I keep reading about these bulls people are tagging and not finding....

[TSAMP]

I dont see the thread as anti hunting. Wounding sucks and bow hunting certainly has the majority. Talking about it is helpful, even though its a subject we as hunters try and avoid to protect ourselves from outside prejudice. I will say ive noticed as of late a whole lot of people up on pedestals like they never made a mistake and would of done such and such different. Gets old, but then again seeing folks not take the craft as serious as you also gets old. I say if your here and talking about this, we're probably not all that far off from one another. So keep the conversation going.

 

[Gila]

I dont see the thread as anti hunting. Wounding sucks and bow hunting certainly has the majority. Talking about it is helpful, even though its a subject we as hunters try and avoid to protect ourselves from outside prejudice. I will say ive noticed as of late a whole lot of people up on pedestals like they never made a mistake and would of done such and such different. Gets old, but then again seeing folks not take the craft as serious as you also gets old. I say if your here and talking about this, we're probably not all that far off from one another. So keep the conversation going.

Things are back on track now about what this thread should be about. I'm not so sure about bowhunting being the primary culprit. At least there is usually an arrow to give an idea of where the animal was hit. I've never shot mechanicals. My goal has been and still is a pass through shot. With a rifle sometimes you just don't know until you get to the impact area. Range is a sore spot for more than a few. Seems as though technology eventually eclipses what an ethical range is considered to be. I try to get as close as I can and I know what my personal limitations are with my weapons. I suppose ethical range will always be a debate. I want to believe most hunters are fundamentally ethical. I would think everyone wants to bring home some meat.

 

[CamoPirate]

I keep reading these senseless posts and not finding the point.

 

[AaronMColeman]

I bow hunt and I hit an elk in the shoulder last year. 4” penetration. Very little blood. It was near my house so I searched for 2 days and came up with two spots of blood and no real direction. I assume he lived since it was a shoulder wound. But it felt terrible. Rushed shot I knew I shouldn’t take. I wish I hadn’t taken it. I hope I learned and I know I put a lot of hours into real world scenarios in practice this year.

But even a lost animal isnt a waste. The circle of life. Something will use every ounce of that animal. I don’t want to be the cause of that circle of life but its true.

i didn’t punch my tag on that shot. Maybe I should have. But it seemed like his survival rate was pretty high. I later got one in rife season. I punch the tag if the animal is,likely dead. like so much of the hunter‘s ethic, it’s a personal decision. I don’t want to push my beliefs on anyone. That’s why I love threads like this, we get opinions from others and refine our own.

 

[AaronMColeman]

Things are back on track now about what this thread should be about. I'm not so sure about bowhunting being the primary culprit. At least there is usually an arrow to give an idea of where the animal was hit. I've never shot mechanicals. My goal has been and still is a pass through shot. With a rifle sometimes you just don't know until you get to the impact area. Range is a sore spot for more than a few. Seems as though technology eventually eclipses what an ethical range is considered to be. I try to get as close as I can and I know what my personal limitations are with my weapons. I suppose ethical range will always be a debate. I want to believe most hunters are fundamentally ethical. I would think everyone wants to bring home some meat.

ive Seen more wounded animals by rifle than bow. Part of that is more guys rifle hunt so odds increase. I also think it has to do with more hack rifle hunters who can hit a gong at 500y on the range and think they can in the field too. And I think a huge contributor is the high BC bullets making people think they can take out an elk at 700y because their 6.5mm has a .721BC. im not opposed to any means of take or distance. Just know your limits, train, be willing to pass up things your not comfortable with, and accept that hunting is not always pretty.

 

[deerlick]

I know alot of guys who shoot really well at targets and shoot alot, but can't keep their composure when a elk is in their face.

 

[Geewhiz]

So another side of this debate is rifle hunters. I can only speak for here in Michigan but I have to believe it’s similar (or worse) in the west with the longer distances.

I can’t tell you over the years how many people never go look for blood or the animal if it doesn’t drop within sight. Lazy people shooting too far and even if they do go look they might not even be able to find the spot in the low light with their 500 yard shot.

Lots more rifle hunters out there and an animal is more likely to survive a bow hit. Happens to both but bow hunters always take the brunt of it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Besides the fact that, at least in montana, there is no season that follows rifle season. All dead animals that are found in the spring are attributed to winter kills, but all dead animals found in rifle season are attributed to bad archers.

 

[Wrench]

If you kill enough elk you'll find them with enormous puss pockets from broadheads, bullets and antler tines.

