Do you manage your own investments?

Kilboars

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Dec 22, 2013
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West Palm Beach, Fla
Up until last year I've invested myself. Just buy good companies with low P/E's and let them ride.

No mutual funds or index funds straight stocks.
 

DudeBro

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Mar 17, 2019
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158
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Virginia
I manage mine and my mother's investments, which is pretty easy given my strategy. For years, I paid brokers 3-5% to advise on stocks and funds. The investments were always measured against "the market" - some did good in the short term, but none "beat the market" in the long term once you factored in funding fees and expense ratios (there's a reason nobody has ever one Buffet's challenge). Then, I was hit with an epiphany - if the measure of performance is always "the market," why not just invest in the market. So, a few years ago, I moved all of our money into the Vanguard S&P 500 ETF (VOO); it has zero funding fees and nearly zero (currently at .03%) expense ratio. With the funding fee and expense ratio, I'm already more than 5% ahead of where'd I'd be with more traditional investing.

I disregard the conventional risk strategy of diversification for two reasons: 1) the various investment sectors are incredibly interdependent these days - one goes down, they pretty much all go down; 2) the S&P has never been down over any 10 year period.
 

jpalderton

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Jan 24, 2021
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Wisconsin
Agree with the above about Fidelity. Have used their managed services as well as index funds on my own. Very happy with the company overall.
 

Farmingdale's Finest

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I manage mine and my mother's investments, which is pretty easy given my strategy. For years, I paid brokers 3-5% to advise on stocks and funds. The investments were always measured against "the market" - some did good in the short term, but none "beat the market" in the long term once you factored in funding fees and expense ratios (there's a reason nobody has ever one Buffet's challenge). Then, I was hit with an epiphany - if the measure of performance is always "the market," why not just invest in the market. So, a few years ago, I moved all of our money into the Vanguard S&P 500 ETF (VOO); it has zero funding fees and nearly zero (currently at .03%) expense ratio. With the funding fee and expense ratio, I'm already more than 5% ahead of where'd I'd be with more traditional investing.

I disregard the conventional risk strategy of diversification for two reasons: 1) the various investment sectors are incredibly interdependent these days - one goes down, they pretty much all go down; 2) the S&P has never been down over any 10 year period.

Being a financial advisor trying to beat the market is a suckers bet also I have never seen anyone charge 3-5% a year. There are some individual investments with fees that high for instance a variable annuity that you pay extra for a guaranteed income or minimum death benefit. But never for just managing your money.

We earn our fees for keeping people from making impulsive stupid decisions like I put in a previous post on this thread. That advice has saved my clients tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars. There is a reason the average investor earns less than 4% while the S&P 500 has averaged about 10% over history. They buy at the top of the market and sell at the bottom because they panic.

Actually your statement that the market hasn’t lost money over 10 years is incorrect. From January 1st 2000 through January 2009 we experienced the first time the “market” was down ten years later. Now how would you react if Jan 1, 2000 was the day you retired. You now have negative compound interest and could be out of money in the next ten years. While a diversified portfolio with stocks, bonds and cash averaged about 8% in that time period. But when the market is down 50% over three years a very large portion of investors panicked out and made those losses permanent. We also saw those retires kids invest much too conservatively and get significantly below market returns in the recovery.

Today with the run off the bottom last year and the frothiness with the new investors throwing money around at any idea that they hear on snap with no research is going to end at some point as badly as the tech bubble. Last week Elon Musk posted something and people thought he was talking about a penny stock and on Monday the stock was up like 800% and went from like a million dollar market cap to 100 million in a few hours. That is the definition of a bubble.

No investing is not rocket science but most people aren’t equipped to make the best choices for them selves because they don’t know all of the options available to themselves. For instance someone retired with more cash than they need for two years. Something that is quite common today. They can significantly increase their income and protect their heirs with estate putable bonds so at their death even if the bond is down 50% the heir would get the full face value by giving the bond back to the company y that issued them. If the bond is worth more then you sell it in the market with the stepped up cost basis from the time of death. There are annuities that let’s say hypothetically you put in $1 million and at your death between the management fees, a bad market and taking out more money than you should have and the value of account has depreciated and is now worth $10.00 they will pay the beneficiary the original investment amount just like the estate putable bond I mentioned above and if it’s worth more your beneficiary gets the stepped up basis too. These are just two things that the average investor has no idea about.


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DudeBro

Senior Member
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Mar 17, 2019
Messages
158
Location
Virginia
Being a financial advisor trying to beat the market is a suckers bet also I have never seen anyone charge 3-5% a year. There are some individual investments with fees that high for instance a variable annuity that you pay extra for a guaranteed income or minimum death benefit. But never for just managing your money.

We earn our fees for keeping people from making impulsive stupid decisions like I put in a previous post on this thread. That advice has saved my clients tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars. There is a reason the average investor earns less than 4% while the S&P 500 has averaged about 10% over history. They buy at the top of the market and sell at the bottom because they panic.

