How long is too long before it goes bad.

[coOverwatch]

Okay, So I ran into some elk hunters over the weekend discussing how long an elk will last not being dressed out. It appears one in their party had shot a “good sized” cow and followed the blood trail for about ¼ mile. Due night falling in and not wanting to bump the elk they decided to pick up the trail again the next morning. The shot was mid morning and the weather was in the low 30’s with snow and rain off and on. Based on the direction they said the elk was heading higher towards the snow line which was around 7500.
So what experience has others run into in this situation? How quickly will the meat spoil not being dressed out. I figured they would be okay over-night as it the temps would be near freezing. However if the elk was down for 6-8 hours mid-day with temps around 50 would everything be spoiled.

And on a Rant- If some poor shmuck walks by your camp with a load of elk on their back stating that they are solo hunting and have an elk down 4 miles and two ridges away and they ask if you can spare some time to help don’t respond… “ You shot it you hump it out “! Remember it might be you that could use a friendly hand some time. Got that response from the camp mentioned above as I was walking by at 7pm with a hind quarter on my back as they were standing around drinking coffee. Didn’t even ask if I would like a cup to warm up. This is after they dropped their camp 200 yards from mine. Okay…. End of rant. And Yahooo….. I got elk in the freezer!

So how long have you left a non dressed elk sit and not lost any meat?

 

[rayporter]

i can't put a number of hours on that but i bet it would sour pretty fast.

i knew of a deer shot at sunddown in 30 degree temps that i personally found the next morning before sunup. it was about zero when i found it. i saved the backstraps but they were slimy and the rest was already green. elk are bigger and hold heat better.

 

[wapitibob]

Neck and hinds at the ball joints will bone sour over night. I track at night if I have to. I'm not leaving anything overnight, on the ground, with the guts in it.

Oh, and I would have grabbed my pack and helped... congrats on the Elk.

It would be a miracle if they went back and spent more than an hour looking the next day.

 

[justin davis]

It just kinda depends. The bull I killed this year. I shot him right at dark. Didn't want to push him because I was not clear as to where I hit him. He died shortly after I'm sure. I found him Next morning. Stiff. Meat was perfect.

 

[ScottP]

I shot a cow with my bow in 2013, entered in through the liver and out just behind the heart, missing the lungs (my biologist wife did a quasi-necropsy to see what happened) as the arrow passed through the back of the front shoulder and exited. Shot was 5pm. I jumped the elk at 6pm when I went to pick up the arrow, she had gone only 50 yards and I couldn't see through the spruce-fir jungle that she had just been standing there the whole time in one place. Found a few drops of blood where she was standing and 2 prints where she had crossed some big down fall. Then darkness and the 2013 CO monsoon settled in on us. My buddy, who has a lifetime of elk experience compared to my 2 years at that time suggested risking some meat loss and looking in the daylight given the complete lack of blood, dangerous lightning and the jungle this elk had just walked into. It was Sept. 5, and the low temp overnight was 50 maybe.

We took up the search again at 7am and by 9am had located the elk, about 400yds down hill from where I last saw it. No blood, just found a few prints on a game trail and grid searched the drainage. The meat was fine, we quickly butchered and packed out all meat in one trip. Immediately deboned and put on ice in coolers as it was going towards 80 degrees that day. Changed the ice a couple times over the next day and cut and wrapped it all. ZERO meat loss. Its all been consumed and was as good as the one I dropped with my rifle in October.

That was my experience anyway. My buddy (who also guides for elk hunting) said it varies a lot on whether you lose any meat or not, and as noted above, the inside of the HQ and neck, especially on the side towards the ground would be the first to go.

 

[coOverwatch]

I know there is a lot of wiggle room with determining if when the meat will turn. With questionable shots on TV you see them leave elk overnight and never really talk about if/how much meat is lost. I always hurry to get things taken care of ASAP. I even got a little worried about leaving half of the cow I shot hanging in the Junipers over night. I just couldn’t risk twisting an ankle at 10pm to get two more loads out that night. Was taking 2.5/3 hours round trip and it was a rocky slope. I usually have an OTC with my Cow hunts… will think long and hard about filling two tags at one time when I am out by myself. 

