Tikka Accuracy Issues

[Outdoorsman12b]

Hi folks,

I have used this site quite a bit over the last two years to outfit myself for backcountry hunting. One of the overwhelming themes is the recommendation of the Tikka T3 as a rifle. I purchased a Tikka T3X in .270 as a sheep rifle, and topped it with a Leupold VX3i 3.5-10 CDS.

At the range when I zeroed the rifle at 100 yards off shooting bags (front and rear support) I was astounded at the groups. 3 rounds almost touching with Hornady 130 SST Superperformance. 200 yards was MOA as well. I really thought I was on to something.

Later (another session) I moved to 200 and 300 yards shooting off my pack (Mystery Ranch Marshall) and things started to go astray. Rounds at 200 were consistently hitting left and low with a group of about 6-9 inches. At 300 I was hardly on paper, and these are sizeable targets. I was allowing 3-5 minutes between shots. Basically if the barrel is to hot to touch I don't shoot.

I have scoured the internet looking for similar issues and the only thing I have found is that the pressure point on the plastic stock can react quite badly to the heat and start throwing rounds. The rifle has less than 200 rounds down the pipe and I have already used copper solvent on bore. My shooting experience with bolt guns is definitely above average.

Torque settings on action screws is 45 ft/lbs. Mounts (Talleys) are at 25 ft/lbs for base and 15 ft/lbs for rings. Scope is level as I use Wheeler levels.

My question to the rokslide community is has anyone else experienced these issues with a Tikka? If so what was the solution?

Thanks in advance.

 

[JeffRaines]

While you wait on more experienced folks to chime in - did you try shooting off bags after the pack?

I know these lightweight rifles are finicky in regards to how they're held while shooting.

 

[Fatcamp]

Have you shot off improvised rests with other rifles and had better results?

Because if not it is probably you.

 

[deserthunter2016]

Did you use ft/lbs or in/lbs when torquing your mounts, base and rings? You said you used ft/lbs and bases and rings usually go by in/lbs.






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[zimagold]

No expert here,

Are you right handed? When shooting off the bags did you "NOT" hold the fore-end and then hold it off the pack?

Changing how you hold the rifle will modify the movement of the gun during recoil and shift the effective zero. Pretty common in very light rifles. 6-9" at 200yds could be just holding tighter vs free recoil off the bags. I've recommended T3s to quite a few friends and this is a common problem with people that use a lead sled to zero/load develop and then practice with another method of support. It's normally fixed by making sure you are consistent in your hold. I have 4 Tikka and my superlight 270 is the most sensitive.


Did you use the CDS knobs to dial? Is the scope known to be good? I've seen at least two copies of Leupolds that exhibited hysteresis when dialing with the CDS knobs.

 

[blutooth]

Just curious, what did the gun do when you went back to 100 yards? And if you didn’t that’s where I would start - shoot at 100 again (you sounded like there was a time gap). Off the same pack, see if you can group that Moa again. If not on the pack then as someone suggested 100 yds with the bags. Get back o square 1 with the gun.

 

[jhm2023]

The main things that come to mind that I would check: Is toque specs on everything correct and in in/lbs.? Nothing stuck in the barrel channel of the stock such as a stick or something. Did you rest the rifle barrel on something in one shooting position as opposed to the stock? Because that can change your barrel harmonics enough to shift point of impact. Did the crown get damaged between range sessions? I've owned several Tikkas and they were always consistent no matter the shooting position or support used.

 

[Outdoorsman12b]

Thanks all for your responses. To clear up a few things I definitely used inch/pounds with Wheeler FAT wrench. Barrel was not in contact with anything or damaged at any point. Rifle was not zeroed with Led Sled, I use the "tac driver" I was able to repeat 100 yard MOA with prone unsupported. I did dial the CDS to 300 and 400 to confirm bullet drop, but the windage was not touched as scope has wind plex reticle. The first shot off the pack is always dead centre, and all shots after go off. I use hand over scope when shooting prone off pack and have had success with other rifles. I have put a limbsaver pad on rifle to help spot shots. Results with groups were consistent over several different range sessions.

