Starting predator hunting.

[wcasey755]

Hey everyone, Im a long time deer/elk/duck hunter and I blast coyotes when they get to close to my cows. Im in southwest Washington and I frankly cant bring myself to chase these decimated elk numbers anymore. Coming onto a herd and seeing each and every one of them limping on one good leg and having nothing on them but their skin and fur. Just hurts my soul. So ive made the decision to switch my efforts to hunting the predators. Hopefully helping out the elk and deer along the way. My question is, since I cant use bait or hounds. Spot and stalk or calling seems to be my options. What is everyones opinion on a E caller that can put me somewhat away from the target while also not costing a arm and a leg. My second question is rifle related. I have a 300. win mag I use for big game. It does some damage to a deer. Im wanting to go after coyotes, bobcats, cougar, and black bear. What is a caliber you guys would suggest that can drop all of those without destroying the hide on a cat or bear in case I choose to get one taxidermized? Thank you all for your time!

 

[Skerhunter]

For callers remote range is important. I’m not up to date on any new callers, so not sure which model is best bang for your buck. Any foxpro with the tx1000 remote has a good range. Lucky duck callers are popular also. Getting a cheap caller doesn’t work the best unless it is calm and animals are close.

For a calling gun I prefer to have the flattest shooting round possible (204, 22-250, 22creed, 6mm). Ideally they come to the caller, but if they circle 300 yards down wind I don’t want to have to worry about ranging. For which caliber, there is a big difference between bobcats. Any caliber .224 and up can leave bigger holes depending on bullet used and shot placement. 243 would be pretty close to covering everything - 55gr varmint bullets up to 95-100gr for cougars/bear. It going to leave a hole in a bobcat though.

I guess which animals do you expect to call in the most and at what distance do you think your shots will be?

 

[wcasey755]

For callers remote range is important. I’m not up to date on any new callers, so not sure which model is best bang for your buck. Any foxpro with the tx1000 remote has a good range. Lucky duck callers are popular also. Getting a cheap caller doesn’t work the best unless it is calm and animals are close.

For a calling gun I prefer to have the flattest shooting round possible (204, 22-250, 22creed, 6mm). Ideally they come to the caller, but if they circle 300 yards down wind I don’t want to have to worry about ranging. For which caliber, there is a big difference between bobcats. Any caliber .224 and up can leave bigger holes depending on bullet used and shot placement. 243 would be pretty close to covering everything - 55gr varmint bullets up to 95-100gr for cougars/bear. It going to leave a hole in a bobcat though.

I guess which animals do you expect to call in the most and at what distance do you think your shots will be?

I was looking at the foxpro prowler. Looks like a solid entry level caller.

Where I’m at we have all of them. Coyotes, bear, bobcats, cougar. A lot of them too. Seen them all, only shot coyotes and bobcats off blind luck. I’d love to target bear and cougar as well though. Shots In my area can be 30-250 yards. Although there is some spots that could hit the 400-500 range. I initially was thinking 243 or 6mm. I definitely want some knockdown. If I have to leave a bigger hole in a bobcat to keep the knockdown power. I can always have the mount facing the other way haha.

 

[Spoonbill]

I was looking at the foxpro prowler. Looks like a solid entry level caller.

Where I’m at we have all of them. Coyotes, bear, bobcats, cougar. A lot of them too. Seen them all, only shot coyotes and bobcats off blind luck. I’d love to target bear and cougar as well though. Shots In my area can be 30-250 yards. Although there is some spots that could hit the 400-500 range. I initially was thinking 243 or 6mm. I definitely want some knockdown. If I have to leave a bigger hole in a bobcat to keep the knockdown power. I can always have the mount facing the other way haha.

You can get a 22 centerfire and cover everything, if it is legal for bears and lions in your area.
Another option would be a 223 for bobcats and coyotes and a 243/6cm for bears and mountain lions and set both rifles up the same.
My coyote hunting is similar to yours and I am in the same boat as far as getting started. I have a 243 and a 223, My plan is to use my 243 until my scope for my 223 shows up then use the 223 exclusively.

 

[Skerhunter]

I was looking at the foxpro prowler. Looks like a solid entry level caller.

Where I’m at we have all of them. Coyotes, bear, bobcats, cougar. A lot of them too. Seen them all, only shot coyotes and bobcats off blind luck. I’d love to target bear and cougar as well though. Shots In my area can be 30-250 yards. Although there is some spots that could hit the 400-500 range. I initially was thinking 243 or 6mm. I definitely want some knockdown. If I have to leave a bigger hole in a bobcat to keep the knockdown power. I can always have the mount facing the other way haha.

Looks like that remote has a good range! Not sure how windy it gets there, but I would suggest getting a bigger(louder) one if calling in winds over 10mph or expect the animals to be beyond 1000ish yards. The design on that caller looks just like their old entry level one, but they improved the remote. Nothing wrong with it, just won’t put the sound out there as far.

