Bino + Rangefinder vs Bino with Rangefinder built in

[darmento]

I am about to venture into the rabbit hole of purchasing optics for Western hunting. Trying to figure out if I should get a pair of binos plus a separate rangefinder, or if the technology has advanced to the point where you can just get one pair of Binoculars with a good rangefinder built in.

Seems like there is a LOT of good experience on this forum in the area of optics. Thank God, because the subject is definitely confusing!!!

I was thinking about getting a pair of Zeiss Conquest HD 10x42, and then purchasing a rangefinder for under $1000 (hopefully) like a Revic BR4, and then it occurred to me that maybe there is a product out there that includes a good rangefinder, while still having very very good binocular capability. Usually these combo products wind up being jack of both trades but master of none, but I wanted to get some expert opinions.

By the way, the rangefinder needs to be good for no more than 1,000 yards. In reality, I probably won't take a shot beyond 500 yards or so....

Thanks!!!

 

[Lee_R]

Given you're rifle hunting, I'd suggest going with a bino/rf combo. (Archers like the one handed operation of a stand alone rangefinder). I know there's alot of hate on here for vortex, but I love my Fury 5000s. I don't have the ones with the ballistics calculator, however. But for just over $1000, they're great. FWIW, I got rid of stand alone zeiss binos and a Sig kilo 2200 rf for the vortex. Also, I know the range of those Furys is more than you say you'll need. I agree and my shooting range is less than yours, but I like to range further distances to know where I'll need to stalk to, etc. Good luck with your search.

 

[SDHNTR]

I went from separate units to a combo, and then back to two separate units again. I am primarily a bow hunter. I found it much easier to range one-handed and I can do so with less movement with a separated rangefinder. That matters to me. But for strictly rifle hunting when you will seldom get inside of 100 yards, the combo unit is convenient.

 

[nobody]

Separate units. Each company has something they're really good at. Swaro builds good binos, but their rangefinding capabilities, IMO, leave a LOT to be desired. Buy really good binos and a really good rangefinder and keep them separate.

I also strongly dislike the RF binos because none of them (that I'm aware of) have ambidextrous controls. I'm right handed/right eye dominant, so if I'm shooting my bow, I usually wanna run everything with my right hand. But sometimes I do wanna use my left hand. Every RF bino I know of favors one over the other. And binos are harder to run one handed/keep steady relative to a small rangefinder.

Invest in good binos one time, and buy a solid rangefinder. Electronics go bad/become obsolete. If you buy a $3k pair of Swaro RF binos and the electronics fry, you're SOL because their electronics only have a 1 year warranty. So you're left with really ergonomically sucky binos without a functioning rangefinder. Rangefinders are, for all intents and purposes, disposable. Buy a really good pair of Alpha-level binos and a good rangefinder and you'll spend less money in the long run.

 

[nphunter]

My opinion is to have them separate. There are lots of good options out there for individuals and the biggest downfall I can see is that range finders are electrical and will eventually die, then you are left with a big heavy set of binoculars. Most companies have poor warranties on their electronics. Most are 2-5yrs, Vortex is the exception with a lifetime warranty on electronics.

I would buy your Zeiss Conquest HD 10x42 binos and a Vortex Razor 4000 range finder and be set for life. Great binos, great range finder and both will last as long as you hunt. My Razor range finder is the 4th range finder I've purchased in about 15 years, the first 3 had electronic issues, in total I've spent about $1500 on range finders and I'm happy I'll never have to buy another.

 

[Huntin Fool]

Another vote for the fury 5000, I doubt there is a range finder that is much better than the one in the fury and you get a life time warranty on the electronics. I love mine and I doubt I would ever go back to having a hand held rangefinder

 

[josef]

Depends on what you are looking for. Stand alone binos will always have better optics all else being equal. There are compromised that are required to put the LRF in there. LRF binos will always be able to range further all else being equal again.

I have gone to a 10x42 LRF bino on my chest and 15x56 stand alone binos in my pack for use with a tripod. The ranging capability is amazing and if I really need to pick something apart I can get the larger binos out. I am not counting rings on sheep so I leave the spotter in the truck 99% of the time.

 

[tdhanses]

It definitely is personal preference, I went to the combo in one 5 years ago and haven’t looked back. If you have the coin I’d look at the new Leica Geovid Pro coming out shortly.

I have an older Leica Geovid HDB 2200 and it does everything I need and has glass not far off from the Swaro EL SV, doubt I’ll ever go back to separate. You could probably find these for less then your separate and have better glass.