I was taught that if you see someone walking a deer or elk out by themselves you don’t wait for them to ask for help.. you shoulder your pack or grab the horse and help out. they were pretty liquored up so I don't know how much help they really would have been.


This was the first Elk I did with the Stone Glacier I got last year and it worked perfectly. Going to have to get the wife one so she can help next time.

 

[Violent Hippie]

This August my hunting partner put an arrow through a blacktail in 70 degree weather just before dark. Arrow entered the guts and exited opposite lung. We lost the tracks after 1/2 mile and complete darkness sunk in. It got down to about 40 that night and we found him around 9 am . We opened him up and all was fine. Still ate the heart and liver with no meat spoiled.

 

[MattB]

I have seen a bull start to spoil overnight in ~50 degree weather. The side that was on the ground did not cool down and bone sour started in the hip joint.

 

[JPD350]

Neck and hinds at the ball joints will bone sour over night. I track at night if I have to. I'm not leaving anything overnight, on the ground, with the guts in it.

Oh, and I would have grabbed my pack and helped... congrats on the Elk.

It would be a miracle if they went back and spent more than an hour looking the next day.

I agree^, sometimes you really got to put your nose in it to smell the sour, removing a little bit right away is best so that you don't taint other meat.

 

[djsmith46]

You seem like a nice guy and I like to fancy myself a nice guy as well. However, I have never had the expectation that a stranger would help me hump out an animal I had shot. Those fellas were certainly rude to you but a four mile hump there and a four mile hump back with a load of meat might wreck some guys and their prospects for killing an animal subsequently. Days off from work are hard to come by for most and time spent as a packer for other hunters is time lost hunting. With that being said theres a good chance I still would have helped you out and I certainly wouldn't have spoke to you in that manner.

 

[coOverwatch]

I didn't have the expectation that anyone would be obligated to help out.... It was just the response I got when I asked if anyone could spare a few hours to help bring it down even half way. the other part of the story that I left out was this was the first time these guys were hunting the area and I pointed them to where they had a good chance to find some elk, which they did. either way it all worked out okay, they got to drink and I got my elk out... and learned that I need to do a lot more training (okay some) in the off season.

You seem like a nice guy and I like to fancy myself a nice guy as well. However, I have never had the expectation that a stranger would help me hump out an animal I had shot. Those fellas were certainly rude to you but a four mile hump there and a four mile hump back with a load of meat might wreck some guys and their prospects for killing an animal subsequently. Days off from work are hard to come by for most and time spent as a packer for other hunters is time lost hunting. With that being said theres a good chance I still would have helped you out and I certainly wouldn't have spoke to you in that manner.

 

[djsmith46]

I didn't have the expectation that anyone would be obligated to help out.... It was just the response I got when I asked if anyone could spare a few hours to help bring it down even half way. the other part of the story that I left out was this was the first time these guys were hunting the area and I pointed them to where they had a good chance to find some elk, which they did. either way it all worked out okay, they got to drink and I got my elk out... and learned that I need to do a lot more training (okay some) in the off season.

In that case I definitely would have helped you out. That was super generous of you to point them in the right direction.

 

[Poser]

If it smells good, it'll taste good (aka: "If the streets are clean, go downtown )

 

[Where's Bruce?]

I woulda helped out and expected a slice of steak for dinner which in my case may be the only way I ever get to eat elk...they manage to mess with me every hunt. LOL
I have come sooooo close but still eating tag soup.



As for spoilage, it depends on the shot, when it expired and whether or not anything found it first. No way to say. If it was a good shot and died quickly it may have spoiled during the heat of the day. I would have tracked it that day...after 7 hrs if the shot was poor (not that I make those).

