onto the frame an then just add other stuff loose.

 

[Jager]

My question is, how comfortable can a load like this actually be? Will spending the 350-650 on an Exo/SG/Kifaru/MR setup be that different from what I'm experiencing now? Do those pack systems actually bear that weight in a manner that can be called comfortable?

To answer your original question mate, no matter how much you pay for a pack, if you load it up heavy ie with a harvested carcass, it will be uncomfortable, just because a pack costs double the price of another, it won't make the load feel any lighter. I laugh when people say they hardly noticed the 70#'s on their back, impossible.

This last week I was invited to give a talk to a hunting org re backpack hunting. For an experiment one of the boys loaded a 55# fertilizer bag into a pack and the members had a go at guessing weight when they lifted it, they were all guessing north of 80. 80#'s is a lot of weight when you put it on your back.

It is all relative, what you may find comfortable, I might find uncomfortable. The difference in well thought out and manufactured packs (I am not mentioning price point here either) is the r+d involved, and these packs will offer a relative higher level of comfort. Will you still get tired and sore with heavy loads and walking long distance, yes, however the experience will not be as miserable as a not so well thought out pack.

Before I flew home yesterday, I spent some time in a pack factory that takes their r+d and manufacturing processes very seriously, this really is where the difference comes in.

 

[PathFinder]

Still haven't come to a concrete conclusion yet but I'm leaning to the Kifaru Duplex frame w/ Nomad or the Exo with a beavertail and slurpy stalker for day shed trips. The Nomad is likely the better shed hunting design, but taking the bag off the Exo and adding the Slurpy Stalker and beavertail instead would turn it into a dedicated horn hauling machine. The Kifaru is pricier, but more easily available. One potential concern with the Kifaru is the rather large/wide waistbelt; I don't exactly have a giant torso and I wonder if it might really bug me having that big of a waistbelt. Can anyone comment on that? Jager, you hit the nail on the head. I figure I can't go wrong with any of these manufacturers but the fit has to be right.

 

[tipsntails7]

Jäger I don't agree with some of what you said. 70 pounds in my kifaru feels a ton lighter then it did in my eberlestock. Did they weigh the same? Of course but the load feels much much different there for I am able to pack more longer with much more comfort because of the design. Hold a dumbbell parallel to the ground out to your side then hold it down by your waist, same weight but I'd bet my next paycheck it feels lighter and you can hold it for a heck of a lot longer by your waist. Same principle with heavy load in a pack built to take it.

 

[MuleyFever]

There is no best back, you have to try as many as you can. So many people talk up the Kifaru and I got one. I am not having much luck with it. My Icon 3000 was more comfortable so far. I am still adjusting it and I think I may have it now but we will see next week. I plan on buying a couple packs after season and doing some testing to make sure I have the pack that best fits me. Return shipping is well worth the cost to find that pack that fits you better.

 

[tipsntails7]

tipsntails, so your saying a pack costing a lot of money will make a load feel lighter?


You have basically said exactly what I did in my post, the load may weight the same in two different packs, however one may carry said load a lot better, hence it is a lot more comfortable, not lighter. You said it yourself, the load feels much more comfortable because of the design, that doesn't mean a less expensive pack isn't the more comfortable of the two. Read my second last paragraph, it doesn't matter how good or expensive your pack is, carry it with weight for a long time and you will fatigue in many areas.

Your analogy doesn't make much sense, since when did people carry packs at arms length. Nothing to do with weight, more to do with basic physics.

My analogy is for perceived weight.
Holding a dumbbell out is like using an ill fitting pack that does not have proper shoulder lift so your carrying all the weight on your shoulders, just like using only your deltoid to hold the dumb bell, holding by your waist is like using a properly fitting pack that creates shoulder lift utilizing the pack belt and shoulder harness just like using all your back arm and shoulder muscles with the dumbell. It's a crude example but the situations are similar, the weight has no changed but our perception or "Felt" weight has. My kifaru pack loaded is very very comfortable compaired to other cheaper packs I've tried. So yes my kifaru pack makes 80# weigh less then what my eberle did. It has nothing to do with what the actual weight is and everything to do with your perception of the weight.

 

[PathFinder]

I'm definitely willing to send one back if I don't absolutely love it. That's what I love about the higher end pack makers. That's also the crappy deal with the Kuiu; gotta sell it or it's a 350$ space occupier in my hunting room. I thought of another thing the pack will get used for enough to take it into consideration; hauling treestands and bear bait. I think they're all up to it in the right configuration.

 

[MuleyFever]

That's also the crappy deal with the Kuiu; gotta sell it or it's a 350$ space occupier in my hunting room.

I used a KUIU Ultra for 30 days and returned it. Once season is over I plan to get an Icon Pro to try and return it I don't like it.