 

[tdhanses]

My opinion is to have them separate. There are lots of good options out there for individuals and the biggest downfall I can see is that range finders are electrical and will eventually die, then you are left with a big heavy set of binoculars. Most companies have poor warranties on their electronics. Most are 2-5yrs, Vortex is the exception with a lifetime warranty on electronics.

I would buy your Zeiss Conquest HD 10x42 binos and a Vortex Razor 4000 range finder and be set for life. Great binos, great range finder and both will last as long as you hunt. My Razor range finder is the 4th range finder I've purchased in about 15 years, the first 3 had electronic issues, in total I've spent about $1500 on range finders and I'm happy I'll never have to buy another.

Hard to say, even if you have to pay to fix something from an alpha it usually is very reasonable also many times even if out of warranty they’ll still not charge as a good faith repair.

This isn’t something I’d worry about.

 

[nphunter]

Hard to say, even if you have to pay to fix something from an alpha it usually is very reasonable also many times even if out of warranty they’ll still not charge as a good faith repair.

This isn’t something I’d worry about.

It is hard to say, what about 10+ years down the road? I'm not really debating alpha glass warranty but the electronic part warranty is a PITA and companies just don't warranty them well, all myself and others have been offered when filing a warranty claim on discontinued range finders is a small discount off of the retail price for an upgraded model. It still cheaper in most cases just to purchase from someone like camera land on sale.

 

[tdhanses]

It is hard to say, what about 10+ years down the road? I'm not really debating alpha glass warranty but the electronic part warranty is a PITA and companies just don't warranty them well, all myself and others have been offered when filing a warranty claim on discontinued range finders is a small discount off of the retail price for an upgraded model. It still cheaper in most cases just to purchase from someone like camera land on sale.

I sent my 5yr old geovids back that were demos so only had a 1 year warranty, leica completely went through them for a total cost of $0, they had a focusing issue so nothing electrical but they still did it all after warranty was up.

Maybe when they are 20 years old if they fail I’ll get a new one.

 

[Superchop]

Hands down combo lrf binos. I don’t know anyone here in the Rockies that hunts seriously and still uses separate binos & rf. Who the hec wants to look at game, and then come out of their glass and dig out their range finder so they can range it, and go back & forth all day?

So which ones do you get? IMHO if you have the coin, go with the Swaro EL Range binos, they’re bad to the bone. If you’re more cost sensitive but still want a solid set of rf binos then look to the SIG Kilo 3k. Those would be my choices. I’ve beat the crap out of a set of the Sig Kilo 3k binos over the past 3 years, and they still operate perfectly. Awesome warranty too.

I don’t think you can necessarily go wrong with the Leica binos or the newer updated Vortex Fury binos, but I think the Swaros beat the Leicas, and the SIGs beat the Vortex.

 

[Rocky]

Separate units. Each company has something they're really good at. Swaro builds good binos, but their rangefinding capabilities, IMO, leave a LOT to be desired. Buy really good binos and a really good rangefinder and keep them separate.

I also strongly dislike the RF binos because none of them (that I'm aware of) have ambidextrous controls. I'm right handed/right eye dominant, so if I'm shooting my bow, I usually wanna run everything with my right hand. But sometimes I do wanna use my left hand. Every RF bino I know of favors one over the other. And binos are harder to run one handed/keep steady relative to a small rangefinder.

Invest in good binos one time, and buy a solid rangefinder. Electronics go bad/become obsolete. If you buy a $3k pair of Swaro RF binos and the electronics fry, you're SOL because their electronicsYuo only have a 1 year warranty. So you're left with really ergonomically sucky binos without a functioning rangefinder. Rangefinders are, for all intents and purposes, disposable. Buy a really good pair of Alpha-level binos and a good rangefinder and you'll spend less money in the long run.

Zeiss RFs have an ambi control. It comes set with the right button from the factory, but with a few clicks, it can be switched to the left button.

 

[handwerk]

Been using my old Geovid HD-R's for many years without issue and don't plan on changing.
One thing people often fail to mention is how much easier it is to range with BRF vs. a small handheld.
Also I think the optical penalty for the BRF is often overblown in real field use. I also have 8.5 EL's and 12x NL Pures and for sure they impress, but not enough for me to stop using my Geovids as my main hunting handheld bino.

