Biden announces proposed gun control measures

Stefen Haynes

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About what exactly?

If you are asking about the "modern weapons" then yea, there should be some dialogue on what constitutes "arms" today. Or, we can be constitutional literalists and use the definition of the time which then limits us to muskets and swords and the like. I prefer the dialogue and reasonable arguments that can be explained to the typical voter.

Looking at Huntinaz's comments, the name-calling isn't helpful. That's not going to win people over to his side. But more specifically, the idea that if you don't see the need for high capacity magazines and firearms specifically designed for killing humans, then you're part of the problem.

A LOT of hunters don't see the need for high capacity magazines or firearms designed specifically to kill humans. But they know better than to speak up because they will get shouted down by the gun nuts, called names and in some instances, banned from forums because the mods don't want to hear those points of view.

What we need is reasonable conversation. If we don't sound reasonable to the growing number of people who don't use or own firearms, then we will lose what we have because we didn't do a good job of stating our case. And that's on us.

You may have missed the full reference in my post:

”semi autos and high capacity magazines becoming NFA items (requiring registration with waived fees)”

Fees waived is a key administrative point that disarms the registration cost objection. this is similar to how the ATF approached AR pistols in the recent comment document that was posted and withdrawn in December. NFA registration with a waiver of fees. while I certainly don’t like this idea, I can see it being easier to implement than an outright ban, which requires a law. The Federal government, could design a de novo registration program, but the NFA framework is established And available making it more tactically accessible to the federal govt. NFA also carries some other pain in the ass features like limitations on travel, storage and sales/transfers.

i also think your numbers may be off a bit. there were 5.2 million NFA items in 2017. Say it doubled since and Call it 10 million current NFA items. The number I hear for AR15 type rifles is 15-20, including LEO. to be conservative, maybe double that for any other type of semi auto they may try to ban. to be safe, call it 50 million For all semi autos that they might focus on Plus NFA items. Then say half the other 350 million guns in the US use a magazine that could be subject to new NFA regs and you are talking about 200 million guns, so get to a trillion magazines, you would need over 1,000 magazines per gun.

once again, I don’t like the idea of NFA registration for semi autos. However, I think it is an easier path for the anti gun crowd than a new AWB which can get filibustered among other things.
I meant billions, not trillions.Still, I don’t think it’ll happen. It’s something Dems like to campaign on but never really want to accomplish much. There are too many semi-auto gun owners in the country. 5MM new ones just last year.
 

*zap*

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I hear that the house is voting on a bill that puts 50% tax on firearm and ammo sales the next time they meet
 

Ryan Avery

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Since this has devolved enough, serious question for the voter fraud folks - can you provide some links that back up your beliefs? Don't mistake that for a challenge, I ask because I'd like to have a more educated opinion.
JMO but I think over the next year the evidence will be brought to light. I think the Dominion issue will be the most enlightening especially if Dominion goes down the lawsuit road with Powell. Which I hope they do.
 

Rokbar

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I hear that the house is voting on a bill that puts 50% tax on firearm and ammo sales the next time they meet
HR 5717. Sponsored by some moron from georgia last January. Believe it is in limbo as of now. But with the new session in it could be brought back to the top. Pocohantas sponsored a similar bill in the senate. Google HR 5717.
 

NevadaZielmeister

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I hear that the house is voting on a bill that puts 50% tax on firearm and ammo sales the next time they meet

What, you too?

Sigh.....

H.R. 5717 was introduced this time last year. Still stuck in Committee. Kinda like H.R. 5103, which was introduced in 2018, went no where. Varying levels of state tax increases also went no where (Connecticut HR 5700, Illinois HB 1586, etc.)

Worry monger much?
 

Sccritterkiller

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I love this guy!

He may support guns but he is fine with doing away with public lands. "Texas has 2% public lands and if you ask most Texans that 2% too much." T. Cruze.
I can't figure out why some sportsman will get behind a politician because they are pro 2A but will completely ignore there other policies. Folks need to take off their Jerseys and think for themselves. Everything bad the Ds say about the Rs is true and everything bad the Rs say about the Ds is true..Both sides know this.The people in power really don't care who's right as long as they keep their power.
 

Newtosavage

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In someone's favorite spot
He may support guns but he is fine with doing away with public lands. "Texas has 2% public lands and if you ask most Texans that 2% too much." T. Cruze.
I can't figure out why some sportsman will get behind a politician because they are pro 2A but will completely ignore there other policies. Folks need to take off their Jerseys and think for themselves. Everything bad the Ds say about the Rs is true and everything bad the Rs say about the Ds is true..Both sides know this.The people in power really don't care who's right as long as they keep their power.
Maybe the thinking is if they take away all our public land, we won't need guns anymore because we'll have no place to use them. LOL

Joking, but what you said is spot-on. Some people get so blinded by one issue (2A, Abortion, Immigration) that they completely lose sight of some of the policies these people have that are directly opposed to our hunting and outdoor way of life.
 

Chucklehead

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He may support guns but he is fine with doing away with public lands. "Texas has 2% public lands and if you ask most Texans that 2% too much." T. Cruze.
I can't figure out why some sportsman will get behind a politician because they are pro 2A but will completely ignore there other policies. Folks need to take off their Jerseys and think for themselves. Everything bad the Ds say about the Rs is true and everything bad the Rs say about the Ds is true..Both sides know this.The people in power really don't care who's right as long as they keep their power.