Actually your statement that the market hasn’t lost money over 10 years is incorrect. From January 1st 2000 through January 2009 we experienced the first time the “market” was down ten years later. Now how would you react if Jan 1, 2000 was the day you retired. You now have negative compound interest and could be out of money in the next ten years. While a diversified portfolio with stocks, bonds and cash averaged about 8% in that time period. But when the market is down 50% over three years a very large portion of investors panicked out and made those losses permanent. We also saw those retires kids invest much too conservatively and get significantly below market returns in the recovery.

Today with the run off the bottom last year and the frothiness with the new investors throwing money around at any idea that they hear on snap with no research is going to end at some point as badly as the tech bubble. Last week Elon Musk posted something and people thought he was talking about a penny stock and on Monday the stock was up like 800% and went from like a million dollar market cap to 100 million in a few hours. That is the definition of a bubble.

No investing is not rocket science but most people aren’t equipped to make the best choices for them selves because they don’t know all of the options available to themselves. For instance someone retired with more cash than they need for two years. Something that is quite common today. They can significantly increase their income and protect their heirs with estate puttable bonds so at their death even if the bond is down 50% the heir would get the full face value by giving the bond back to the company y that issued them. If the bond is worth more then you sell it in the market with the stepped up cost basis from the time of death. There are annuities that let’s say hypothetically you put in $1 million and at your death between the management fees, a bad market and taking out more money than you should have they will pay the beneficiary the original investment amount just like the estate putable bond I mentioned above and if it’s worth more your beneficiary gets the stepped up basis too. These are just two things that the average investor has no idea about.


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You are right, my statement about 10 years was wrong.

With that said, were you an advisor during the aftermath of 9/11 or the housing crisis of 2008? What common investment strategy would have made money across those world events without a crystal ball? There are certainly strategies that would have reduced risk of loss, but it is still a loss. Not to mention, those same strategies would also at least partially shield the investor from the substantial gains that began in March 2009.

I agree that some people need protected from their own poor decisions. That should not be the default; that is what has lead our country to the social security crisis we have. I am definitely not one of those people, and the fees associated with management of finances is definitely not worth it to me.
 

Farmingdale's Finest

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Dec 30, 2017
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742
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NEW JERSEY
You are right, my statement about 10 years was wrong.

With that said, were you an advisor during the aftermath of 9/11 or the housing crisis of 2008? What common investment strategy would have made money across those world events without a crystal ball? There are certainly strategies that would have reduced risk of loss, but it is still a loss. Not to mention, those same strategies would also at least partially shield the investor from the substantial gains that began in March 2009.

I agree that some people need protected from their own poor decisions. That should not be the default; that is what has lead our country to the social security crisis we have. I am definitely not one of those people, and the fees associated with management of finances is definitely not worth it to me.

I have been an advisor for 20 years and yes my clients were down in those time periods and other than the one I mentioned that didn’t listen to me during the credit crisis they all came out with significantly less losses than what the market was down during that time period. Which also meant they didn’t need as big a return to get back to even and it also meant they were ahead sooner. I had several clients at the end of 2009 have portfolio’s worth more in Dec 2009 than what it was worth in October 2007 at the market peak before the credit crisis without adding money.

As I said we earn our keep when the market goes against us. Yes that happens less often than when the market goes up but those mistakes that the majority make are where they turn paper losses into realized losses that can’t recover because if they liquidate at the bottom they don’t have the same amount of cash to buy enough shares of any investment to catch up without taking much more risk than they are comfortable with.

Again it’s not the investments we pick it’s planning based upon the clients risk tolerance, short and long term goals and the time frame when they need that money. We formulate that plan to get them from point A to B with the least amount of volatility so they don’t panic out and make bad decisions. Again there is a reason the average investor has a return of about 4% when the market has averaged about 10%.

As I said it’s not rocket science but the average person is not built to make those decisions because of personal fears and biases. If you can that’s great but then you are the exception. I wish you all the best.


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DudeBro

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Mar 17, 2019
Messages
158
Location
Virginia
Again there is a reason the average investor has a return of about 4% when the market has averaged about 10%.
I suppose I'm not the average investor. I got serious about understanding my investment strategy during the 2008 crisis and went in strong in March 2009. Since then, my TSP C fund has had an annualized return of 16.9%, my TSP S fund has had an annualized return of 18.7%, my kids' 529 plan has had an annualized return of 13.7%, and the S&P has had an annualized return of 13.96% (all percentages may not be exact, but are pretty close for comparison's sake).

I acknowledge my 100% equities strategy has a higher risk than a more generally accepted allocation. I accept that risk for the added potential return.

I also acknowledge that some investors need assistance with short, intermediate, and long-term strategy. Once an initial strategy is determined and an allocation is established, I see little advantage to an ongoing relationship w/ an advisor other than as a coach to ensure discipline - attempts to time the market generally result in negative returns.

