Anyone using a Whites?

[canyonhunter47]

I know some units with easy draw muzzleloader tags in NM, AZ and CO so I’ve been planning to take the smokepole more seriously.

This what I’m looking for in a gun:

1) Shoots well in a load that’s legal for all 3 (loose powder, no sabots)
2) 50 caliber (CO elk)
3) Drilled/tapped for scope mounts (AZ and load development) and iron sights/peep sights (NM, CO)
4) uses 209’s (less fumbling, no. 11’s sometimes don’t seat well and need to be hammered twice)
5) fairly light

I’d like to use an old Whites that mostly fits the bill above and for sentimental reasons. The gun is in great condition but I’d want to convert it from No. 11 to 209 and test plenty of loads.

Has anyone tried the 209 kit and if so, is it any good? Am I missing out on much compared to the newer rifles on the market? Are there any better bullet designs I’d be missing out on with the Whites? (not sure what the twist or max charge is)

Another option I was considering was just getting a Knight UL or maybe a CVA or TC that fits my needs

 

[redpep]

There's no problem using #11 caps in a White.
I have a UMag in .504 and a .451 built by Doc for me. They are not lite, but with a bullshop pure lead they will do the job. Both are very accurate.
But they are not forsale.

 

[canyonhunter47]

There's no problem using #11 caps in a White.

I’m not crazy about them because I’ve had “misfires” including on game because the cap wasn’t firmly seated enough with finger pressure with a whites. If cocked again that would seat the cap on better and fire as expected.

This wouldn’t happen every time but it’s more likely when you need it most — ie animal jumps up, or reloading quickly for a follow up and fumbling with the tiny cap. And often in the cold so fingers are cold or in gloves (or both)

That’s why I was interested in the 209 kit

 

[redpep]

I litely polished(600 grit wet sand paper) the nipple on my breech plug to help with the seating issue. I use CCI mag caps with a CVA capper, It's the straight one, L shsped st the cap end, you can't bend it when you push the cap on with your thumb. T-777 2F powder and Bull Shop 460 .5045 lead bullets.
I had a White Thunderbolt with the 209 BP system, I worked my tail off to find the right 209 primers to use and the you still have to get it out after you fire the gun. I ended up polishing the primer pocket and then wiped the primer pocket with a qutip with alight coating of anti sieze. I could then fire the MZ about 10 times at the range before the fowling builds up. I ended up selling the Thunderbolt when the price was right.

 

[canyonhunter47]

I litely polished(600 grit wet sand paper) the nipple on my breech plug to help with the seating issue. I use CCI mag caps with a CVA capper, It's the straight one, L shsped st the cap end, you can't bend it when you push the cap on with your thumb. T-777 2F powder and Bull Shop 460 .5045 lead bullets.
I had a White Thunderbolt with the 209 BP system, I worked my tail off to find the right 209 primers to use and the you still have to get it out after you fire the gun. I ended up polishing the primer pocket and then wiped the primer pocket with a qutip with alight coating of anti sieze. I could then fire the MZ about 10 times at the range before the fowling builds up. I ended up selling the Thunderbolt when the price was right.

Great info, thanks!

 

[ElDiablito]

I’ve got seven White rifles. Great guns. I also have a couple 209 kits but don’t use them. The #11s are a better and more waterproof system.

Sounds like you have a nipple issue. Check out this video on how to adjust/modify a nipple so you get a good fit. You can make the nipple looser by sanding or filing it down a little. Sometimes the nose of the OEM plug/nipple gets a little enlarged from hammer strikes so the caps don’t fit perfectly or sometimes they may be a bit loose. You need a proper fit.

Best upgrade you can make to a White though is to get a new breech plug from Jeff Fisk (dba Bestill Creations) that uses replaceable nipples.

 

[redpep]

When you are on your hunt, put a valve stem cap over the cap on the nipple and gently lower the hammer back down, it's a safe way to walk around with the muzzleloader.
I paint mine orange and carry a few spares l with me.

 

[COLOelkman]

I shot my White Ultra Mag .504 a lot last year and never had a misfire. I do use the Bestill nipple (#11) after seeing lots of people saying that's the way to go and I like it a lot. I have several other Whites as well and I'm not sure you'll find anything significantly better unless you go with one of the custome mfg.'s that are like $3K or more. I was shooting decently at 200 yds with open sights even with a problem with my right eye.

 

[redpep]

I have yet to wear out an original White #11 nipple. I went through 4lbs of T-7 one summer shooting my White's.
I am not discrediting Jeff's nipple at all. He does excellent work.

 

[Del Gue]

Jeff makes a custom breech plug for White's. He doesn't make the nipples. You can use any nipple with .250-28 threads(1/4''-28) to fit his plugs. Jeff will sell you nipples along with his plugs if you want for an additional cost. The nipples he offers are the Treso Ampco nipples.
I have two of Jeff's plugs for my White's. They are great quality. The only thing I will ever have to worry about is replacing the nipple if my flash hole wears out.
I like to use the Treso Ampco nipples myself. They work good with the RWS #11 caps. They fit nice and snug.

 

[Par4rick]

I’m not crazy about them because I’ve had “misfires” including on game because the cap wasn’t firmly seated enough with finger pressure with a whites. If cocked again that would seat the cap on better and fire as expected.

This wouldn’t happen every time but it’s more likely when you need it most — ie animal jumps up, or reloading quickly for a follow up and fumbling with the tiny cap. And often in the cold so fingers are cold or in gloves (or both)

That’s why I was interested in the 209 kit

I have 5 Whites I shoot regularly, and have experienced the problem you describe with #11's.

Simple fix, dead reliable.

When you cap your rifle, point in a safe direction, like the ground, grasp the cocking piece, (knob or lever), pull the trigger and GENTLY lower the striker/hammer down to contact the cap.

Keeping the rifle pointed down at the ground, apply firm pressure with your off hand to the rear of the striker, You will feel the cap "stretch" and seat firmly against the nipple.

You have just taken out the "slack" in the cap/nipple arrangement, and the cap is now firmly in contact with the face of the nipple. Now cock the striker to fire.

I have followed this process for several years, it has never failed me.

 

[Del Gue]

I have 5 Whites I shoot regularly, and have experienced the problem you describe with #11's.

Simple fix, dead reliable.

When you cap your rifle, point in a safe direction, like the ground, grasp the cocking piece, (knob or lever), pull the trigger and GENTLY lower the striker/hammer down to contact the cap.

Keeping the rifle pointed down at the ground, apply firm pressure with your off hand to the rear of the striker, You will feel the cap "stretch" and seat firmly against the nipple.

You have just taken out the "slack" in the cap/nipple arrangement, and the cap is now firmly in contact with the face of the nipple. Now cock the striker to fire.

I have followed this process for several years, it has never failed me.

Great advice!
I carry a small wood dowl to help seat my caps. I will try your technique in the future.