243/6mm sounds like the ticket if you want just one gun for it. 55gr varmint bullets for coyotes and cats works great. You can jump up to 90-100 grains for bears/lions then. Pay attention to barrel twist. Most are 1:10 and will shoot 55-100 grainers. Go faster and you can over spin the lighter ones.

I don’t have lion/bear experience. Hopefully someone can chime in on what bullets they know work well.

 

[wcasey755]

Looks like that remote has a good range! Not sure how windy it gets there, but I would suggest getting a bigger(louder) one if calling in winds over 10mph or expect the animals to be beyond 1000ish yards. The design on that caller looks just like their old entry level one, but they improved the remote. Nothing wrong with it, just won’t put the sound out there as far.

243/6mm sounds like the ticket if you want just one gun for it. 55gr varmint bullets for coyotes and cats works great. You can jump up to 90-100 grains for bears/lions then. Pay attention to barrel twist. Most are 1:10 and will shoot 55-100 grainers. Go faster and you can over spin the lighter ones.

I don’t have lion/bear experience. Hopefully someone can chime in on what bullets they know work well.

Wind here honestly isn’t to bad. Closer to the coast it gets worse but where I stomp around the timber tends to keep the wind in check. What would be the big difference between .243 and 6mm?

I appreciate what advice you did give! It was very helpful.

 

[wcasey755]

You can get a 22 centerfire and cover everything, if it is legal for bears and lions in your area.
Another option would be a 223 for bobcats and coyotes and a 243/6cm for bears and mountain lions and set both rifles up the same.
My coyote hunting is similar to yours and I am in the same boat as far as getting started. I have a 243 and a 223, My plan is to use my 243 until my scope for my 223 shows up then use the 223 exclusively.

So then are you packing in two rifles? My main concern is having a smaller caliber like a 223 then having a big bear or cat come in and not having enough firepower to take it down. Around here our bear and cougar season is pretty dang long. So I never want to get caught with my pants down under gunned. I know some fellas preach that .223 is enough for cats and bears but it just makes me a bit nervous.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

So then are you packing in two rifles? My main concern is having a smaller caliber like a 223 then having a big bear or cat come in and not having enough firepower to take it down. Around here our bear and cougar season is pretty dang long. So I never want to get caught with my pants down under gunned. I know some fellas preach that .223 is enough for cats and bears but it just makes me a bit nervous.

You need to read the 223 thread. The right bullet in a 223 will kill everything from coyotes to moose, including cats and bears.

 

[Spoonbill]

So then are you packing in two rifles? My main concern is having a smaller caliber like a 223 then having a big bear or cat come in and not having enough firepower to take it down. Around here our bear and cougar season is pretty dang long. So I never want to get caught with my pants down under gunned. I know some fellas preach that .223 is enough for cats and bears but it just makes me a bit nervous.

My 223 is currently scopeless but I wouldn’t feel undergunned if I had it loaded with the right bullets.
If feeling undergunned is a concern, maybe a 6 creed would be a better choice. Ammo is inexpensive and you can shoot heavier bullets.
Also I haven’t really looked at hunting in your state but 22 cals may be illegal for hunting bears, I know some states have rules about it. Something to look into if you are wanting a one gun option.

 

[wcasey755]

My 223 is currently scopeless but I wouldn’t feel undergunned if I had it loaded with the right bullets.
If feeling undergunned is a concern, maybe a 6 creed would be a better choice. Ammo is inexpensive and you can shoot heavier bullets.
Also I haven’t really looked at hunting in your state but 22 cals may be illegal for hunting bears, I know some states have rules about it. Something to look into if you are wanting a one gun option.

Yeah I just looked it up and it is. Minimum is .24. So looks like the 6 creed is the move!

 

[TheGDog]

Save up your dough, and get a FoxPro X24. Them having that Coaxial Tweeter really creates realism when the recording is of equally good quality.

Just stuff it into a Juniper or something similar, about waist height or chest height off the ground... then find a good hidey spot to sit low at, that's facing towards the crosswind from the downwind side of the caller location onward. Doing this you can get them in to 20-25yds easily. And don't need a rifle, shotgun works great. But I understand you might live in a different habitat type though, where rifle is for sure needed.

But yeah for distance? X24 works great in that regard as well. I've never had to run it terribly long before they come in, if the area has them there. But on days when I'm making stands on some new location I wanted to give a try to.. it's large rechargeable battery pack could easily go far longer than most would ever need.

I've stopped using a motion decoy for coyotes, as I've had some bolt the moment they see it. At least in my "primo spot" that's always brought one in.

Another great ultra small lightweight caller is made by Pocket Prey. Runs off a 9v battery. BUT.. you hand hold it, so you end up pointing the sound back and forth to create realism... so gotta be ready to quickly set it down on your lap the moment they come into view, so your hands are ready on the rifle/shotgun.

For .223 Rem.... seriously checkout the Hornady 35gr NTX loading! It's listed as 4000fps! And on this one good sized coyote that came in when I was using the Pocket Prey... the shot was like only.. 15yds at most. MAN did he bleed! Was shocked that little 35gr bullet had the exit hole it did, like maybe a quarter. Looked like it hit bone on the way out though, so probably why.