This has been brought up before with regards to Cruz. It's not new.
Not every hunter uses public land. Especially in Texas, where Cruz is from.
The bad policies he has can be defeated. Its been done before and we can do it again.
You think you need to agree with every policy he has to like him as a rep overall? What if you agree on 99 out of 100 policy positions? That's it? "I'm out"? Single issue voter?
 

Dos Perros

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Not my understanding. He was stopped by the officers and he reached for a gun in his coat after being told to show his hands and "don't reach for it." They gave him every opportunity to live, but he chose to be a martyr instead.

I may be confusing him with another guy that was shot.

One wonders why they didn’t just Hellfire his ass with a Blackhawk?
 

Dos Perros

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I must have. Apologize if I misrepresented your argument.

I think my point was, because of the shit storm created by how the feds handled Ruby Ridge and Waco, the Bundy situation got handled differently.

Another poster here might have suggested a drone strike on those folks holed up. But obviously that would look awful, and that’s why something like that wasn’t done, because optics and politics are important to decision makers.

I said it before...I don’t think some future conflict would resemble anything like symmetrical warfare. Why would it?

And even if it did, there are plenty of examples of folks doing what they thought was right, well aware that it would lead to their deaths. I think that is a powerful deterrent in and of itself.
 

Sccritterkiller

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This has been brought up before with regards to Cruz. It's not new.
Not every hunter uses public land. Especially in Texas, where Cruz is from.
The bad policies he has can be defeated. Its been done before and we can do it again.
You think you need to agree with every policy he has to like him as a rep overall? What if you agree on 99 out of 100 policy positions? That's it? "I'm out"? Single issue voter?
I vote to re-elect no one....and if its only incumbents on the ticket I will obstain. They are all crooks both sides. Terms limits for congress is only way to get our country back. The founding fathers never envisioned career politicians. The viewed Congressional term as a service to your country not a chance for the country to serve you.
 

WCB

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Maybe the thinking is if they take away all our public land, we won't need guns anymore because we'll have no place to use them. LOL

Joking, but what you said is spot-on. Some people get so blinded by one issue (2A, Abortion, Immigration) that they completely lose sight of some of the policies these people have that are directly opposed to our hunting and outdoor way of life.
Public lands is one of those issues people get blinded by also....
 
OP
BjornF16

BjornF16

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I think it's mostly fluff and the majority of elected officials will not make that it a huge topic to push. Elected Dems from Texas and other southern states as well as midwest states know where most of their voters stand on it. Always remember about politicians they will only do what they think is necessary to get re-elected. Plus I think they realize the biggest things to tackle are the pandemic and keeping businesses afloat.

Obviously stay vigilant but I don't think the sky is falling quite yet. Biden was already in office for 8 years and nothing changed much.
The times are different today as compared to Obama's 8 years.

Near the end of the Obama administration, we saw the beginning of the end of the filibuster under Dirty Harry Reid.

During the Trump administration, we saw judges being confirmed with simple majority (due primarily to Dirty Harry Reid's breaking of Senate tradition, Turtlehead McConnell followed suit).


Under Reid, Democrats voted for the "nuclear option" in 2013, which eliminated the filibuster for executive branch and judicial nominees. Four years later, Republicans under Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell extended the policy to Supreme Court nominees so Justice Neil Gorsuch could be concerned.




What do you think the Dems are going to do now that they have control of Senate again?

Protecting our 2A rights (as they exist today) is in grave danger. There are gun grabbers in both parties just as there are pro 2A in each party.

The key will be putting constituent pressure on weak kneed Republicans and Dems who may strike a blow against the 2A.

The fallback may be Trumps court appointments...but that takes years to go through the full process to get to SCOTUS.

So, in spirit of my original OP, be vigilant! Contact your Senators and Reps!



(And for God's sake, stop the inward facing circular firing squad and be civil with one another here. We need to band together. Hostility, accusations, and personal attacks aren't going to help sway another's opinion...and you know what they say about "assumptions")

Edit: Added quote and link from Newsmax
 
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BjornF16

BjornF16

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He may support guns but he is fine with doing away with public lands. "Texas has 2% public lands and if you ask most Texans that 2% too much." T. Cruze.
I can't figure out why some sportsman will get behind a politician because they are pro 2A but will completely ignore there other policies. Folks need to take off their Jerseys and think for themselves. Everything bad the Ds say about the Rs is true and everything bad the Rs say about the Ds is true..Both sides know this.The people in power really don't care who's right as long as they keep their power.
Ted Cruz really has nothing to do with lack of public lands in Texas...that is a problem that has existed for a very long time.

Of course, most of the people who say "2% is too much" are the land owners.

So, I'll still support Ted. He is very pro 2A, unlike my other senator, Cornyn. I'd like to get rid of Cornyn and replace him with a clone of Ted.
 

NDGuy

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The times are different today as compared to Obama's 8 years.

Near the end of the Obama administration, we saw the beginning of the end of the filibuster under Dirty Harry Reid.

During the Trump administration, we saw judges being confirmed with simple majority (due primarily to Dirty Harry Reid's breaking of Senate tradition, Turtlehead McConnell followed suit).

What do you think the Dems are going to do now that they have control of Senate again?

Protecting our 2A rights (as they exist today) is in grave danger. There are gun grabbers in both parties just as there are pro 2A in each party.

The key will be putting constituent pressure on weak kneed Republicans and Dems who may strike a blow against the 2A.

The fallback may be Trumps court appointments...but that takes years to go through the full process to get to SCOTUS.
Good points man, I agree. Our politics shouldn't just be a pendulum back and forth ramming things through just because someone has the majority now. I have worry as well that particular cat is out of the bag now.
 
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