Congratulations on your 100% performance. As a guy with 30 ish elk to my credit, I can't claim such success.

 

[CMF]

Thats an awesome tip, I hadn't even heard of or considered a website where blood tracking dogs could be found

In Mississippi we have facebook groups dedicated to aligning hunters with trackers(with dogs). If you put a dog on a track, he'll find it if it's down or let you know if its not. The guys that do it, live for it and probably do more tracking than hunting because they like working their dogs.

My best whitetail on the wall was found with a dog, the shot was good, but the blood ran out after 50 yds. He only made it another 70 or so, but piled up in brush and we walked right by him the night before.

The only buck I never recovered, I put a quartering away shot on him and only got into the front shoulder. We put dogs on it after the blood ran out and we grid searched. The dogs ran him a mile and came back, the handler said the deer wasn't dead. Three weeks later a kid killed him youth weekend.

I would never give up a search without trying to put a dog on the trail.

 

[gelton]

One thing that I will point out with Archery is that everyone gets so focused on FOC and heavy arrows that knowing the distance of the shot is paramount. I had a clean miss last year because I pre ranged my distances and not the animal and was shooting heavy arrows with high FOC and my speed wasnt there. If I had a flatter shooting arrow and new the exact distance to the animal I dont think I would have missed. The next arrows that I build are going to be for a specific FPS, not weight or FOC.

As to the circle of life comment above, I shot a whitetail doe right at the end of shooting light several years ago that had little to no blood trail in the desert sands of S Texas, we found her the next morning totally devoured by coyotes, there was not a piece of meat left on any bone at all.

 

[Beendare]

I keep reading these senseless posts and not finding the point.

The POINT....is for hunters to think.

Its a worthy process to evaluate our skills and limitations for the eventuality of a shot on game.....and stay within our skill level.

I've seen a lot of woundings over the years when hunting and calling for friends........and am responsible for a few myself. One in particular comes to mind, a coyote I called in to a friend and he shot [rifle] the coyotes front leg clean off [laying there on the 2 track]- never recovered.

I would say the majority of woundings I've seen were due to guys extending their effective range [rifle and bow]

By now we all should know that our effective range in the field on live animals is much less than at a rifle range on sandbags....or flat ground at an archery range....where we have all the time in the world to touch one off. Just the "urgency" factor of a shot in the field cuts your effective range drastically.

______

 

[AaronMColeman]

As to the circle of life comment above, I shot a whitetail doe right at the end of shooting light several years ago that had little to no blood trail in the desert sands of S Texas, we found her the next morning totally devoured by coyotes, there was not a piece of meat left on any bone at all.

I don't want to be a part of that circle of life (well, unless I'm the consumer in that circle). But the truth is even a lost animal will be used 100%. The goal is to use it yourself, and it really sucks to lose an animal. But, again, we can't beat ourselves up if we did the right thing and the wrong outcome occured.

 

[CamoPirate]

The POINT....is for hunters to think.

Its a worthy process to evaluate our skills and limitations for the eventuality of a shot on game.....and stay within our skill level.

I've seen a lot of woundings over the years when hunting and calling for friends........and am responsible for a few myself. One in particular comes to mind, a coyote I called in to a friend and he shot [rifle] the coyotes front leg clean off [laying there on the 2 track]- never recovered.

I would say the majority of woundings I've seen were due to guys extending their effective range [rifle and bow]

By now we all should know that our effective range in the field on live animals is much less than at a rifle range on sandbags....or flat ground at an archery range....where we have all the time in the world to touch one off. Just the "urgency" factor of a shot in the field cuts your effective range drastically.
______

It's hunting; it's dynamic. Nothing prepares you for shooting at a live animal, and with success rates where they are, how times does the avg person draw on a live animal? Yeah, taking wanton shots and just wounding game to fling arrows is pathetic, nobody is going to argue that. But it's hunting. It's a matter of when, not if, you'll have a bad shot, regardless of how often or how well you shoot. You can't stop animals from reacting.

Hence why I don't get these posts. A lot of emotion, very little logic.

 

[Bendersfembot]

I bow hunt and I hit an elk in the shoulder last year. 4” penetration. Very little blood. It was near my house so I searched for 2 days and came up with two spots of blood and no real direction. I assume he lived since it was a shoulder wound. But it felt terrible. Rushed shot I knew I shouldn’t take. I wish I hadn’t taken it. I hope I learned and I know I put a lot of hours into real world scenarios in practice this year.