I also consulted with a gunsmith to see if it was perhaps my trigger control or if he had Tikka's come in with similar issues. He indicated that sometimes you just get a bad barrel, but I find it hard to believe that I can replicate MOA at 100, but not beyond.

 

[Dhbwa]

I find it hard to fault a rifle that shoots under MOA at 100 in a rest but shoots 3 MOA at 200 when the same rest isn’t used.
( I hate lead sleds as much as brakes).....

 

[CarlTuesday]

Can you clarify? You said you are shooting sub-MOA at 100 yards unsupported in that last post. If that is the case, physics wise, you'd also be shooting sub moa at 300 yards, barring some bizzare bullet instability or severe underrotation for example. In other words, if you're truly sub-MOA at one range (ignoring wind) you'll be sub-MOA at another.

The rifle doesn't care what range you are shooting.

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[Outdoorsman12b]

Carl do you have anything to back that up? I have personally never seen a rifle shoot MOA at any given range. Most manufacturers that I am aware of only garuntee MOA at 100 for good reason. I have heard of chamber to bore misalignment causing issues at beyond 100 yards.

To realign the post my question was has anyone else that uses a tikka encountered accuracy issues with their tikka shooting off different platforms? Has anyone removed the front pressure point on barrel and had positive results?

 

[wyosteve]

Might try putting on a different scope if you have one in case the current one went bad in some fashion.

 

[tntrker]

Not Tikka related but I had the same problem with my Savage 116 30-06. I couldn't get a consistent group, ie 2 shots touching 1 inches right/left. I used my bag and pack instead of bi-pod, still nothing consistent. I was about to buy a new gun when my last ditch effort was I had a swivel bi-pod and bought a "break" for it to make it stationary. Had a Leupold VX-R 4x12-50, upgraded to VX5HD 3x15-44. Shooting MOA at 400 yrds now. Best I can figure, the swivel bi-pod was letting me "canter" and I must have had part of the barrel, not just stock, resting on bag/pack while shooting and better scope. Hopefully you can pinpoint the issue, good luck!

 

[blutooth]

Thanks for the clarification. While I can’t speak directly to your question as it relates to the Tikka, I will say I had a similar problem with a Winchester in 300wsm.

I started at the easiest variable to the hardest to fix.
1) shoot again with different ammo. Both heavier and light grain bullets. Once I could duplicate the same bad results I could confirm it’s not the ammo choice.
2) then I got my hands on a new scope. Zeroed, and shot. (I don’t think the vx-3i has parallax adjustment so there could be something faulty in there that worked loose over the years). The rifle exhibited the same symptoms.

Everything above from the same rest - ideally the most stable of any choice

At that point I knew it was something in the rifle, and also it was something I wasn’t interested in digging in to further and potentially chasing for years on end. Sold the rifle and switched to an x-bolt which has worked great for me. Part of the switch was just a confidence issue as well. Every time I shot that Winchester there was that thought in the back of my mind that I was doing something to cause the problem - which probably exacerbated the issue as well. Clean slate and I was back to shooting tight groups. You sound like you know what you are doing, just keep changing variables 1 at a time until it is completely isolated.

Best of luck, I hope you get to the bottom of it and try not to go crazy trying.

 

[Formidilosus]

Carl do you have anything to back that up? I have personally never seen a rifle shoot MOA at any given range. Most manufacturers that I am aware of only garuntee MOA at 100 for good reason. I have heard of chamber to bore misalignment causing issues at beyond 100 yards.

To realign the post my question was has anyone else that uses a tikka encountered accuracy issues with their tikka shooting off different platforms? Has anyone removed the front pressure point on barrel and had positive results?

Dozens of Tikkas. Yes, I remove the barrel bumps out of each.



There is is nothing magical that happens between 100 yards and any other range to deviate the bullets off of their prior track Wind, and extreme velocity variations are it.


If you rifle is consistently shooting MOA at 100, than given the same conditions it will be MOA at 200.