This is just one guy's view. I'm not trying to be confrontational.
 

Marble

Senior Member
Joined
May 29, 2019
Messages
1,253
Through work I have a 457 that is managed at .5% annually.

Wife and I share an account through a small firm that we've bought some mutual funds and individual stocks through.

Recently I started a Robinhood account to basically gamble...individual stocks. Have a small amount in there I'm going to tinker with to learn a few things. It's fun.


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Beendare

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May 6, 2014
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In Traffic
Funny story, my 22-year-old son is killing me right now. He is doing the day trading type stuff with very small amounts of money but his last four trades average up 80%. He sent me over this thing that he’s going to do AMC calls and two days later he sells it for a 150% profit.... and he is complaining because he sold it too early he could’ve been up much more than that.

before that it was gamestop and Southwest Airlines calls.

it’s hard to tell him that that is not investing.....

....
 

mlevimadden

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2014
Messages
353
Location
Colorado
Funny story, my 22-year-old son is killing me right now. He is doing the day trading type stuff with very small amounts of money but his last four trades average up 80%. He sent me over this thing that he’s going to do AMC calls and two days later he sells it for a 150% profit.... and he is complaining because he sold it too early he could’ve been up much more than that.

before that it was gamestop and Southwest Airlines calls.

it’s hard to tell him that that is not investing.....

....
I shake my head every time I look at this thread with over 5k posts. Hopefully some of them come over here and read the Vanguard advice.

https://www.rokslide.com/forums/threads/dip-in-the-market-what-are-you-guys-buying.162409/
 

Shaun Wayne

Newbie
Joined
Aug 30, 2020
Messages
9
Big Fidelity fan, made the move from a local financial advisor to fidelity about 5 years ago. They made the process of transferring over super easy. I like their mobile app, partially because im used to it now.. Its easy for me to use for most day to day things and I use my computer for deeper research and planning. Good luck!
 

BrokentineCO

Junior Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2021
Messages
15
Location
Grand Junction
Another fan of Vanguard index funds here. J.L. Collins book The Simple Path to Wealth does a really great job of laying out how to take on your own investments. It really is simple too. Just set it and forget it.
 

Pahunter1

Junior Member
Joined
Jun 5, 2015
Messages
14
Location
Pennsylvania
I’m a financial advisor and to be honest if you wanna pick your own stocks and determine when to buy and sell do it somewhere that doesn’t have trade fees or at least cheap fees. Guys like me come in handy when your trying to generate income, bypass the tax man, or don’t want to ever look at your account and just want told what to do...with a fee of course lol
 

accuracy

Junior Member
Joined
Feb 17, 2021
Messages
13
Location
So Calif.
I trade my own personal portfolio with TD Ameritrade. While i'm not a very savvy trader, i've gotten help from couple friends who trade for a living.

While my performance has been decent, it takes a more time and effort + stress obviously. (I look for about 5-10min, 3-4 times a week) However in my 401k account, which is with Vanguard . I set distribution to nearly all Small-Midcap High Risk funds, and my vanguard account generally does better than what I could do.
I never touch it, and only look at it like twice a year, haha.

also QQQ and SPY can be good buy and forget etfs. since youre essentially just betting on the market.
 

Meshnasty

Member
Joined
Apr 19, 2018
Messages
51
We do our own. We went to financial advisor right as covid hit the US. I asked him why I should invest with him when the markets are at an all time high and there is a new virus circulating the globe, which he said "its always a good time to invest". The market dumped two weeks later and he got none of my money. Once he saw what we had saved he wanted us to write a check that day and had all sorts of plans for it.

I have a trading account which is higher risk and long term account. Long term account is heavy in passive ETFs like VTI/VOO and some ARK funds. I run less risky options and leaps through it as well.

Trading account is mainly options. The trading account is winning by a long shot this year, but this market is easy to take advantage of. I got sick of having to babysit short term options and it's hard with my job so it's mainly longer dated options now, 2-6 months out. I won't be a millionaire over night, but I wont go broke either if the market turns down for while. I'll gladly risk my money went the ROI is high, but I'm no expert. This is why my accounts are separate. I also follow my own set of rules that I rarely deviate from.

My goal is to get to a point where I can conservatively theta farm and not have to work.
 

KsRancher

Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2018
Messages
78
I have a 401k thru my work. It's at Edward Jones. I absolutely hate it. They take a annual percentage pulled out monthly, of the account gross balance. I dislike that in the fact that they get a paycheck for "attendance" not "accomplishment". It has done good though 15% annual return of the last 4 yrs. I have only had it 4 yrs. I opened up a TD acct in March. I am putting in all the extra money I can into it. I bought only into individual stocks. But I am in the process of getting 2/3 of my money into ETF's (QQQ,SPY) and will keep 1/3 into individual stocks. I always put my annual raise into my 401k, but wont be doing that anymore. Any raises will be put into my TD account. Granted, it will be post tax instead of pre tax. But I am fine with that.
 

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