But even a lost animal isnt a waste. The circle of life. Something will use every ounce of that animal. I don’t want to be the cause of that circle of life but its true.

i didn’t punch my tag on that shot. Maybe I should have. But it seemed like his survival rate was pretty high. I later got one in rife season. I punch the tag if the animal is,likely dead. like so much of the hunter‘s ethic, it’s a personal decision. I don’t want to push my beliefs on anyone. That’s why I love threads like this, we get opinions from others and refine our own.

Hello i am practicing archery for my first bow hunt ever. Your scenario is my worst nightmare and something i will have to consider heavily. Thanks for bringing this up i will be following thread to see how others would react in these circumstances. I shoot an sas recon survival bow it's a surprisingly well built tool.

 

[David Kaden]

I also hear an awful lot of hunters describe hitting a bull and not finding him. And a guide I talked with said 2 out of three hunters he guided were wounding bulls, so he quit the business. Its not just beginning hunters either. To many hunters take LONG SHOTS!! And to many things can go wrong and shots over 30 yds. Not to mention loss of arrow energy due to wind drag etc. I think Outdoor TV shows play a part in this growing distance hunters are taking shots. Watching really good shot like Levi Morgan drop a critter at 100 yds like he did on a dall sheep hunt, doesn't mean you, or even he, should be doing that. Animals can take a step while arrow is in flight, and what might have been a good shot is a gut shot or worse. we owe it to the game we hunt to shoot only at distances you can put 4 out of 4 in a 6" in circle. And next time someone tells you about wounding and not finding an animal, tell him why he isnt respectful of the game or the sport..

 

[Warmsy]

I totally agree with what you said. I think it gets murky, though.

This thread has stories of people trailing animals 500+ yards, hands and knees, aspirin for headaches... If a hunter were to shoot, with any weapon, at any range, and watch it run into a thick canyon, and say "duck it, I'm not going into that shit.", The 500+yard guy and aspirin guy would be very upset.

It may be legal. But like others have mentioned about the anti-hunting tend of this thread, aren't we compelled to police ourselves and encourage ourselves to get afield with nothing but the highest embodiment of those ethics and morals?

I'm new to hunting. I have killed a turkey and a few rabbits and squirrels. I've killed hundreds of sheep, goats. Chickens, turkey, etc. Often I have been teaching others to slaughter. I always slaughter with a knife, and I'm very good at it. There have been a few that just wouldn't die, with other people watching. Some were my mistake, and others. As people know, won't let go of life.

I appreciate you looking at both sides. When my day comes that I shut a deer with my recurve in California, I hope that I maintain my lofty ideals.

 

[Warmsy]

Sorry I was trying to quote stubborn bowhunter.

[IMG alt="Stubborn_bowhunter"]https://forumdata.rokslide.com/file/forumdata/data/avatars/m/18/18183.jpg?1565349439[/IMG]

Stubborn_bowhunter​

Senior Member​

• Sep 20, 2020
• Add bookmark
• #54

I see no difference when comparing a lion failing to kill an animal. We're also natural critters whether we want to act higher than nature, or not.

I standby the old saying you probably haven't been hunting very long if you've never botched a shot. It sucks, but just like a lion failing to kill we may also lose prey.

It is one thing if you know for certain an animal you shot is going to die. If you don't know and gave every effort then it's on you to make the choice. I can and have lived with wounding an elk then moving onto keep hunting. I spent two days looking for it, had photos of it alive a month later.

I've also heard the argument "that you still shouldn't consider your tag filled if you don't find said animal. It's for proof of legal transfer of ownership from the state to you. If you didn't find the animal you have nothing to own besides your gut wrenching feeling. Whether you want to keep hunting after giving your best effort, but failing to find the critter. That's on you. You technically did not take an animal though."

 

[*zap*]

best to learn to enjoy seeing the animal walk past when there really is no opportunity for a high % shot rather than slinging an arrow or bullet at it.....is this really a discussion of ethics or a discussion of self control and knowing what your ACTUAL ability is.

 

[trophyhill]

Thats an eye opening percentage there if its accurate, the bow shooting part of it can be trained and practiced out if willing, I figure the blood trailing can only come from experience and like any other curve in hunting its steep. I don't have dogs but I bring my brother along, he's a damn good blood trailer.

I seriously doubt that’s accurate........

 

[mtblackdog]

One lunged a bull one time with my longbow around noon. Followed and tracked him till 6:30 that evening. He went three miles. Only way most of the time I found him was I heard him cough. He would then spray blood. About every 500 yards. Tough bastards to say the least.