Also it (Baby Jack on the X24) routinely brings in Bobcats. They're just a little harder to detect coming in because they're generally more cautious.

Also there's this UK outfit (https://3dfoxcalls.co.uk/) that 3D prints these whistle calls, to emulate like Rabbit and Rodent. They don't weigh anything so you can keep it around your neck all the time, and you can play it held in your mouth with just your lips, so hands-free to be your coaxer. Those also work really well also.

 

[wcasey755]

Save up your dough, and get a FoxPro X24. Them having that Coaxial Tweeter really creates realism when the recording is of equally good quality.

Just stuff it into a Juniper or something similar, about waist height or chest height off the ground... then find a good hidey spot to sit low at, that's facing towards the crosswind from the downwind side of the caller location onward. Doing this you can get them in to 20-25yds easily. And don't need a rifle, shotgun works great. But I understand you might live in a different habitat type though, where rifle is for sure needed.

But yeah for distance? X24 works great in that regard as well. I've never had to run it terribly long before they come in, if the area has them there. But on days when I'm making stands on some new location I wanted to give a try to.. it's large rechargeable battery pack could easily go far longer than most would ever need.

I've stopped using a motion decoy for coyotes, as I've had some bolt the moment they see it. At least in my "primo spot" that's always brought one in.

Another great ultra small lightweight caller is made by Pocket Prey. Runs off a 9v battery. BUT.. you hand hold it, so you end up pointing the sound back and forth to create realism... so gotta be ready to quickly set it down on your lap the moment they come into view, so your hands are ready on the rifle/shotgun.

For .223 Rem.... seriously checkout the Hornady 35gr NTX loading! It's listed as 4000fps! And on this one good sized coyote that came in when I was using the Pocket Prey... the shot was like only.. 15yds at most. MAN did he bleed! Was shocked that little 35gr bullet had the exit hole it did, like maybe a quarter. Looked like it hit bone on the way out though, so probably why.

Also it routinely brings in Bobcats. They're just a little harder to detect coming in because they're generally more cautious.

Also there's this UK outfit (https://3dfoxcalls.co.uk/) that 3D prints these whistle calls, to emulate like Rabbit and Rodent. They don't weigh anything so you can keep it around your neck all the time, and you can play it held in your mouth with just your lips, so hands-free to be your coaxer. Those also work really well also.

Intresting on the hand whistles. Could you run a caller with maybe a coyote vocal, along with using a whistle to maybe replicate a coyote over a fresh kill?

 

[TheGDog]

Intresting on the hand whistles. Could you run a caller with maybe a coyote vocal, along with using a whistle to maybe replicate a coyote over a fresh kill?

Only potential problem might be the differing locations of where the sounds emanate from. I'd imagine once they are where you can see them.. I'd figure you'd likely have to stop using the whistle so they zero-in on the caller? That's just me speculating. Because I know they are EXTREMELY good at detecting the direction from which a sound emanates.

 

[Skerhunter]

Intresting on the hand whistles. Could you run a caller with maybe a coyote vocal, along with using a whistle to maybe replicate a coyote over a fresh kill?

You can run a hand call and ecaller on the same stand. The purpose of the ecaller is for you to be able to set up in a good shooting position vs maybe having to hide and not get a shot. Having a good door way and using the wind is key to good stands. Setting the ecaller out there a ways makes this much easier. In general they respond to one sound, so most people use one sound then move on after 5-15 minutes. That might be a series of prey distress sounds or vocals. Then end with pup distress if targeting coyotes. Cats the challenge is keeping them interested and keep coming.

 

[TheGDog]

Also.. be absolutely 100% ready to be on-point and ready to raise your weapon rapidly to fire, the moment you press the Play button!

I was shocked and kinda caught off-guard this one time where I'd pressed play, but then proceeded to mess with my sit cushion and angle of sit... when "What The...!?" it hadn't been like even 30seconds this one time and one came bolting in! after they crossed the gap from one bush to another, maybe only 15ft... there was a piece of brush between me seeing them. But apparently it then saw my motion decoy.. and decided to exit the scene now proceeding directly away from me, with that bush shielding his retreat. Not that he saw me first or anything, but I just had the shotgun laid beside me for a moment to re-adjust my sit. And that cost me being able to take him. So learn from my mistake. Be fully ready every time you press Play!

 

[wcasey755]

Thank you all. Lord of fantastic information! When I get a rifle setup and get out I’ll try to post my results!

 

[oryxman]

.243

 

[2000Champion]

I think the .243 or 6 mm’s would serve you well. I’m in Arizona and call pretty often. I strictly shoot a .243. I’ve had great luck with longer shots on coyotes. I have to admit it can be pretty tough on bobcats though. As far as e-callers there are several on the market, but I don’t think one can go wrong with one of the fox pro’s. Best of luck.