You you have a couple of blaring things-

1) Three shots is not a group. Worse, “three shot groups” are more likely to lie to you, then give you credible information. Shoot a couple of 10 round groups at 100 yards with a dead on point of aim, point of impact (POA/POI) zero. Then, go to 300 and shoot a 10 round group without touching the turret. The 100 and 300 yard groups will be within .25 MOA of each other.


2) Leupold. More than any other reason, THIS is why people should use scopes and mounting systems that are absolutely reliable. Because when weirdness happens, you now have to add those two things into the possible cause pile.


3) Shoot from the same rest each time. If you repeat the 10 round groups from above but off of a pack instead of bags, your group will be larger. A single “good” group does not data make.





What I would I would do, in order-

Replace scope with a reliable one.... and/or-

Remove barrel bumps heavily, degrease, Loctite, and torque screws

Use sands bags to shoot 2x ten round groups at 100 yards. If still using the Leupold shoot another 20 rounds but dialing all the way up, and all the way down, shoot one round at zero, then up to 10 MOA and shoot another round. Do this for all twenty rounds. At the end, it is highly likely that the group at zero is 1.5 times the size of the initial groups and probably in a different location. The group at 10 MOA will most likely be 1.5 times the size of initial groups, and will not be 10.5 inches high of zero.


Doing the above will tell you two things- what you and the rifle are capable of group wise, and what your scope is doing on a base level.

 

[Cant hit em]

Sounds too simple but —-If you took the gun apart between shooting it , make sure the recoil lug was seated properly when put back together. Mine was a bitch to get it to seat good and a couple times it looked as if it was but was not.

 

[Outdoorsman12b]

Formidilosus some good suggestions. Any recommendations on an alternate scope that in your experience is reliable? I can't afford much more than a VX3i. Does not need to dial, but I do need some form of hold off to get out to 500 which is my intent with this rifle.

Cant hit em I will try that as well to make sure it is seated properly. I did not disassemble in-between range sessions but worth a try to rule it out.

 

[Formidilosus]

Formidilosus some good suggestions. Any recommendations on an alternate scope that in your experience is reliable? I can't afford much more than a VX3i. Does not need to dial, but I do need some form of hold off to get out to 500 which is my intent with this rifle.

Cant hit em I will try that as well to make sure it is seated properly. I did not disassemble in-between range sessions but worth a try to rule it out.

SWFA SS 6x42mm or SS 3-9x42mm.



Try what what I wrote though, you’ll know of it’s a a scope issue pretty quick.

 

[Fatcamp]

SWFA SS 6x42mm or SS 3-9x42mm.



Try what what I wrote though, you’ll know of it’s a a scope issue pretty quick.

So would you care to expand on your thoughts for why 6X rather than 10 or 12?

I am close to selling a really nice Leupold scope and replacing it with a SS. Side focus worth it? HD worth it? They only come in 10X, but still.

We have an FX 3 6X with a heavy duplex and really like it. Reticle is too thick for distance work.

As we stretch our legs we are finding dialing very useful, which is what drew us to the CDS system, but time is showing it less than ideal for repetitive work.

 

[Formidilosus]

So would you care to expand on your thoughts for why 6X rather than 10 or 12?

I am close to selling a really nice Leupold scope and replacing it with a SS. Side focus worth it? HD worth it? They only come in 10X, but still.

We have an FX 3 6X with a heavy duplex and really like it. Reticle is too thick for distance work.

As we stretch our legs we are finding dialing very useful, which is what drew us to the CDS system, but time is showing it less than ideal for repetitive work.

Field of view.

Hitting and consistently killing at medium to long range, is about way more than magnification. We need enough magnification to discern the target, and as much visual information during and after the shot as possible. Once we’ve reached enough magnification to see the target, the more magnification we add the smaller our field of view gets and consequently the less information we get from the shot. 6x Mag is enough to hunt big game out to 600 and a bit further, yet is low enough that usability in close is fine.


I wouldnt go 10x on a general hunting rifle. Negative of the SF as well as it not needed. The SWFA 6x offers great FOV, a good eyebox, and good size and weight.