 

[orionsbrother]

My buddies and I had two elk down on a warmer day. We broke them down, hanging the quarters from one in the shade of some Jack pines and boned out the rest of the meat and loaded it into our packs. We didn't have a four mile pack out, but it was a rigorous couple of miles bee-lining to a road and then a hike around the head of the drainage to get the truck.

Shortly after my buddies hit the road and dumped their packs, they met a guy in his truck who was starting his trip. His truck was still loaded with coolers and gear. He was looking for all kinds of direction. They suggested some good campsites and explained that we were low on water. They asked if they could buy a few bottles from him. He said that he didn't have any.

They refrained from sharing any scouting and started hoofing to the truck.

 

[Manosteel]

It just kinda depends. The bull I killed this year. I shot him right at dark. Didn't want to push him because I was not clear as to where I hit him. He died shortly after I'm sure. I found him Next morning. Stiff. Meat was perfect.

I had the same experience about 4 years ago. Shot elk right at sundown, shot looked a little high and I didn't want to push him in the jungle of brush he ran into. Found him next morning right at sunrise, shot was good and it was clear he died pretty quick. Stiff as a board but meat was all good. Temps were right around 35-30f that night.

 

[coOverwatch]

So I guess there is no "magic" number and go with the rule if it smells bad then it is bad.

 

[Scot E]

My experience.

Part of what you have to decide is do you want the best tasting meat or just edible. There will be degradation in only a couple hours after death. You can see this by how fast and completely a quarter will firm up after quartering and hanging. Most quarters that took even a couple hours to get off the carcass won't firm up near as much as ones that were broke down faster. This is due to the bloating gases that very quickly surge through the blood vessels once a creature dies. If you want the very best meat you need to get your game animal broken down as quickly as possible. Leaving an animal overnight is very popular on TV but it is something I try to avoid at all costs. It's also a reason why the gutless method leads to some bad meat sometimes. I love the concept but for meat purposes only you are much better off to sever the gas line to the meat!



Breaking down the hind quarters properly and getting that knuckle exposed to air is very important. I am much less concerned about warm weather. I have had some great meat in really hot conditions, than I am about getting the hide off immediately and quarters made correctly. In my experience hind quarter will start to go bad very quickly on any animal left overnight. A lot of guys don't understand how much meat their processor has to throw away around this area.

Hope this helps

 

[Snyd]

My experience.

Part of what you have to decide is do you want the best tasting meat or just edible. There will be degradation in only a couple hours after death. You can see this by how fast and completely a quarter will firm up after quartering and hanging. Most quarters that took even a couple hours to get off the carcass won't firm up near as much as ones that were broke down faster. This is due to the bloating gases that very quickly surge through the blood vessels once a creature dies. If you want the very best meat you need to get your game animal broken down as quickly as possible. Leaving an animal overnight is very popular on TV but it is something I try to avoid at all costs. It's also a reason why the gutless method leads to some bad meat sometimes. I love the concept but for meat purposes only you are much better off to sever the gas line to the meat!

Breaking down the hind quarters properly and getting that knuckle exposed to air is very important. I am much less concerned about warm weather. I have had some great meat in really hot conditions, than I am about getting the hide off immediately and quarters made correctly. In my experience hind quarter will start to go bad very quickly on any animal left overnight. A lot of guys don't understand how much meat their processor has to throw away around this area.

Hope this helps

I call BS on this one.


I've done about 15+ moose using the gutless method. 4 of them by myself. I butcher and grind my own meat. If you figure an average of 400lbs of meat per animal that's about 6000lbs of moose meat I've dealt with in Sept temps ranging from 30-65. I've NEVER had bad meat or thrown away edible meat while processing. I NEVER have tainted/sour meat resulting from how I handle it.

 

[William Hanson (live2hunt)]

I don't know for sure about elk but I've had whitetail that had spoilage when it was mid 30s overnight but I've also had no spoilage in the same circumstance, I don't know what the difference was.

As far helping pack an animal, I can't think of too many circumstances that I wouldn't pack mule grateful of the opportunity to be of assistance.