 

[tdhanses]

Been using my old Geovid HD-R's for many years without issue and don't plan on changing.
One thing people often fail to mention is how much easier it is to range with BRF vs. a small handheld.
Also I think the optical penalty for the BRF is often overblown in real field use. I also have 8.5 EL's and 12x NL Pures and for sure they impress, but not enough for me to stop using my Geovids as my main hunting handheld bino.

I completely agree.

 

[nobody]

Zeiss RFs have an ambi control. It comes set with the right button from the factory, but with a few clicks, it can be switched to the left button.

This is great, but highlights a reason I prefer separate units. I don't want to have to remember to change my RF setup when I switch from rifle practice to bow practice to rifle season to bow season to 3d season to long range practice. And I stand behind the fact that Alpha glass is expensive enough, you shouldn't have to turn it over every few years because the electronics are fried or obsolete.

Alpha glass = $2500
Top Dollar Rangefinder #1 = $700-ish
Top Dollar Rangefinder to replace #1 when #1 fries/dies after 5 years = $700-ish
Cost for 10 Year to run this setup = $3900

Swarovski EL Range TA Initial Investment - $3,600
Replacement in 5-7 Years when Electronics Fry - $3,600
Cost for 10 year Ownership of these Items = $7200

Net Difference (Assuming Zero inflation, Yeah Right...) = $3300

I know you can send the Swaro's in for repair, but they only have a warranty for 2 years. And you can also send the rangefinder in for repairs in scenario #1, so its a moot point. Assuming both of these items failures are handled same same (repair vs repair or replace vs replace) Electronics wear out and become obsolete. But the $3300 "saved" in scenario #1 equals lots of other gear and tags. I also stand behind my statement that the best glass companies don't build the best rangefinders, and the best rangefinder companies don't always build the best glass. Buy the best of each unit that you can find, and buying them separate saves you money in the long run. Lots of guys still run their SLC's from 20 years ago and have no plans to upgrade, should they be forced to if those SLC's have an integral rangefinder that can't be serviced?

Idk, that's my view, but I'm just some random guy on the internet...

 

[LittleZooski]

Personally prefer them separate

 

[tdhanses]

This is great, but highlights a reason I prefer separate units. I don't want to have to remember to change my RF setup when I switch from rifle practice to bow practice to rifle season to bow season to 3d season to long range practice. And I stand behind the fact that Alpha glass is expensive enough, you shouldn't have to turn it over every few years because the electronics are fried or obsolete.

Alpha glass = $2500
Top Dollar Rangefinder #1 = $700-ish
Top Dollar Rangefinder to replace #1 when #1 fries/dies after 5 years = $700-ish
Cost for 10 Year to run this setup = $3900

Swarovski EL Range TA Initial Investment - $3,600
Replacement in 5-7 Years when Electronics Fry - $3,600
Cost for 10 year Ownership of these Items = $7200

Net Difference (Assuming Zero inflation, Yeah Right...) = $3300

I know you can send the Swaro's in for repair, but they only have a warranty for 2 years. And you can also send the rangefinder in for repairs in scenario #1, so its a moot point. Assuming both of these items failures are handled same same (repair vs repair or replace vs replace) Electronics wear out and become obsolete. But the $3300 "saved" in scenario #1 equals lots of other gear and tags. I also stand behind my statement that the best glass companies don't build the best rangefinders, and the best rangefinder companies don't always build the best glass. Buy the best of each unit that you can find, and buying them separate saves you money in the long run. Lots of guys still run their SLC's from 20 years ago and have no plans to upgrade, should they be forced to if those SLC's have an integral rangefinder that can't be serviced?

Idk, that's my view, but I'm just some random guy on the internet...

Even if out of warranty on electronics they are repairable and doubt it’s super expensive, so not really a moot point if it costs $500 to repair each when you consider the replacement cost. Plus with the way prices are jumping who knows what the cost to buy new will be at that point.

 

[DCT1983]

I have only run my 5000 Fury HDs for one season here in Missouri so far, but so far I love them. I can't wait to get out west and use them out there in the future. Like mentioned above I really like that I don't have to put the binos down to range after looking at it.

 

[nobody]

Even if out of warranty on electronics they are repairable and doubt it’s super expensive.

Either way, as I said in my post, so is the single RF unit. Difference is once the electronics are obsolete and irreparable, it STILL costs more to replace and own the RF binos. It's dollars and cents, and at the end of the day, the RF binos cost more, period. You get much higher value per dollar spent with separate units.