WOLVES..."Do You Realize Now What You Have Done?..."

[TraderMike]

I saw this link posted over on AT and thought it needed to be read by as many sportsmen as possible. It is a bit lengthy but worth the time IMO.
http://canadafreepress.com/print-friendly/77682

The question of introducing Canadian wolves, at least in Colorado, is a moot point. They are already here... Now what to do about it. As has already been mentioned on another thread, the Colorado Park and Wildlife is this week discussing the matter of wolf introduction in CO.

 

[Darren Best]

The end goal from the beginning was to eliminate hunting by means of using the wolf to wreak devastation on game animals. We are at the point that if we don't band together and push back, we will lose our heritage of hunting for our children and grandchildren.

Everyone sportsman that hunts in Colorado needs to fight and put a stop to wolves there and stop or prevent federal protection of what is already there.

 

[WyoBowhunter21]

Very well written article. Sadly this will not do justice unless we as hunters stand up and say we are fed up with it. I know in my home state I am tired of hearing about finding elk carcasses and no live elk. For the second year in a row, I go without getting a deer or elk. I now resort to buying beef for the year. Do I continue hunting? That is a very good question that I often ask myself. I realize it is not about the kill, but the chase, but if what your chasing is not there, what do you chase? My hope is, before it is too late we can find a solution. As learned in college, the solution to pollution is dilution.

 

[TraderMike]

I couldn't agree more.

 

[Shrek]

The wolf is about a lot more run just eliminating hunting. It's about destroying the economy of the west so that the population living there will collapse. The ESA , CWA , and control of the federal lands is being used to push people off the land and into cities. The wolf is but one tool.

 

[airlocksniffer]

The end goal from the beginning was to eliminate hunting by means of using the wolf to wreak devastation on game animals.

Source?

 

[jmden]

Source?

Knowledge of the liberal agenda, airlock.

 

[Darren Best]

They openly admit it.

 

[DaveC]

Very well written article.

A bare majority were even complete sentences.

 

[DaveC]

The wolf is about a lot more run just eliminating hunting. It's about destroying the economy of the west so that the population living there will collapse. The ESA , CWA , and control of the federal lands is being used to push people off the land and into cities. The wolf is but one tool.

You do realize that saying this stuff out loud only reinforces the assumption that hunters are wackjobs divorced from any meaningful picture of reality, yes?

 

[WyoBowhunter21]

A bare majority were even complete sentences.

I apologize. It was meant in sarcasm but with that said it is a very good topic.

 

[airlocksniffer]

Much like politics as you have all discovered recently, although you paint me as a far-left liberal, I'm neither all pro or all anti-wolf. If reintroduction does happen in CO (I'm not sure it's a good idea), management has to include hunting. That said, it seems like wolves are already extending their range so not sure that we need to be dumping more into the state. But, at least in the case of the Bitterroot, wolves were blamed for the decline of the elk herd but didn't turn out to be the case:

http://fwp.mt.gov/mtoutdoors/HTML/articles/2014/BitterrootElkResults.htm#.VpQ5oufntah

As far as the "far left agenda", unless you can show a source it's just fear mongering.

 

[TraderMike]

My understanding of the wolves that are being introduced is that they are a sub-species that is not indigenous to the western U.S. and that they are a Canadian (Northern) sub-species. Big difference between "reintroduced" and "introduced" in this particular instance as the Canadian strain is said to be much larger and more destructive on deer and elk herds. Also, the alleged science behind "restoring" the natural balance by bringing back an apex predator like wolves goes out the window when the species being brought back actually qualifies as an invasive species because it never inhabited the region in question in the first place.

 

[DaveC]

My understanding of the wolves that are being introduced is that they are a sub-species that is not indigenous to the western U.S. and that they are a Canadian (Northern) sub-species. Big difference between "reintroduced" and "introduced" in this particular instance as the Canadian strain is said to be much larger and more destructive on deer and elk herds..

I'd love to see evidence which supports this statement. Every biologist I've asked about it just rolls their eyes.

 

[jmden]

Much like politics as you have all discovered recently, although you paint me as a far-left liberal, I'm neither all pro or all anti-wolf. If reintroduction does happen in CO (I'm not sure it's a good idea), management has to include hunting. That said, it seems like wolves are already extending their range so not sure that we need to be dumping more into the state. But, at least in the case of the Bitterroot, wolves were blamed for the decline of the elk herd but didn't turn out to be the case:

http://fwp.mt.gov/mtoutdoors/HTML/articles/2014/BitterrootElkResults.htm#.VpQ5oufntah

As far as the "far left agenda", unless you can show a source it's just fear mongering.

https://vimeo.com/28858208 See just a few of the direct quotes in this one movie alone. Then find a copy of 'Yellowstone is Dead'. There's plenty of information out.

 

[jmden]

Did you read the article in the OP?

EDIT:

http://www.fws.gov/mountain-prairie/species/mammals/wolf/northernrockymountainwolfrecoveryplan.pdf

Page iv of the Preface talks of the remaining population. What was done to ensure their survival? And, remember this is a biased report to begin with in my opinion. The fact that this was even mentioned is amazing, but dealt with by "there's not a viable population..." Really? Is that what we said about the California condor?

Who got to play king and decide that the native population of wolves could be exterminated to bring in a non-native, invasive subspecies? No politics here. The non-native, invasive sub-species Canadian Gray wolf was forced upon us.

 

[Jason Snyder]

My understanding of the wolves that are being introduced is that they are a sub-species that is not indigenous to the western U.S. and that they are a Canadian (Northern) sub-species. Big difference between "reintroduced" and "introduced" in this particular instance as the Canadian strain is said to be much larger and more destructive on deer and elk herds. Also, the alleged science behind "restoring" the natural balance by bringing back an apex predator like wolves goes out the window when the species being brought back actually qualifies as an invasive species because it never inhabited the region in question in the first place.

There is absolutely nothing to substantiate this. Look at the historical sizes of wolves that were indigenous to the Northern Rockies and then look at all of the harvest data that has been collected since the inception of wolf hunts in the lower 48. You'll find there is no significant difference in sizes.

 

[tipsntails7]

I'd love to see evidence which supports this statement. Every biologist I've asked about it just rolls their eyes.

The same can be said for the 200 pound monster wolves... Somehow every time they are weighed they shed about 70-80 pounds.

 

[jmden]

Guys, Read my post above. That's just one of several sources not to mention the article in the OP. It never fails to amaze me how blind so many hunters are to this issue. Wake up!

 

[TraderMike]

I can't keep track of how many articles I have read over the last 10 to 15 years stating that there is a difference between the traits of different sub-species of wolves.
http://www.lobowatch.org/adminclient/WolfFacts4/go

This one took me all of 2 minutes to find. Oh, incidentally, are these biologists that you are polling cashing government pay checks? If they are- and what biologist doesn't work for the government- then just maybe they value their job and aren't going to acknowledge that their scientific justification is completely flawed.

In response to DaveC...